The UK is suffering from a bad atmosphere

[Bollocks]

I have a finance degree...I think the pound will rally back somewhat, but the bottom line is that the UK was better off being a part of the EU than it will be without it. This was a decision that was fueled by propaganda and xenophobia.

Estimates regarding the direct and indirect costs for the UK in regards to EU membership is around 8-11% of the UK's GDP. But the EU accounts for 25% of global GDP, and has a primarily service-based economy; no longer being a part of the EU means that the UK will no longer be a hub for foreign direct investment, which will be another large hit in the long run.

Even very conservative estimates think that this will be a 15-17% overall loss for the UK's economy.

You have a finance degree? So lucky, I'm struggling with my last two years.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Yes lets panic when the effects of economic mismanagement and incompetence crash the economy and not act or speak out before it happens......

Wait. it's the wow beta argument. I knew I read that somewhere before. Let's wait until live to fix shit, because it's still beta after all.

[un_known]

It's a lot easier to take something on the chin when nothing happens. '

You saying "neither" and saying you voted leave "for the economy" just means you think the problems with the economy are due to the EU. In other words, you blamed someone else for your problems.

no where did i say that EU were to blame for the economy, i voted to leave so the economy can grow further, lets be honest, the EU was a great idea for its time and now that we're in 2016, 23 years after the EU was established, it will not grow any further, thus upon leaving EU will the economy further itself. trade will increase (heard there are a lot of countries that want to establish trade with UK)

[Strangebrew]

Well tell me, what's the benefit that comes from voting leave? What is the potential side that the UK has tapped by deciding to leave? I can't think of any that doesn't boil down to immigration which oddly enough is not big of a deal in the zones that voted leave and curiosly those zones receive more EU funds so to me they voted against their interests. Tell me what do you call that?

Do you expect me to answer all of this when i have stated on several occasions now that i am neutral on brexit?
What is it with you people and "either you are on my side or you are on the enemies side"

I don't know what positive or negatives leaving will have, people are panicking, give it time.
People had their reasons for wanting to leave EU, fucking suck it up.

[Celista]

You have a finance degree? So lucky, I'm struggling with my last two years.

Not that I used it too much. I worked in finance for a couple of years after graduation, and I took some graduate coursework in finance while I was in law school too.

Xarim works in finance in the UK so he would be a good person to talk to about finance/current events.

[Bollocks]

Do you expect me to answer all of this when i have stated on several occasions now that i am neutral on brexit?
What is it with you people and "either you are on my side or you are on the enemies side"

I don't know what positive or negatives leaving will have, people are panicking, give it time.
People had their reasons for wanting to leave EU, fucking suck it up.

That's the thing, you are saying that there is no wrong side without knowing fully the implications of the decision, but this time there is. The leave side doesn't have any arguments to stand on that are not based somewhat on immigration; which is needed in the UK, and the idea that the EU will fall. That is why its a correct statement to say they made a wrong decision or many of them were deceived by false promises. I.E The leave campaign not delivering their promises (No investment of 350 million in NHS, not being capable of controlling immigration and one of its leaders quitting an attempt to attain power altogether effectively leaving the responsibility to others..

[Strangebrew]

That's the thing, you are saying that there is no wrong side without knowing fully the implications of the decision, but this time there is. The leave side doesn't have any arguments to stand on that are not based somewhat on immigration; which is needed in the UK, and the idea that the EU will fall. That is why its a correct statement to say they made a wrong decision or many of them were deceived by false promises. I.E The leave campaign not delivering their promises (No investment of 350 million in NHS, not being capable of controlling immigration and one of its leaders quitting an attempt to attain power altogether effectively leaving the responsibility to others..

The leave side have plenty of good arguments, you just refuse to see them as you drown them amongst the cries of xenophobia and racism

[Celista]

Last time I checked they're not working 24 hours 7 days they have time to learn. Or they could have not gone into the "Fuck the experts." mode, you know the ones that did bother to get up off their asses and check.

I put myself through school, I worked two jobs in the summer one year so I was working 12 hour days. I paid for everything on my own. I was LUCKY because I didn't get sick or have anything bad happen to me because I had zero safety net. Not having a safety net alone is stressful, which affects our health in a myriad of complex ways, including chronic stress during child and adolescent development.

You are out of touch because you are so flippant about the challenges of rising out of poverty. In our economics classes during undergrad we talked about this reality, it is infinitely harder for a poor person to rise to the middle class than it is for the wealthy to become wealthier, or even for the middle class to reach upper middle class, depending on the country that you live in.

[Bollocks]

The leave side have plenty of good arguments, you just refuse to see them as you drown them amongst the cries of xenophobia and racism

Well what are the good arguments? Let me bath in your knowledge.

- - - Updated - - -

Not that I used it too much. I worked in finance for a couple of years after graduation, and I took some graduate coursework in finance while I was in law school too.

Xarim works in finance in the UK so he would be a good person to talk to about finance/current events.

Before we continue MMT, Austrian or heteredox?

[Deleted]

I put myself through school, I worked two jobs in the summer one year so I was working 12 hour days. I paid for everything on my own. I was LUCKY because I didn't get sick or have anything bad happen to me because I had zero safety net. Not having a safety net alone is stressful, which affects our health in a myriad of complex ways, including chronic stress during child and adolescent development.

You are out of touch because you are so flippant about the challenges of rising out of poverty. In our economics classes during undergrad we talked about this reality, it is infinitely harder for a poor person to rise to the middle class than it is for the wealthy to become wealthier, or even for the middle class to reach upper middle class, depending on the country that you live in.

Not the case in the UK. And certainly not the case for people in their 40s and 50s claiming globalisation is what caused them to be "left behind". They are a generation that could have had anything they wanted for free if they came from the working class or were truly disadvantaged. They will continue to fail when we are out of the EU and they will continue to blame others.

[Ripster42]

no where did i say that EU were to blame for the economy, i voted to leave so the economy can grow further, lets be honest, the EU was a great idea for its time and now that we're in 2016, 23 years after the EU was established, it will not grow any further, thus upon leaving EU will the economy further itself. trade will increase (heard there are a lot of countries that want to establish trade with UK)

Saying, "I voted to leave so the economy can grow further," means you think the EU is to blame for holding the UK economy down. Let's be honest, the UK's bargaining power in any trade agreement they hope to reach is much less than if they bargain as a part of the EU. Let's be honest, just saying, "trade will increase," doesn't make trade increase.

[Celista]

Before we continue MMT, Austrian or heteredox?

Definitely not Austrian as I feel it is too fringe-y and we have seen how it has played out somewhat under certain administrations.

I like this criticism of MMT here.

[Kallisto]

I put myself through school, I worked two jobs in the summer one year so I was working 12 hour days. I paid for everything on my own. I was LUCKY because I didn't get sick or have anything bad happen to me because I had zero safety net. Not having a safety net alone is stressful, which affects our health in a myriad of complex ways, including chronic stress during child and adolescent development.

You are out of touch because you are so flippant about the challenges of rising out of poverty. In our economics classes during undergrad we talked about this reality, it is infinitely harder for a poor person to rise to the middle class than it is for the wealthy to become wealthier, or even for the middle class to reach upper middle class, depending on the country that you live in.

I didn't say the challenges don't exist I said there's no excuse not to educate yourself on the important things you're going to vote on. Or if you can not then fucking listen to the experts instead of going "Hurr durr you rely on experts too much mr Prime Minister." like somehow people who have knowledge on things know nothing. I have no sympathy for those who are willfully ignorant.

[Celista]

I didn't say the challenges don't exist I said there's no excuse not to educate yourself on the important things you're going to vote on. Or if you can not then fucking listen to the experts instead of going "Hurr durr you rely on experts too much mr Prime Minister." like somehow people who have knowledge on things know nothing. I have no sympathy for those who are willfully ignorant.

Ah okay. Well I will agree that people should educate themselves on an issue or voluntarily abstain from voting. Time is a luxury for the working poor but it does not take too terribly long to read up on an issue enough to cast an informed vote.

[Bollocks]

Definitely not Austrian as I feel it is too fringe-y and we have seen how it has played out somewhat under certain administrations.

I like this criticism of MMT here.

Well you are good in my book. I absolutely despise austrians, mmters and heteredox economists. But specially mmters

[Deleted]

Someone pointed out that the Brits voted for values, not for economy.

For some it seems to be incredibly difficult to understand why would someone prefer actions that have temporary negative feedback for them instead of favoring promises of instant personal gain -- basically choosing "blood, toil and tears" instead of "free stuff for everyone!".

A lot of people didn't want a flood of unknown immigrants from wartorn countries coming to the UK like we saw in Germany.

That's a valid concern that wasn't resolved.

Knowing the English, that would have been resolved in a far more bloody way (we'd basically see another Iceni tribe).

People really need to accept this decision now. It was mostly London (which has a large many generation immigrant population) and Scotland that voted to remain. London will be fine. Scotland can become independent. Problem solved for them.

[Kallisto]

A lot of people didn't want a flood of unknown immigrants from wartorn countries coming to the UK like we saw in Germany.

That's a valid concern that wasn't resolved.

Knowing the English, that would have been resolved in a far more bloody way (we'd basically see another Iceni tribe).

People really need to accept this decision now. It was mostly London (which has a large many generation immigrant population) and Scotland that voted to remain. London will be fine. Scotland can become independent. Problem solved for them.

It was resolved. We didn't have the refugees coming to the UK except maybe 20k from camps. That's not even enough to fill a league 1 stadium

[Mehrunes]

I have a finance degree...I think the pound will rally back somewhat, but the bottom line is that the UK was better off being a part of the EU than it will be without it. This was a decision that was fueled by propaganda and xenophobia.

Estimates regarding the direct and indirect costs for the UK in regards to EU membership is around 8-11% of the UK's GDP. But the EU accounts for 25% of global GDP, and has a primarily service-based economy; no longer being a part of the EU means that the UK will no longer be a hub for foreign direct investment, which will be another large hit in the long run.

Even very conservative estimates think that this will be a 15-17% overall loss for the UK's economy.

If the part about colonies on the Sun wasn't obvious enough, I was being sarcastic :3

[PC2]

It was resolved. We didn't have the refugees coming to the UK except maybe 20k from camps. That's not even enough to fill a league 1 stadium

Hence the concern is future oriented. The U.K. doesn't want to be the next Germany on migration.

[Deleted]

It was resolved. We didn't have the refugees coming to the UK except maybe 20k from camps. That's not even enough to fill a league 1 stadium

We're thinking long term.

In that respect, the UK won.