HFC nerfs are in.

[trylessyo]

HFC nerfs yayy

[Daedius]

Was this REALLY necessary...? HFC had its nerfs through usage of Valour upgrades and a legendary ring that scaled up to 795... -.-;

Guess it'll increase fights over the mythic mount during the few weeks of pre-patch before Legion hits.

[Octa]

Was this REALLY necessary...? HFC had its nerfs through usage of Valour upgrades and a legendary ring that scaled up to 795... -.-;

Guess it'll increase fights over the mythic mount during the few weeks of pre-patch before Legion hits.

So you have no idea what is happening in the pre patch and you didn't read a single post in this entire thread. Got it.

[Deja Thoris]

Was this REALLY necessary...? HFC had its nerfs through usage of Valour upgrades and a legendary ring that scaled up to 795... -.-;

Guess it'll increase fights over the mythic mount during the few weeks of pre-patch before Legion hits.

Of course its needed. Theres 5 pages explaining how classes are getting a lot weaker due to the changes in the pre-patch.

[Raiju]

They've been known to insert band-aid fixes for pre-patch play that gets reverted for expansion play. If some specs are completely gimped, I can see something like that happening. (Warriors in ICC come to mind.)

enhancement & elemental were completely broken for 4.0 prepatch and they did nothing about it?

[Dracodraco]

enhancement & elemental were completely broken for 4.0 prepatch and they did nothing about it?

They've been known to do it when the prepatch hits because they suspect a spec will be inferior compared to everyone else during the prepatch, then remove some of the buffs when the actual expansion hits. Nobody really gives a fuck about the prepatch and anyone's performance during it, so if you're gimped, just get carried by the ones who aren't and figure out how your new buttons look till release. It's really not a huge issue.

[Raiju]

They've been known to do it when the prepatch hits because they suspect a spec will be inferior compared to everyone else during the prepatch, then remove some of the buffs when the actual expansion hits. Nobody really gives a fuck about the prepatch and anyone's performance during it, so if you're gimped, just get carried by the ones who aren't and figure out how your new buttons look till release. It's really not a huge issue.

I never stated it was an issue, I pointed out they don't really care for buffing broken specs pre-max level (which seems to be your point as well)

[Dracodraco]

I never stated it was an issue, I pointed out they don't really care for buffing broken specs pre-max level (which seems to be your point as well)

No, my point is he's right - when they drop the pre patch, they'll often add some buffs to specs they *know* will severely underperform. They don't do it mid-patch, but they *do* occasionally do it when they KNOW it'll be an issue. It's just that as there's pretty much zero testing done at level 100, it's extremely difficult to get data on who will suck and who won't .

So no; My point isn't that they don't buff specs pre-max level; It's that they do it super-early, and then just let it be.

[Raiju]

No, my point is he's right - when they drop the pre patch, they'll often add some buffs to specs they *know* will severely underperform. They don't do it mid-patch, but they *do* occasionally do it when they KNOW it'll be an issue. It's just that as there's pretty much zero testing done at level 100, it's extremely difficult to get data on who will suck and who won't .

So no; My point isn't that they don't buff specs pre-max level; It's that they do it super-early, and then just let it be.

It was known before the patch hit so call BS on that. It sounds more like you're confusing general last minute tuning. You don't just 'miss' a class.

[Hypasonic]

They'll just fix the really bad performing specs like they did during SoO. If I recall correctly, warriors were stupid OP initially and hunters were just broken, even though blizz stated that they were tuned for 100 and it was temeporary they also said in cases where it's so bad (Hunters) they couldn't just ignore them.

[Marrilaife]

They tend to underestimate how much the nerfs make it easier for the healers and tanks compared to the DPS.

Since active mitigation uptimes, tank cds, healer cds got nerfed, bonus armor got removed, healer's manaregen got nerfed it only makes sense to nerf boss damage. Also dps classes might not have access anymore to so many defensives as they used to have before the "prune" and some of those abilities were used to cheese 1 shot mechanics, things like xul black hole soaking, manno marks soaking, and few other mechanics you could help yourselves with specific defensives (doomfire soaking, tyrant p3 edicts etc.) Also it helps everyone, especially dps to survive fucked up seeds on Zakun, fucked up fires on xul and other non 1-shot but high overall raid damage if you're let's say an 11 mythic guild hoping to finish hfc on prepatch.

Not saying any of you are, but there are many 11 mythic guilds on my server that kinda struggle to do the last push.

[Deleted]

Since active mitigation uptimes, tank cds, healer cds got nerfed, bonus armor got removed, healer's manaregen got nerfed it only makes sense to nerf boss damage. Also dps classes might not have access anymore to so many defensives as they used to have before the "prune" and some of those abilities were used to cheese 1 shot mechanics, things like xul black hole soaking, manno marks soaking, and few other mechanics you could help yourselves with specific defensives (doomfire soaking, tyrant p3 edicts etc.) Also it helps everyone, especially dps to survive fucked up seeds on Zakun, fucked up fires on xul and other non 1-shot but high overall raid damage if you're let's say an 11 mythic guild hoping to finish hfc on prepatch.

Not saying any of you are, but there are many 11 mythic guilds on my server that kinda struggle to do the last push.

If the history repeats itself they will make it a slightly harder version of heroic mode which allows various minor mistakes and only requires the major parts of the strategy to be followed (not that mythic currently doesn't allow minor mistakes but they usually result to deaths that could wipe if they are numerous).

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It's just that as there's pretty much zero testing done at level 100, it's extremely difficult to get data on who will suck and who won't .

Well they could because they run simulations on the actual game engine itself but I don't think they care much. The majority of players are confused about their classes for at least 2 weeks and then everyone is excited for the launch at the last week so basically it would be effort that would benefit a few players for around 10 days only. They might do some limited tuning on big outliers.

[Deleted]

Well the %nerfs made a lot better argument to stick to the game for non-100%-progress raids. Don't like current way of hard nerfs every half year.-

[Deleted]

I don't think it will be enough TBH. People underestimate how much damage we are losing, how squishy tanks are going to be and the loss of all spirit regen.

Why the fuck did they nerf every goddamn class, and why that much? Who the hell pissed into their corn flakes? ffs! This is unprecedented.

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They'll just fix the really bad performing specs like they did during SoO. If I recall correctly, warriors were stupid OP initially and hunters were just broken, even though blizz stated that they were tuned for 100 and it was temeporary they also said in cases where it's so bad (Hunters) they couldn't just ignore them.

They'll ignore it and tell you to play Fire, I assure you Arcane will remain completely useless.

[Icecreamcake]

Did they buff any classes during the pre patch though, of course broken overpowered things are nerfed or hotfixed immediately

[Marrilaife]

If the history repeats itself they will make it a slightly harder version of heroic mode which allows various minor mistakes and only requires the major parts of the strategy to be followed (not that mythic currently doesn't allow minor mistakes but they usually result to deaths that could wipe if they are numerous).

Tbh I don't think it's such a bad thing, eyes of everyone will be already upon legion, everyone will have to relearn their spec and play it in the no-artifact incomplete version, it's gonna be 4-6 weeks of archi mounts tops, cutting edge will be gone and generally it's a last call / consolation reward to be able to kill a boss on prepatch if you couldn't before.

First week of prepatch is gonna be a clusterfuck with half the people having issues because addons aren't working or they have connection problems (those always crop up after a big patch), or they simply need more time to figure out what exactly happened with their class / spec, and legion size of reworks are one of the bigger in wow history.

Don't think anyone wishes for serious reprogress on pre-patch, I think many people would agree current mood about hfc is "let's get this over with". No one would be looking forward to having to devise a whole new strategy to use for a couple of weeks. And some old strategies might get broken, for example my guild uses mages with iceblock + glyph to soak marks on mannoroth, now what will happen when glyphs are removed, no idea.

[Deleted]

Tbh I don't think it's such a bad thing, eyes of everyone will be already upon legion, everyone will have to relearn their spec and play it in the no-artifact incomplete version, it's gonna be 4-6 weeks of archi mounts tops, cutting edge will be gone and generally it's a last call / consolation reward to be able to kill a boss on prepatch if you couldn't before.

First week of prepatch is gonna be a clusterfuck with half the people having issues because addons aren't working or they have connection problems (those always crop up after a big patch), or they simply need more time to figure out what exactly happened with their class / spec, and legion size of reworks are one of the bigger in wow history.

Don't think anyone wishes for serious reprogress on pre-patch, I think many people would agree current mood about hfc is "let's get this over with". No one would be looking forward to having to devise a whole new strategy to use for a couple of weeks. And some old strategies might get broken, for example my guild uses mages with iceblock + glyph to soak marks on mannoroth, now what will happen when glyphs are removed, no idea.

As I remember it the first week is total confusion and the last 10 days are full of excitement about the release. So there is no much room to care about minmaxing. Maybe for a couple of weeks max, depended on guild or person.

[Sylvaeres]

so fire or ice is better at 100^^

I'm guessing Fire will be the goto spec. I haven't been able to unlock my frost artifact because the quest is bugged on beta, but I've been dying to try that out to see how it works. I guess it's time to load up the ptr and test it out

[Fabinas]

Why the fuck did they nerf every goddamn class, and why that much? Who the hell pissed into their corn flakes? ffs! This is unprecedented.

They didn't do nerfs per se. They revamped classes to Legion abilities/talents etc and tuned around HAVING the artifact. Which we won't get till Legion launch. Nerfs are a byproduct of the class revamp systems, that's all.

[Icecreamcake]

This has to be reduced more since specs all across the board are doing less damage

I imagine that guilds on Tuesday of the release of the prepatch will have a very hard time

They have to buff or nerf more