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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by May90 View Post
    I've seen negative outcomes. I grew up in a third world country, with extremely corrupt system. Investigation into an economical fraud got the wrong man, who happened to be my family's friend: they tortured him into signing confession, while the real criminal got away. Result: an innocent person got 5 years in jail, and the real criminal probably retired to Bahamas.

    Yaaaaay for torture! /s
    and happy Rosie smiles a lot can give a lollipop to the wrong person eliciting false information because they really like lollipops. at some level the tool is only as good as the person using it.
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  2. #202
    The Unstoppable Force May90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    and happy Rosie smiles a lot can give a lollipop to the wrong person eliciting false information because they really like lollipops. at some level the tool is only as good as the person using it.
    Since you can never guarantee that the information you are receiving is genuine, even the "best torturer" (however oxymoronish it sounds) is bound to fail every now and then. And the cost of failure might be enormous.
    Quote Originally Posted by King Candy View Post
    I can't explain it because I'm an idiot, and I have to live with that post for the rest of my life. Better to just smile and back away slowly. Ignore it so that it can go away.
    Thanks for the avatar goes to Carbot Animations and Sy.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I actually support this. Sometimes a little torture is a good way to extract information from terrorists. Also, they are TERRORISTS, you know, people who put fear and death into people's lives for the sake of it.

    Its amazing to me how the left and the Killary supporters blast trump for something like this.

    Guess what:

    I'm still voting for Trump.
    So it's ok for him to target their families as well who might not know anything? Which he has stated he wants to do. Not all terrorists families are terrorists believe it or not.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I actually support this. Sometimes a little torture is a good way to extract information from terrorists. Also, they are TERRORISTS, you know, people who put fear and death into people's lives for the sake of it.

    Its amazing to me how the left and the Killary supporters blast trump for something like this.

    Guess what:

    I'm still voting for Trump.
    You call her "Killary" as you advocate torture.

    You're such a hypocrite...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleccybubb View Post
    So it's ok for him to target their families as well who might not know anything? Which he has stated he wants to do. Not all terrorists families are terrorists believe it or not.
    I wonder if Dump thought that, just for a second, that his own family would be on the firing line if he kept promoted that philosophy.

  5. #205
    Banned Jaylock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    You call her "Killary" as you advocate torture.

    You're such a hypocrite...
    Yes absolutely. She and her idiocy got good American lives killed. How anyone could vote for her is beyond me.

    Torture of TERRORISTS for the purpose of gaining information to SAVE LIVES is a completely different issue.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by May90 View Post
    Since you can never guarantee that the information you are receiving is genuine, even the "best torturer" (however oxymoronish it sounds) is bound to fail every now and then. And the cost of failure might be enormous.
    well. you are pretty safe when it is only filth that you are torturing.
    There is no Bad RNG just Bad LTP

  7. #207
    Warchief Lupinemancer's Avatar
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    Well it's a Fight Fire with Fire situation. If it gets rid of those savages, then fine by me, I couldn't care less, after all, they are not humans so why should we trat them as such?

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Bollocks View Post
    Often what not it gives incorrect information. Thus damaging more your campaign than helping it.
    I highly doubt this. Sounds like propaganda from anti-torture advocates, I can buy the moral argument but suggesting that torture isn't effective just doesn't make any sense. Humans have been torturing people for information for thousands of years and if it was doing nothing but giving them false information that then got their military killed / etc then they wouldn't continue doing it.

    Hell look at our US Navy men who gave up sensitive information just at gunpoint, which is a light form of "torture" it is suggested pain/death unless they divulge information. Torture is about ramping up pain/discomfort until the person cracks and tells you what they know to end the suffering / threat.

  9. #209
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    They didn't learned anything from Guantanamo and secret CIA prisons all over the world, did they?

    Plenty of innocent men were put through hell in those prisons. They were capturing and imprisoning them based on vague gossip, without any trials or proven charges.
    An arabic man that lived in Germany suffered 5 years of extreme torture and abuse in Guantanamo, before being finally freed in 2007 (despite they KNEW that he's not a terrorist in 2002!!!)

    Read this article:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murat_Kurnaz

    Torture has been proven to be one of the least effective methods of gathering information anyway. The information obtained through physical and psychological abuse has been false in nearly all cases.

    Dropping political correctness and getting heads out of their asses is one thing, I approve this. But I will never approve doing what they did at Guantanamo Bay. This is savage ape behavior. It's no better than what ISIS is doing.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Harekrsna View Post
    I highly doubt this. Sounds like propaganda from anti-torture advocates, I can buy the moral argument but suggesting that torture isn't effective just doesn't make any sense. Humans have been torturing people for information for thousands of years and if it was doing nothing but giving them false information that then got their military killed / etc then they wouldn't continue doing it.

    Hell look at our US Navy men who gave up sensitive information just at gunpoint, which is a light form of "torture" it is suggested pain/death unless they divulge information. Torture is about ramping up pain/discomfort until the person cracks and tells you what they know to end the suffering / threat.
    as Derah posted earlier in the topic

    Quote Originally Posted by Derah View Post
    This is a fallacious argument.

    If that was true, diet pill companies would have gone bankrupt years ago. Their fucking pills don't work, you wanna lose weight? Go on a diet, and do some excercise. Swallowing a magic pill is not gonna turn you into a super-model. Magic pills that let you eat like a pig, but still look like a greek statue DON'T work, but people still buy them by the bucketloads.

    For hundreds of years, ancient tribes believed that eating the hearts and balls of your enemies would make you stronger. It didn't work but that didn't stop thousands of tribes from all parts of the globe from trying it at one point or another.

    For decades it was thought that if you ask an undercover police officer if they are a cop, they're obligated to tell you. Its not true, but believe it or not, people STILL attempt to do this when soliciting sex or drugs from undercover agents, believing that they're perfectly safe so long as they ask first "are you a cop?". Hundreds of thousands of people arrested, and people STILL believe this shit works.

    For almost 200 years people have believed that searing the meat "seals in the juices" creating better, softer, moister meat. Wait, you think that searing a steak magically makes it impermeable? No, what actually happens is that the Maillard reaction creates the brown crust which is just really fucking delicious, and makes it taste better. That's it. Doesn't stop people from still yammering about searing their steaks because they want them nice and juicy...... then they overcook them and they have to eat a dried piece of crap.

    I could list you examples all day, but the bottom line is: Throughout history, people have tried INNUMERABLE amounts of things because they think they work. Even when shown irrefutable evidence that they don't, they still try it, why? Because humans are stubborn, and stupid.

    But mostly stupid.

  11. #211
    Nothing new here, he said this during the primary. I personally don't c what's wrong with torturing terrorists, it led to Osama, and even if it doesn't lead to anything. They get what they deserve for how their culture treats everyone that isn't them.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Yes absolutely. She and her idiocy got good American lives killed. How anyone could vote for her is beyond me.

    Torture of TERRORISTS for the purpose of gaining information to SAVE LIVES is a completely different issue.
    She was proven innocent of it... Yet you ignore that fact cuz it doesn't fit your pretty picture - so you choose to instead make us monsters to be despised more (and now with justified) reason, which will promote their cause further.

    Fuking hyppocrite...

  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leotheras the Blind View Post
    No Ghandi, no it doesn't. By taking the eye of the guilty it ends there. The one giving the sentencing is punishing the one who took the eye of the innocent.
    From someone named Leotheras the Blind I see how my comment doesn't apply to you
    I love Warcraft, I dislike WoW

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  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Leotheras the Blind View Post
    I would fight ISIS in a way that would deter ANY resistance. How you ask? All of my soldiers would dip their bullets into pigs fat or pigs blood before firing, any Muslim caught would be covered in pig parts and forced to eat pork during the duration of captivity. And any Muslim killed would be buried face down coated in pig part and pig waste.

    To fight terror, you have to show it you're not afraid, and make it fear you.
    Great plan, beat the villain by becoming an even bigger villain. I see no way this could backfire on the world if it was done by the largest military power on earth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Having the authority to do a thing doesn't make it just, moral, or even correct.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Powerogue View Post
    Great plan, beat the villain by becoming an even bigger villain. I see no way this could backfire on the world if it was done by the largest military power on earth.
    Well, being absolute assholes in the middle east is what got the US into this mess in the first place. So, it kind of already has backfired.

  16. #216
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenji87 View Post
    Well it's a Fight Fire with Fire situation. If it gets rid of those savages, then fine by me, I couldn't care less, after all, they are not humans so why should we trat them as such?
    Except it doesn't get rid of them at all. You'd just be adding fuel to their warped ideology.

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  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noxx79 View Post
    Yes, following the Geneva convention is "an arbitrary restriction".

    You realize that there are consequences for actions, right? Trumps plans would lead to a completely isolated US with no allies, no trade, no respect.
    And ISIS will follow the Geneva convention as well? Those who break the rules can't expect to be treated fairly under them.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Selastan View Post
    And ISIS will follow the Geneva convention as well? Those who break the rules can't expect to be treated fairly under them.
    They won't because they didn't agree to it. The US agreed to the Geneva Convention.

  19. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nelinrah View Post
    They won't because they didn't agree to it. The US agreed to the Geneva Convention.
    Well then the answer is simple. A group of Americans who are willing to do anything to stop ISIS, are supplied by the government, but not officially a part of it. We need to make that happen, then we can actually fight them without the handicap.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by Selastan View Post
    Well then the answer is simple. A group of Americans who are willing to do anything to stop ISIS, are supplied by the government, but not officially a part of it. We need to make that happen, then we can actually fight them without the handicap.
    You do realize that the US government would still directly be involved then...right?

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