[MARKSMANSHIP]Legion Alpha Discussion

[Deleted]

That's silly. Master's Call and RoS were vital components for hunters to stay alive. It's not like hunters are flat out dominating the current PvP meta.

It's really hard, if not flat out impossible, to call how pvp is going to play out. But point in fact remains that we lost a HUMONGOUS load of CC and survivability. If we get compensation for that in some way or if other classes suffer similarily that would be OK, but I remain skeptical until I know either for sure.

We're losing double deterrence; two of our specs are losing access to an iconic class CC: Freezing Trap; we're losing Master's Call; we're losing RoS; BM and most of all MM are losing Kill Shot; BM is losing BW CC immunity. Those are some pretty heavy hits. And I've seen little in return; nor have I seen such massive massive defensive nerfs on other classes.

Like I said, ill save my judgement knowing that a lot of pvp balancing has yet to be done and waiting for some of the better players to give their feedback. But from the looks of things it's not too good, so I'm remaining very skeptical.

Bm/Sv still have ROS and there havent been any CC immunity on BW for a long time. BM is actually Gaining fear/terrror immunity when BW is active as a talent.
But yea i agree, bm with out MC makes no sence at all as SV keep it as a talent.

[shade3891]

What is the problem with Aimed Shot having a cast time? Or that you need to stand still to cast it? Don't all ranged dps have the same?
If i need to move i just use cheeta to get to the new place.. or even barrage the target.

Been playing on the beta and did not find it a problem at all, solo or in dungeons..

[kaminaris]

Don't all ranged dps have the same?

Because hunter wasnt suppose to be generic ranged dps but a spec ops member with a mobility and ability to take down prio targets quickly as well as doing some random wierd sh*t which no one else could. Now we can't do anything of that. Not only that, we lost utility, lost traps, lost mobility, lost 3rd spec, not top dps. We have been reduced to ele shaman but even less mobile and with even less utility.

[GeekyArcher]

So is Markman pretty much a dead spec at launch? I typically enjoy a bit of PVP along with some heroics/mythics.. Is it better to go BM/Survival at launch at the moment?

[Danshot]

Aimed Shot A powerful aimed shot that deals (185%->200% of weapon damage) Physical damage. Hunter - Marksmanship Spec. 50 Focus. 40 yd range. Instant.

Neat.

[albatar]

That's silly. Master's Call and RoS were vital components for hunters to stay alive. It's not like hunters are flat out dominating the current PvP meta.

It's really hard, if not flat out impossible, to call how pvp is going to play out. But point in fact remains that we lost a HUMONGOUS load of CC and survivability. If we get compensation for that in some way or if other classes suffer similarily that would be OK, but I remain skeptical until I know either for sure.

We're losing double deterrence; two of our specs are losing access to an iconic class CC: Freezing Trap; we're losing Master's Call; we're losing RoS; BM and most of all MM are losing Kill Shot; BM is losing BW CC immunity. Those are some pretty heavy hits. And I've seen little in return; nor have I seen such massive massive defensive nerfs on other classes.

Like I said, ill save my judgement knowing that a lot of pvp balancing has yet to be done and waiting for some of the better players to give their feedback. But from the looks of things it's not too good, so I'm remaining very skeptical.

I only tried MM on PTR and was disapointed. No more trap, no more Kill Shot, no more burst...only spamming small damage when rogues can 3 shots you. You know when you are playing the victime class when eveybody in the BG rushe you because you are an easy kill. I saw some youtuber in Beta doing 500k damage at lvl 110 but i don't know how. Did i miss something to do high damage ?

[Kanzerbb]

Aimed Shot A powerful aimed shot that deals (185%->200% of weapon damage) Physical damage. Hunter - Marksmanship Spec. 50 Focus. 40 yd range. Instant.

Neat.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is a data mining error. Reasons to back my statement are as follows:

1.) WoWHead states it is a 185%->200% damage increase. Still 2 sec. cast.
2.) No changes or iterations to Lock and Load, which enabled auto attacks a chance to cause your next to Aimed Shots to be instant and free.

[Perrin]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is a data mining error. Reasons to back my statement are as follows:

1.) WoWHead states it is a 185%->200% damage increase. Still 2 sec. cast.
2.) No changes or iterations to Lock and Load, which enabled auto attacks a chance to cause your next to Aimed Shots to be instant and free.

you don't even need to check other sites. when you look at the tooltip it still says 2 sec cast in the new version.

[Deleted]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is a data mining error. Reasons to back my statement are as follows:

1.) WoWHead states it is a 185%->200% damage increase. Still 2 sec. cast.
2.) No changes or iterations to Lock and Load, which enabled auto attacks a chance to cause your next to Aimed Shots to be instant and free.

For a split second I felt like I won the lottery. I really really want to play hunter, but there is no spec that is fun to me. Aimed Shot while moving? Yes please. Instant Aimed Shot? Butter me up and call me Sandy!

Sadly... no

[Deleted]

For a split second I felt like I won the lottery. I really really want to play hunter, but there is no spec that is fun to me. Aimed Shot while moving? Yes please. Instant Aimed Shot? Butter me up and call me Sandy!

Sadly... no

pretty much this

[Deleted]

Spec is totally boring for me, aimed shot at this form is pathetic.
I see MM as high mobility, not big dmg uptime BUT really big nuke button to push sometimes.

and from pvp perspective lets quote holinka:
"If a class is very mobile and has a lot of damage uptime, they may need a damage reduction to maintain balance."

okay mr holinka and what about WW, DH rogues?
Where are they going with this?

[Deleted]

Spec is totally boring for me, aimed shot at this form is pathetic.
I see MM as high mobility, not big dmg uptime BUT really big nuke button to push sometimes.

and from pvp perspective lets quote holinka:
"If a class is very mobile and has a lot of damage uptime, they may need a damage reduction to maintain balance."

okay mr holinka and what about WW, DH rogues?
Where are they going with this?

sub rogues have non-cd "shadowstep backstab thingy" when ever they decide to dance ( 3 charges ), vanish ( 30sec cd ) or otherwise get into stealth so imo they should heal you when they get to you.

[DeicideUH]

I only tried MM on PTR and was disapointed. No more trap, no more Kill Shot, no more burst...only spamming small damage when rogues can 3 shots you. You know when you are playing the victime class when eveybody in the BG rushe you because you are an easy kill. I saw some youtuber in Beta doing 500k damage at lvl 110 but i don't know how. Did i miss something to do high damage ?

Pretty much this, but we need to remember that at Level 110 there's the Artifact power and traits that change how the spec plays. Less CD on Bursting Shot, more damage on all shots, plus healing on AotT and dmg reduction on Disengage.

But at level 100, he spec is very bland and underpowered.

[Freerunz]

that change how the spec plays. Less CD on Bursting Shot, more damage on all shots, plus healing on AotT and dmg reduction on Disengage.

how the spec plays... how the spec plays...how the spec plays...how the spec plays...

I can bet you are Celestalon's illegitimate son.

[Feanoro]

Reminders:
- Instant Aimed Shot only existed in Wrath (but MM needed ArP to be worth it) and in the current tier, which has OP bonuses handed out like candy
- Aimed on the move was a sop to rushing WoD out and being unable to solve the "painted ourselves into a corner" on pvp mobility


It's more concerning that they built the two-stage debuff system, made us shit without those debuffs, then tossed it out the window with a half-assed Sidewinders/Patient Sniper bandaid.

Clearly management is rushing a release again...

[Thursley]

It's more concerning that they built the two-stage debuff system, made us shit without those debuffs, then tossed it out the window with a half-assed Sidewinders/Patient Sniper bandaid.

Clearly management is rushing a release again...

That's not fair, they haven't tossed anything out the window. They're doing exactly what they have consistently said they want to do, which is use talents to offer different playstyle options. If they fail to balance it properly and the patient sniper / sidewinder playstyle is always strictly superior then that would be a failure on their part, but that's very different from them actively abandoning the baseline spec.

[Zoopercat]

For those of you running sims on the AMR simulator, I wanted to let you know we just updated the site with the latest beta patch. You can run updated sims on our beta site.

And remember, you can easily verify all of our implementations. For example, you can see that Aimed Shot deals 200% weapon damage. It's in the first "Damage" section under Effects, the first number in the formula, 2.00 is the weapon damage multiplier.

Browse the spells on the left menu if you want to check out other ones. The idea with this wiki style info is that it's easy(ish) to verify and you can have confidence that things are implemented correctly (or find bugs quickly).

Other updates:

• We have the client program available now (get it here), so you can target lower margins of error. You still use the website to setup sims and view reports, while the client operates in the background to use your own computer's cores.
• We also have all dps set bonuses implemented and about half of the legendaries (working on finishing those this week). Trinkets are still being worked on, so hang tight on those.
• We also moved the consumables out of the rotation and into the options when you setup a simulation.
• A few bug fixes.
• If you have questions, hit us up here, on Discord or our forums. And for help, this page has some resources.
  

[Deleted]

We dont need instant Aimed shot, we need heavy- huge damage skill with nice procs sometimes. But this should hit like full moon or something. Also, heavy chimera like instant cast (CD) and some fillers with nice-non boring mechanic. That is how I see this. But this is more from pvp perspective.

[shade3891]

So just viewed the Q&A, did i hear it correctly that there will be a hidden gun skin for MM?

[Vurrin]

I believe its actually a crossbow. Afaik no gun specific model for thas'dorah. Although you can Xmog it to look like one.