Top Bosses that remained unkilled the longest.

[Spawn913]

very interesting stuff

[Frolk]

Is there an list that shows amount of pulls needed on these bosses?

[trylessyo]

People were just bad back in the days

[Fenixdown]

The ones I find the most fascinating are #1 and #10. I wonder if the reasons for Ouro and Vicidus being so incredibly high on the list was due to their lack of interest (as they were side bosses with minimal upgrade potential) or in the case of Vicidus, due to an incredibly asinine amount of requirements due to it's raid mechanics. Funny enough, Vicidus was a drastically easier fight for Horde raids, as they had access to shamans and thus had access to Poison Cleansing totems. In comparison, Alliance raids had to stack an incredibly high number of druids and/or paladins to deal with the constant barrage of debuffs. And don't forget all your non-mage casters needing frost damage wands!

But Ouro...like, it's funny, it's almost like after C'thun fell everyone was like "Oh yeah, there's that worm boss, let's go do that I guess". It's kinda sad when that's the attitude people had towards Blizzard's raid design. It's loot was subpar and it wasn't the end boss, so it was like...why bother?

[judgementofantonidas]

I do agree with the guy saying this list should be redone accounting number of tries.

Things changed a lot. We mostly have no corpse runs ,portals, even mass summons during Cata. Much smaller raids with less trash packs or even very small raids with just a few bosses in it. This shortens the time span required to get a kill.Also, gearing have been much much easier, now we even have BMAH and raid finder.

We also should account in for the massive increse on world-first interest, wich is can be considered an e.sport on its own.

Let's take for example Heroic Raggy from FL. From Dream Paragon guild site " We wiped 500+ times on the boss, although I lost count at some point"

Different times.

one way or the other it should be made uniform.
either from instance opening, or from prior boss kill.

[Purpleisbetter]

Your not the least bit wrong the list would look a hell of alot different with more recent bosses in the top spots.

If extended to all mythic bosses with lock extended to the whole account, could be a deterrent against one of the biggest enemy of top guilds: split raids.

[theyanger]

The ones I find the most fascinating are #1 and #10. I wonder if the reasons for Ouro and Vicidus being so incredibly high on the list was due to their lack of interest (as they were side bosses with minimal upgrade potential) or in the case of Vicidus, due to an incredibly asinine amount of requirements due to it's raid mechanics. Funny enough, Vicidus was a drastically easier fight for Horde raids, as they had access to shamans and thus had access to Poison Cleansing totems. In comparison, Alliance raids had to stack an incredibly high number of druids and/or paladins to deal with the constant barrage of debuffs. And don't forget all your non-mage casters needing frost damage wands!

But Ouro...like, it's funny, it's almost like after C'thun fell everyone was like "Oh yeah, there's that worm boss, let's go do that I guess". It's kinda sad when that's the attitude people had towards Blizzard's raid design. It's loot was subpar and it wasn't the end boss, so it was like...why bother?

I mean, why would you go kill Ouro first as soon as the patch hit? The reality is guilds had tried both, they were both broken, C'thun was clearly the superior boss to kill, so why wouldn't you do him first? The amount of strat requirement for C'thun for guilds as soon as the patch hit was literally 0, it was a matter of walking in and doing it.

[Cernunnos]

I mean, why would you go kill Ouro first as soon as the patch hit? The reality is guilds had tried both, they were both broken, C'thun was clearly the superior boss to kill, so why wouldn't you do him first? The amount of strat requirement for C'thun for guilds as soon as the patch hit was literally 0, it was a matter of walking in and doing it.

Ouro was also bugged. His underground phase would sometimes bug out and he wouldnt emerged from underground, his damage would sometimes increase far beyond what guild's could handle in the raid gear at the time pretty much the same patch that fixed C'thuns bugs fixed Ouro's.

And yeah, guild's intentionally avoided him because C'thun big bad of the instance, and Ouro was a side boss.

[Deleted]

This list is and was always useless.

No Boss is so hard that the most skilled players of the time couldnt killed it in over 100 days. To put buggy and impossible bosses in there misleading new players that never played at that time, so they think this old 2 mechanic bosses were harder.
Dont get me wrong the game back then was different, the calsses had little survivibility, not like today where every class has more than one "oh shit button" and an insane amount of mobility. If you did a mistake back then you could not just leap out, you just died.
And to put 4 hourseman in there is also wrong, not the boss mechanics kept players from killing it, just the farming of gear for it.

LK HC without doubt one of the hardest Bosses for its time and stayed that long alive because guilds had only 50 atempts per week for LK plus the 4 wingbosses alltogether. If you died at one of of the wingbosses you lost one of your tries for LK.

Then all the T5 Bosses, they were all buggy plus, who could kill them like from the start of TBC? Guilds first farmed T4, not to forget attunement system.

This list is useless to measure anything.

[Deleted]

this list is so wrong!

[MattEffect]

Its hard to make a list given the different factors each expansion brings. We need graphs, graphs always make things better.

[jallfo]

Obviously this shows how boss/raid design has changed, along with how much harder the world first guilds try now, more so than anything about difficulty.

-SNIP-

And the top spot might be C'Thun, which was broken and unkillable until Blizzard fixed some bugs. Guilds just went in there and hit their faces against the wall, then one day Blizzard secretly patched him and suddenly he died. WF went to the guilds that happened to be raiding when the nerf went live. Vanilla was the best!

Hey there, it's interesting that you link that article regarding C'thun. In the article my previous guild leader (Failure of Risen on Alleria) recounts some of the bugs that happened in that fight.

I just wanted to point out a couple of things as I was playing with the guild at that time trying to progress.

• At the time, servers were largely full and you had to be in queue for hours to login so often guilds didn't have 40 people
• You said guilds didn't have developers onsite for "WA" like addons. This is factually untrue. Many of the top guilds, hell the top two of Alleria, had LUA programmers on site and were constantly updating addons to help with fights. See below for my Viscidus explanation.
• Datamining wasn't a thing, so we spent a considerable amount of time OUTSIDE of the encounter looking around the world trying to find a soultion. Little did we know the encounter just was over tuned. Our total number of attemps wasn't NEAR what they are today for top end guilds

The ones I find the most fascinating are #1 and #10. I wonder if the reasons for Ouro and Vicidus being so incredibly high on the list was due to their lack of interest (as they were side bosses with minimal upgrade potential) or in the case of Vicidus, due to an incredibly asinine amount of requirements due to it's raid mechanics. Funny enough, Vicidus was a drastically easier fight for Horde raids, as they had access to shamans and thus had access to Poison Cleansing totems. In comparison, Alliance raids had to stack an incredibly high number of druids and/or paladins to deal with the constant barrage of debuffs. And don't forget all your non-mage casters needing frost damage wands!

But Ouro...like, it's funny, it's almost like after C'thun fell everyone was like "Oh yeah, there's that worm boss, let's go do that I guess". It's kinda sad when that's the attitude people had towards Blizzard's raid design. It's loot was subpar and it wasn't the end boss, so it was like...why bother?

As noted above, I was part of a top 3-5 guild in the world at this time so I can give you some insight into how we were looking to progress on these bosses:

Ouro:

• There defintiely wasn't a "Lack of trying" on this guy, guilds were still spending hours on him each night
• There were plenty of issues with progression including the fact that sometimes the boss would spawn twice. Would often reset, and sometimes would burrow and never come up
• With the same patch that Nerfed C'thun, both Viscidus and Ouro were heavily nerfed. Which is why you saw kills of them so quickly after as well
• There was a strategy that worked for him which involved having two groups consisting of 4 warlocks and 1 priest. The locks would chain tap and the priests would spam Prayer of Healing. This put the priests highest on the threat table while being able to LoS the melee from Ouro (there was a rock formation in the room they could hide behind and accomplish this). This was how we (Risen) were consistently able to get him to the low health / enrage, but then we would wipe - we later abandoned this strategy for fear of "Exploiting"

Viscidus:

• Similarly to C'thun, became much easier after a patch.
• Part of the problem here was the insane corpse run to get back to him. An attempt legitimately took 20-min or so to reset from. There was a bug where you could get DC'd while walking up the branch thing to get to him
• It took us a very long time messing with custom addons to determine if it was TOTAL frost damage or INSTANCES of frost damage that were required in order to get him to freeze. As such, we actually spent many attempts with people in frost type gear (oil / wands etc) and others without.
• There was a good amount of RNG to this fight due to how the blobs spawned.

Anyway, I'm always available to answer any more questions if you need them. This was kind of my "prime" of raiding so I remember it all very well. More than happy to answer anything else you're curious about.

[Deleted]

Whats the point of this list? half of vanilla, actually all of it was bugged as fuck and blizzard took months to fix these bugs hence the long kill times, when the fixes happened, the bosses died the next day. Difference is that today blizzard fixes stuff like this almost instantly, see Archimonde mythic p1, if this was vanilla, they would have left that shit up for few months.

[Saiban]

Anyway, I'm always available to answer any more questions if you need them. This was kind of my "prime" of raiding so I remember it all very well. More than happy to answer anything else you're curious about.

Honestly, any interesting facts you could share would be cool to read and much appreciated. Your post was insightful, containing information I hadn't heard before. Overall, it seems to me that information on raiding during that time is pretty scarce compared to today. More cool tidbits on any raids would be awesome (esp. Naxx, if you have any).

[Sim]

These are from the date it was possible to begin working on them, or the previous hard mode was killed. I'm sure people might quibble with some of them but I did my best. Going with 25-mans here.

You didn't take into the account when they started allowing guilds to raid test raid bosses before they came online. Marking the date upon official release is miss leading because often top guilds will be practising these bosses months before they are actually put out onto live.

[Deleted]

You didn't take into the account when they started allowing guilds to raid test raid bosses before they came online. Marking the date upon official release is miss leading because often top guilds will be practising these bosses months before they are actually put out onto live.

That's just a myth. Bosses are usually up for 1 hour and a half on beta/ptr and they are usually in an extremely bugged state because the 2nd rate test team was doing them with immunity on.

[minteK917]

Yogg 0 light was the only one that really deserve its spot as one of the hardest fight. It was harder then anything in wotlk. Much harder then anything in WoD. This cant even be a debate. The 3rd phase requires so much dps at the time. So many players were kicked in my guild lol.

[Defaulty]

Whats the point of this list? half of vanilla, actually all of it was bugged as fuck and blizzard took months to fix these bugs hence the long kill times, when the fixes happened, the bosses died the next day. Difference is that today blizzard fixes stuff like this almost instantly, see Archimonde mythic p1, if this was vanilla, they would have left that shit up for few months.

I believe it's just strictly measuring the time of the boss' conception to it's first kill. The data can be argued in many different ways, just depends on the semantics.

[Nitros14]

Whats the point of this list? half of vanilla, actually all of it was bugged as fuck and blizzard took months to fix these bugs hence the long kill times, when the fixes happened, the bosses died the next day. Difference is that today blizzard fixes stuff like this almost instantly, see Archimonde mythic p1, if this was vanilla, they would have left that shit up for few months.

The point is to start people talking about old bosses and raids. Obviously doesn't measure difficulty.

Yogg 0 light was the only one that really deserve its spot as one of the hardest fight. It was harder then anything in wotlk. Much harder then anything in WoD. This cant even be a debate. The 3rd phase requires so much dps at the time. So many players were kicked in my guild lol.

Yeah it's interesting, that boss was up forever despite no significant nerfs or changes after the phase 1 mind control removal in week 2. Guilds only killed it after months of farming BiS gear.

[Deleted]

in past bosses lasted longer due players not being as good, less loot, needing to farm resistance gear atunements or limited attemps in icc. But overall bosses currently are lot harder. and world first cottenders play lot more now aswell.