Why should China Respect the Hague's ruling?

[Caliph]

Who is the Hague to rule on china's sovereignty? what is it with the west that we're so inclined to believe we have the right to interfere or intervene everywhere in this world? How many times has the US, Isreal, France, England violated international protocols, rules, laws to get what they want yet China's supposed to accept some western court's ruling concerning disputed islands? Throw Russia in the violator of international law as well. They may be the leader. I couldn't find any relevant research so I have to come to a deduction of sorts concerning the matter. Just look at their butchery in Chechnya, Afghanistan, and their recent forays into Ukraine and Syria. All violations of international law. Where was the Hague in the matter? Here's a link to the China article. oh yeah big bad, blustery America (my country) has sent 2 carrier groups to the south china seas region. You're all worried about ISIS and nobodies like that while America's here trying to kick the hornet's nest with the biggest military ever seen.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/...cid=spartandhp

America i'm sad and ashamed to say will be the end of us all. economically, politically, militarily, and millions of "rapture" ready Christian Zionists seeking to start the armeggdon at the forefront.

[Bloodline]

The International Court of Justice in The Hague is the primary judicial branch of the United Nations, of which China is a member state. They probably signed something somewhere that they respect rulings from said court.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intern...urt_of_Justice
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations

Also the fact that they don't need to listen due to other nations getitng away with things is an appeal to tradition fallacy I believe. I don't think that would hold up in court.

[Caliph]

The International Court of Justice in The Hague is the primary judicial branch of the United Nations, of which China is a member state. They probably signed something somewhere that they respect rulings from said court.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intern...urt_of_Justice
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations

That means nothing. No one else has abided by it so why should they? the G5's so called leadership lead to this. they've violated every law, placed puppets and criminals in leadership positions all over the world that violated all the laws and now China's being told to abide by those same rules? The bigger problem is why is America have 2 carrier groups in the region? Certainly china feels threatened and annoyed by it. I mean does America really care about the Philippines?

[Bloodline]

Your topic title is "Why should China respect The Hague's ruling?". And the answer to that is just that: the International Court of Justice is the court of the UN of which China is a member state. So that must mean something, right? To address your other point: I actually just edited my initial post with this:

The fact that they don't need to listen due to other nations getting away with things is an appeal to tradition fallacy I believe. I don't think that would hold up in any court.

EDIT: Oh well, just to keep the discussion going i pitched some things I'm not really further interested in this affair.

[Caliph]

Your topic title is "Why should China respect The Hague's ruling?". And the answer to that is just that: the International Court of Justice is the court of the UN of which China is a member state. So that must mean something, right? To address your other point: I actually just edited my initial post with this:

The fact that they don't need to listen due to other nations getting away with things is an appeal to tradition fallacy I believe. I don't think that would hold up in any court.

EDIT: Oh well, just to keep the discussion going i pitched some things I'm not really further interested in this affair.

good for you. You'll be interested when American brinksmanship leads to much bigger problems.

[Kellhound]

Why should anyone abide by any court ruling?

[oxymoronic]

That means nothing. No one else has abided by it so why should they? the G5's so called leadership lead to this. they've violated every law, placed puppets and criminals in leadership positions all over the world that violated all the laws and now China's being told to abide by those same rules? The bigger problem is why is America have 2 carrier groups in the region? Certainly china feels threatened and annoyed by it. I mean does America really care about the Philippines?

as a filipino i feel they do.

we have a mutual respect and a crazy president, whats not to love?

[Garnier Fructis]

It's all kabuki theater, really.

But any tears from China are basically crocodile tears, because they're about the last ones who should be complaining about unfairness or tyrannical behavior.

[May90]

What do Christian Zionists have to do with it?

[Celista]

Your topic title is "Why should China respect The Hague's ruling?". And the answer to that is just that: the International Court of Justice is the court of the UN of which China is a member state. So that must mean something, right? To address your other point: I actually just edited my initial post with this:

The fact that they don't need to listen due to other nations getting away with things is an appeal to tradition fallacy I believe. I don't think that would hold up in any court.

EDIT: Oh well, just to keep the discussion going i pitched some things I'm not really further interested in this affair.

Seemed to me like you quite adequately answered the OP.

[Independent voter]

Vietnam and Philippines are smaller countries, China is taking their land, going to court is a peaceful way to resolve the issue.

[nonameelf]

Well, they're UN members so that means they can basically do whatever the fuck they want because the UN sure isn't going to do anything about it.

[Revi]

Why should anyone abide by any court ruling?

Well, because we have to, because the courts will exercice power to enforce their ruling and we're not ble to resist that power.

If you are the power, or are able to resist the power enforcing the court, your only reason to abide is to keep good relations. If you don't care about that, or know that your relations are secure regardless, you don't need to abide.

Which is why the Hague is ignored repeatedly, even by the west who keeps trying to use it to push things on others. It's power is backed by the same entities it's trying to control, which allows those entities to just ignore it if they wish.

[Deleted]

Because might makes right.

Rawwr.

[Kasierith]

The same reason why the United States is not a member of the ICC. Because when you join as a member you sign treaties with the other member nations agreeing to abide by their rulings.

- - - Updated - - -

The International Court of Justice in The Hague is the primary judicial branch of the United Nations, of which China is a member state. They probably signed something somewhere that they respect rulings from said court.

This is incorrect. The UN and the binding treaties as member states precede the ICC, and they are, legally speaking, two separate entities. Member states can become recognized member states of the UN while choosing not to join the ICC, though it's pretty easy to bully smaller states to join in. The US simply straight up refuses, basically because it is the stats quo for the US to reject anything from the ICC to climate control regulations that can allow other states to impede on its national sovereignty.

[psyquest]

Why should anyone abide by any court ruling?

yeah, lets settle things wild west style!

[Sunseeker]

Because it means other involved nations are now allowed to take further action against China if China continues. That's why. The same reason anyone should respect a court ruling against you, because if you don't abide by the ruling they can take more aggressive action against you.

[Zcion999]

Well, because we have to, because the courts will exercice power to enforce their ruling and we're not ble to resist that power.

If you are the power, or are able to resist the power enforcing the court, your only reason to abide is to keep good relations. If you don't care about that, or know that your relations are secure regardless, you don't need to abide.

Which is why the Hague is ignored repeatedly, even by the west who keeps trying to use it to push things on others. It's power is backed by the same entities it's trying to control, which allows those entities to just ignore it if they wish.

Boggles my mind that a concept that simple is not understood by people. At least you get it. We obey the courts because they can ENFORCE their decisions. There are ethical systems at work here but from a purely mechanical point of view, we obey the rulings because if not men with guns will come and kill us.

OT: When you remove the potential of men with guns coming to kill you then obeying the court becomes a matter of diplomacy. If you can get away with not obeying and are pretty certain the US is not going to start a war over that shit then there is nothing stopping anyone from flipping the bird to The Hague. Especially in more recent times where the UN has shown itself to be basically useless and powerless to do anything.

China is pretty certain the US will not wage war and will probably not do any economic sanctions against them since they are a huge part of american economy. They are at a position of power, if they decide to obey, it will be out of respect for whatever the UN is supposed to represent but it will not be out of necessity.

[Tailswipe]

Who is the Hague to rule on china's sovereignty? what is it with the west that we're so inclined to believe we have the right to interfere or intervene everywhere in this world? How many times has the US, Isreal, France, England violated international protocols, rules, laws to get what they want yet China's supposed to accept some western court's ruling concerning disputed islands? Throw Russia in the violator of international law as well. They may be the leader. I couldn't find any relevant research so I have to come to a deduction of sorts concerning the matter. Just look at their butchery in Chechnya, Afghanistan, and their recent forays into Ukraine and Syria. All violations of international law. Where was the Hague in the matter? Here's a link to the China article. oh yeah big bad, blustery America (my country) has sent 2 carrier groups to the south china seas region. You're all worried about ISIS and nobodies like that while America's here trying to kick the hornet's nest with the biggest military ever seen.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/...cid=spartandhp

America i'm sad and ashamed to say will be the end of us all. economically, politically, militarily, and millions of "rapture" ready Christian Zionists seeking to start the armeggdon at the forefront.

The arrogance of the west annoys me as well. They seem to feel that they have jurisdiction to prosecute any African leader in European courts just because of how poor and weak we are compared to them.

[Deleted]

The arrogance of the west annoys me as well. They seem to feel that they have jurisdiction to prosecute any African leader in European courts just because of how poor and weak we are compared to them.

You are poor and weak often because you have shitty and corrupt leaders. If they get prosecuted the next corrupt dictator might think twice ?

But i agree to a certain point. The west should pull out of africa and let them sort shit out themselves. Obviously throwing billions in aid didn't help.