[Legion] Shadow Priest Discussion

[davesignal]

The idea is that you know you can maintain VF for X time. You then use it when the boss will die within X.

Yes it means you die early if you screw up, if your afraid of that your better off with a different talent.

Except you probably aren't, because StM allows you to do such ludicrous damage that you'll probably still come out even with what LoTV produces even if you die early.

[Deleted]

Yes people, the tentacle problem is there but PLEASE can we try to focus on real game play problem instead of something that is purely cosmetics?

[Ilir]

Yes people, the tentacle problem is there but PLEASE can we try to focus on real game play problem instead of something that is purely cosmetics?

Lol.

Did you know that your brain and most people brain (i hope) can handle those two issues at the same time ? Or is it that hard ?

Are you able to use your fork and your knife at the same time or you can only do one at the time ?

Anyway your post is stupid.

[Gnarilex]

Yes people, the tentacle problem is there but PLEASE can we try to focus on real game play problem instead of something that is purely cosmetics?

You don't think we've tried getting as much feedback to the devs as possible? Most of it has largely been ignored since the beginning of alpha.

[Ilir]

Also it's the MMO-C forum so most of the things talked about in here aren't going to the dev's ears and I'm pretty sure most of the feedback is about the "real" game play problems.

[Gnarilex]

Also it's the MMO-C forum so most of the things talked about in here aren't going to the dev's ears and I'm pretty sure most of the feedback is about the "real" game play problems.

A lot of it did end up on the alpha threads, though. There were a few people kind enough to copy/paste posts over.

[Deleted]

Lol.

Did you know that your brain and most people brain (i hope) can handle those two issues at the same time ? Or is it that hard ?

Are you able to use your fork and your knife at the same time or you can only do one at the time ?

Anyway your post is stupid.

Some guy posted about tentacles and 1½ page after was people talking about it. Sure the lack of aoe have been brought up but its mostly been "i want aoe" and not "i need aoe because of how you changed the game".

Spreading awareness is important and increases the chances of the devs hearing us.

Anyway your post is stupid...

[Djriff]

Also it's the MMO-C forum so most of the things talked about in here aren't going to the dev's ears and I'm pretty sure most of the feedback is about the "real" game play problems.

I know I posted some feedback as did quite a few others from MMOC and H2P about some concerns. We were basically ignored, or rather weren't addressed like we asked. Like I'd be a lot more OK with the direction we're going if I knew their end goal for our class cause right now we look like a mess with little to no direction.

[Ilnezhara]

I know I posted some feedback as did quite a few others from MMOC and H2P about some concerns. We were basically ignored, or rather weren't addressed like we asked. Like I'd be a lot more OK with the direction we're going if I knew their end goal for our class cause right now we look like a mess with little to no direction.

How so? I feel shadow is one of the best designed classes at the moment, much better than Balance!

[Deleted]

Is there clear evidence that Call to the Void (the Mind Flay Trait?) is stronger than Sphere of Insanity? I'd be interesting in seeing that, if so! My tests and damage results had shown me that Sphere of Insanity was the better option of the two (hence my mentioning of it so much).

If that is not the case, feedback would be much appreciated so I can revise my information!

[Deleted]

Is there clear evidence that Call to the Void (the Mind Flay Trait?) is stronger than Sphere of Insanity? I'd be interesting in seeing that, if so! My tests and damage results had shown me that Sphere of Insanity was the better option of the two (hence my mentioning of it so much).

If that is not the case, feedback would be much appreciated so I can revise my information!

Checking logs on ST with all traits show that sphere is doing more damage.

By going Call to the Void you remove the option to go AS so its pretty much an all in on something that most likely isnt even better than going Sphere.

[Djriff]

How so? I feel shadow is one of the best designed classes at the moment, much better than Balance!

Well we still have no burst AoE, our cleave damage sucks outside of multi dotting (which is fine). We have decent ST burst on a 1m CD in our Artifact but that's about it. SW: P is too short of a duration that unless you have some decent gear you can't actually get 70 Insanity without having to refresh it, bad deisgn IMO.

And as for direction i was speaking more of the lore. We were told something about old gods and the void being our thing, then they threw insanity into the mix and all this other stuff. It's a huge jumble that really doesn't make any sense. We went from being shadowy, the absence of the light and the darker side of priests, to poor cousins of warlocks that are tapping into the void for the first time. Just seems weird to me.

- - - Updated - - -

Checking logs on ST with all traits show that sphere is doing more damage.

By going Call to the Void you remove the option to go AS so its pretty much an all in on something that most likely isnt even better than going Sphere.

That's interesting, in all the testing i did, Void Tendril did much more than SoI. Did they finally fix the bugs/sound?

[Deleted]

Checking logs on ST with all traits show that sphere is doing more damage.

By going Call to the Void you remove the option to go AS so its pretty much an all in on something that most likely isnt even better than going Sphere.

Okay! My testing came to the same result - which is why I was so surprised that some were saying Call to the Void was the better option.
But ultimately all of this is still futile.

[Ryeshot]

Checking logs on ST with all traits show that sphere is doing more damage.

I do not understand how this is the case, considering SoI only does 5% of the damage of your MB, VB, and MFs.

A single VB benefiting from mastery, Voidform, and Sinister Thoughts does 364% sp.
A single MB benefiting from Voidform and Mind Shattering does 414% sp.
A single MF benefiting from Voidform and Void Siphon does 288% sp per channel, and 72 per tick.

5% of each is:
18.2% sp VB
20.7% sp MB
14.4% sp MF channel, 3.6% sp tick

A normal VF rotation goes VB > MB > 1 tick MF > VB > full channel MF > repeat. With a normal VF rotation (30 stacks) you should be able to cast at most 8 mind blasts, so let's say 8 rotations averaging at 601% spell power damage per Voidform. And only in Vordform.

CttV is unaffected by Voidform, but is affected by versatility, haste with proc chance, and spell power since it does 1000% spell power over 10sec channel. Also, it does not require Voidform so it is not restricted to only be useful during it, unlike SoI. With the above average damage of SoI, CttV has to proc at least once every 1.66 voidforms to be better. And considering it is affected by haste, being useful for our lingering insanity and haste in VF, it should proc at least 1.5 times a minute.

I'm sorry for the arbitrary rotation, but beta is down and I wanted to get this out asap. I'm sure the amount of MB rotations isn't completely accurate, but I'm sure it is not that far off. Once I get back in I'll test my skill use averages to make this more accurate.

[Isentropy]

Checking logs on ST with all traits show that sphere is doing more damage.

By going Call to the Void you remove the option to go AS so its pretty much an all in on something that most likely isnt even better than going Sphere.

What logs are you looking at? Call to the Void was bugged for two builds and didn't work at all so yes, of course Sphere is going to do better then. Sphere is absolutely, no way, zero chance better than Call to the Void at the moment. Going Call to the Void also has nothing to do with the strength of AS, unless you're implying that Unleash the Shadows is required in order for AS to be better than the other options on the row. Again, not true at all.

[Ryeshot]

AS is better than San'layn and SI even without Unleash the Shadows, and Unleash the Shadows only makes it better? That pretty much only provides one play style and one stat priority. Is this true for single target as well as multi? If that is the case, then Legion doesn't provide nearly as many options as it shows.

[Ilir]

Some guy posted about tentacles and 1½ page after was people talking about it. Sure the lack of aoe have been brought up but its mostly been "i want aoe" and not "i need aoe because of how you changed the game".

Spreading awareness is important and increases the chances of the devs hearing us.

Anyway your post is stupid...

This thread is full of people complaining about the aoe. The shadow feedback (and the previous ones) was full of it. A lot of people went on telling us "but guys dw, we don't need aoe !".

We complained about StM and the unbalanced (or uselessness) of the level 100 talent tier since... like the beginning of alpha.

We are actively discussing those.

1,5 pages of tentacles talk isn't going to suddenly make the devs change their stance towards us. They have their mind set, they won't change it.

With that said, I'm sorry for my previous post, it was bad and uncalled for. Had a bad day (it's not an excuse, just an explanation).

[Isentropy]

When you have a certain amount of crit AS comes ahead of both San'layn and Shadowy Insight on single target. Haste will most likely have breakpoints where it starts falling off (100% haste really won't be hard to reach in raids, keeping Bloodlust and STM in mind as well) which means mindlessly stacking it won't be a good idea imo, and that pretty much leaves crit because of how well rounded it is as a stat. Mastery is good as well for really heavy multidot fights but I don't think you'll have the luxury to gather seperate gearsets for seperate fights during progress - mastery is still a poor stat for single target.

[Ryeshot]

I asked this question a while back and it never got noticed. Do we want hastening effects like Heroism and Power Infusion to affect our gc/d cap, or should be ignore them? I'm only asking because the amount of average VF stacks combined with haste effects makes us hit 100% haste at ~20% normal haste, which is very little and easily hit at 830 ilvl.

[Deleted]

Went back and checked logs and i gotta say im confused. On Tichondrius it sometimes procced 5 times during a 3 min fight and actually dealt alot of damage. Then going to Elisande i cant see any damage from them on any pull.

If we say that Sphere and Tentacles are even and compare the traits between them.
15% VT, 15% VB and 10% SWD VS 45% Appa chance, 18% SWP and 3% Shadow Damage.
Without doing any calculations(since i pretty much suck at them) and just thinking it feels like they are close to eachother aswell. Only difference is that 45% chance of apparition is needed if we decide to go AS.

If you happen to get the legendary waist you cast less MF and more MB which further changes everything. I guess shoulders are the other way around though.

Feels like the safest choice is going long way to Hysteria and then Sphere else you might lock yourself into something and cant change it.

- - - Updated - - -

This thread is full of people complaining about the aoe. The shadow feedback (and the previous ones) was full of it. A lot of people went on telling us "but guys dw, we don't need aoe !".

We complained about StM and the unbalanced (or uselessness) of the level 100 talent tier since... like the beginning of alpha.

We are actively discussing those.

1,5 pages of tentacles talk isn't going to suddenly make the devs change their stance towards us. They have their mind set, they won't change it.

With that said, I'm sorry for my previous post, it was bad and uncalled for. Had a bad day (it's not an excuse, just an explanation).

Np about the post, im abit in panic mode when i started to realize that i need to lvl 4 priests and having people boost me in dungeons because i cant do anything on my own and desperately want this to be changed. Hell im fine with them giving us a new aoe spell that can only be used in dungeons, im that desperate.