Why Free College is Bad Idea

[Deleted]

That's already the case in the US. That's the entire reason state funded education is now being pushed, because otherwise people who don't go to college and incur a huge debt only have the option of very low glass ceiling jobs that start at or near minimum wage.

But that was the reason for the problem?
Your solution to the problem is to make the problem bigger?

[Deleted]

They may be free in terms of money but not in term of requirements. It's not unusual for people to be rejected simply because their grades from previous school were not high enough. That's what keeps higher education higher.

sorry, late reply! thats how it works here, and im guessing most of Europe is the same? in the UK we have a UCAS score, most good unis require 300ish.

[Santoryu]

Guess you didn't go to college, otherwise you'd know how to use articles.

[Deleted]

I have feeling that OP is afraid that he can't get to college if he can't buy himself in anymore.
He gotta live in very small bubble and know nothing how things work in EU for example.

[Phlegethon]

Everyone wants college to be free, except no one thinks about the repercussions of everyone having a college degree. If everyone attained a college degree, then the value of a college degree would be worthless and we would be right back where we started. Better stated in the

That might just be the dumbest thing I've ever read.
Just because you don't need to go in debt for the rest of your life, doesn't mean it's "worthless", it just won't cost you an arm, leg and 2 kidneys to get a degree. Your educators remain the same people, they will still be able to learn you shit.
Well, except you, you're stupid. (infraction inc? Worth it.)

[Forogil]

I think I understand what the OP is trying to say, it's just a shame he can only communicate through meme-images instead of using proper words and stuff.

The problem with everyone getting a higher education (not necessarily a problem with it being free) is it saturates the market. Free higher education is great, but school-leavers have to be shown other avenues to developing skills for the job market so everyone isn't funneled towards the same positions.

That is a good point - and I guess it takes education to be able to formulate that point in a coherent way.

So if everyone is super - that isn't bad in itself - but might create a lack of other needed skills:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U01xasUtlvw

well the easiest way we can start making college cheaper for everyone is to get the gov't out of the business of backing private loans.

I mean, dude there's going to be some heavy interest on student loans. It's unsecured, all unsecured loans are expensive, especially given the rate they are defaulted. on

Not having the loans available (or higher interest rates) will make it harder for people to get an education.
There are many options: e.g. the gov't could provide them directly - as in other countries than the US; or make the terms depending on the type of education etc.

People defaulting on student loans in large numbers is an indication that the system is not set up properly, and that destroys the incentive-system of a getting a good education.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Free College is a great idea. I don't even want to read about or listen to any counter-arguments, because it's pretty obvious they're just based in irrational red fear of socialismus.

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I think that is just the UK though? In my country anyone can attend uni as long as they pass the entrance exams (and most faculties don't even have entrance exams). Education in the EU was standardized through the Bologna treaty, but as always the UK was allowed to do it's own thing. (except for not standardizing the degrees).

UCAS is just another metric for comparing school leaving exams. UK universities give ECTS credit points for attended courses too.

[Deleted]

That might just be the dumbest thing I've ever read.

its Econ 101.

Just because you don't need to go in debt for the rest of your life, doesn't mean it's "worthless", it just won't cost you an arm, leg and 2 kidneys to get a degree.

No we can have the EU model, where many degrees earns less money than just not getting a degree and working a random job.

Your educators remain the same people, they will still be able to learn you shit.

not entirely sure how you can reduce costs without in some way cutting costs.

Well, except you, you're stupid. (infraction inc? Worth it.)

It was econ 101 as i said.

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Not having the loans available (or higher interest rates) will make it harder for people to get an education.

But the loans are one of the reasons costs are ballooning, because the colleges can raise tuition and people will borrow, and as they borrow they don't accurately reflect the costs.
Cheap credits raises prices, Its the basis for inflation.

[Deleted]

Thats not why its bad..

Free college is bad cause its not really free. Taxpayers have to pay for it and as with everything government funded, the quality would suffer. I sort of think that it could be free (with limited spots) in the stem fields. However producing useless art, and social studies mayor is a terrible investment and should never happen.

[Forogil]

But the loans are one of the reasons costs are ballooning, because the colleges can raise tuition and people will borrow, and as they borrow they don't accurately reflect the costs.
Cheap credits raises prices, Its the basis for inflation.

There's an obvious solution for that - put a reasonable ceiling on the amount the students can borrow in that way (either a simple amount, or based on some more advanced point-system). The universities will then have an incentive to not over-charge - and it will be the same regardless of whether it is tuition, books, or cost of living.

So, if cheap unlimited credits raise prices - you can limit the credits!

its Econ 101.

[xenogear3]

The reason you cannot find a job is because jobs are outsourced to China.
Not because you don't have a college degree.

Just like government, school is inefficient.
There is really no reason to require a college degree for a pizza delivery job.

[Deleted]

Everyone wants college to be free, except no one thinks about the repercussions of everyone having a college degree. If everyone attained a college degree, then the value of a college degree would be worthless and we would be right back where we started. Better stated in the Disney movie The Incredibles:


Here is an economics professor arguing against education in case you wanted a more "credible" (appeal to authority) source.

You sicken me. Mankind has created this awesome age of knowledge and accessibility and possibility and you want to make sure that not everyone can participate?

This is literally the worst thing I have seen here. Ever.

[Deleted]

i dont really have an issue with the way UK university charges work at the moment, i think thats okay, though i obviously wouldn't be opposed to cheaper / free tuition. I do however, think that unis should be able to set their own entry requirements, not everyone needs a degree, so theres no reason a uni / college should have to accept every applicant

[Puupi]

I do however, think that unis should be able to set their own entry requirements, not everyone needs a degree, so theres no reason a uni / college should have to accept every applicant

That's how it works here. Around 5-15% of applicants are accepted.

[Deleted]

That's how it works here.

ah, some people were saying things about no entry requirements, i am a bit ignorant of how it works in other countries

[Puupi]

ah, some people were saying things about no entry requirements, i am a bit ignorant of how it works in other countries

There is an entrance examination for all admissions. It's either based on high school stuff or some specific books. People actually study years for that examination, especially if you want to get to study medicine, law or business. "Hardly anyone" gets in on their first try.

I oppose this admission system though. It's a waste of time and resources.

[Deleted]

sorry, late reply! thats how it works here, and im guessing most of Europe is the same? in the UK we have a UCAS score, most good unis require 300ish.

Dont know how it is today but 6 or so years ago when I tried to get into English Philology Department in Silesian University you had to get perfect score on Extended Baccalaureate Exam from high school. 400 of such aces were in front of me fighting tooth and nail for 20 spots. That's free higher education for you in Poland. Only for the best of the best.

[Thes]

Thats not why its bad..

Free college is bad cause its not really free. Taxpayers have to pay for it and as with everything government funded, the quality would suffer. I sort of think that it could be free (with limited spots) in the stem fields. However producing useless art, and social studies mayor is a terrible investment and should never happen.

I don't know any place in the world where the programs don't have cap on students though. Put simply, the most valued fields (such as med, law, biz...) have a high amount of appliers but a low amount of accepted students. When the system is meritocratic (you apply with your past degrees/certifications OR you crush it at the entrance exams), you get to study and the tax payers pay.

[XangXu]

Ask the question in a different way.

Would the world be better if everyone, if they choose, had a college level education?

I say yes. Stupidity is ruining the world.

[Deleted]

You sicken me. Mankind has created this awesome age of knowledge and accessibility and possibility and you want to make sure that not everyone can participate?

This is literally the worst thing I have seen here. Ever.

Half the population have an IQ below 100.
one standard deviation up 116 - somewhere here the peoples ability to learn decline (going down, not up obviously) - Anyone with a 120 IQ can learn about anything - Not right away and not without effort - But if i wanted to learn Sanskrit, i could it would take me time and effort, but the outcome would be assured - I would learn it.
Someone with a 100 IQ that's no longer true -
The sad fact is that a non trivial amount of people cant learn - not wont, but cant.
sticking these people with trivial degrees and lifelong debts to do jobs they could qualify for with a HS diploma is not nice, its cruel.

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There's an obvious solution for that - put a reasonable ceiling on the amount the students can borrow in that way (either a simple amount, or based on some more advanced point-system). The universities will then have an incentive to not over-charge - and it will be the same regardless of whether it is tuition, books, or cost of living.

So, if cheap unlimited credits raise prices - you can limit the credits!

Still doesnt solve the issue of people being educated for years to do jobs that wont pay for not working those years.