Legion: Elemental Specific

[Neoxx]

You aren't a shaman. You don't even know a decent shaman. You come in here trolling. Honestly, just muting you and would suggest everyone else does as well. This thing has nothing to offer anyone ever.

You totally know the people I know. Interessting. I'm not trolling, but you can mute me if you want ... maybe that's the best way.

We're all nice to each other, except for bad trolls trying to say what we should and should not do while insulting us. The mod team on this board isnt the best, but we can keep ourselves in check quite well.

This said, we dont need your opinion or the opinion of your shaman guild mate here unless he wants to post in person in this thead.

I didn't tell anyone what to do, you're making shit up again. Second, when I get insulted I talk shit back, that's how it works. I didn't insult anyone in the first place.
If you don't want my opinion here don't read it. Your opinion deosn't reflect everyones opinion on this forum. I can post here if I want, even if I don't main a shaman.

[Deleted]

Hm, four pages earlier we had someone asking for public executions.

Made me laugh tho lmao

[Lightning-]

Ok I actually have to respond to these posts here. Jesus christ some of you are so bitter and angry, like what the fuck has happened?
How did this turn from MY OPINION I state in a public forum to:
"The fucking no name shaman in your no name guild is trash, you should kick that noob"
"We only listen to top10 Shamans and Binkenstein, get the fuck out with your shitty OP mage opinion"
"You are completly wrong with everything you say, don't post an this forum ever again"

Not worth arguing here. I started elemental recently and people said I should keep silent because I have no experience and never played shaman. I just read here now.

[Deleted]

Hm, four pages earlier we had someone asking for public executions.

Which was most likely a joke going towards the dev team and no other poster.

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You totally know the people I know. Interessting. I'm not trolling, but you can mute me if you want ... maybe that's the best way.


I didn't tell anyone what to do, you're making shit up again. Second, when I get insulted I talk shit back, that's how it works. I didn't insult anyone in the first place.
If you don't want my opinion here don't read it. Your opinion deosn't reflect everyones opinion on this forum. I can post here if I want, even if I don't main a shaman.

You can do whatever you want, but everything you say now will be taken with a grain of salt. And I won't hesitate to report you instantly.

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Not worth arguing here. I started elemental recently and people said I should keep silent because I have no experience and never played shaman. I just read here now.

This is why you don't start discussions and writing about how you or your guild mates feel about a class. We discuss with numbers, logs and a working brain.

[Kralljin]

Which was most likely a joke going towards the dev team and no other poster.

Flat out telling that someone needs to be killed isn't my type of joke, and going by the fact that he got banned, is proof enough that other people agree with this stance.

[Deleted]

Flat out telling that someone needs to be killed isn't my type of joke, and going by the fact that he got banned, is proof enough that other people agree with this stance.

Well, I don't know how to say it - but which jokes are tolerable or not is left for each individual. And he didn't get Infracted for this post.

[Kralljin]

Well, I don't know how to say it - but which jokes are tolerable or not is left for each individual.

On the Internet, the host of the Forum usually decides this, since he provides the platform.

[Deleted]

On the Internet, the host of the Forum usually decides this, since he provides the platform.

And I know for fact that even seriously insulting the dev team or any other 3rd party (streamers, etc.) won't result in an infraction. I was in this situation some months ago, and a Global Moderator reversed it.

And again, he wasnt Infracted for this.

[Rawklobster]

Derailed thread is derailed. Can we get back to discussing shaman and not emo rants

[Rezhka]

Derailed thread is derailed. Can we get back to discussing shaman and not emo rants

Nothing to be discussed any further at this point tbh. I myself is already giving up. Maybe on future patch, elemental will get another nerf or no news at all like usual. It's elemental shaman we're talking about anyway. It just happen that I don't know how OP elemental is

[desert-wind]

Derailed thread is derailed. Can we get back to discussing shaman and not emo rants

Do these not go hand in hand? I mean again some fixes are obvious. At an absolute minimum make potm affect CL and LvB. Preferably make our mastery affect all of our damage (or at least primary spells such as earth shock and frost shock) so that our talents and weapon don't work against each other. Again we are an expansion behind.

If this was the state of elemental coming into WoD it wouldn't have been great but we would have started our talent iteration. The problem here is they throw our (finally) revamp in at the same time everyone else's specs got streamlined with artifact traits to polish them off and there are too many directions and contradicting ideas.

Elemental is like the old school cutting room floor of a newspaper, lots of ideas scattered all over the place, some of them good, some of them bad. Someone has come in and mistaken the mess on the floor for the finished articles and sent it to print. That person should be fired (executed lol).

[Deleted]

No one really knows how Blizzard judges class performance. But we know how players calculate it - in rare cases they implement player feedback. They have dedicated class designers (previously Watcher, Holinka, Celestalon and ckali or whatever). All of them have a degree of some sort, they say of themselves that they are dedicated gamers and love their jobs.

The question is now - why Elemental is treated like trash? If you'd ask me which spec deserved some kind of rework in Legion or WoD, I'd always say Elemental. Yet some other classes got major reworks, several even got their 2nd/3rd reworks and on top of this some specs got reworked out of nowhere. The idea of abilities with the sole purpose of buffing other abilities got scrapped 2 expansions ago, yet it is still somehow okay for Ele with Unleash Elements in WoD and SK in Legion. Why?

Not to mention that Elemental ended up with abilities, talents and traits which work against each other yet again. People call them "Lighting" or "Fire" builds, where I call this bullshit. Only one way will be the right one, and if you happen to progress raid on your Elemental, you'll be lucky getting even one set of gear before hunters or the other the other Shaman specs. On top of this "builds" clusterfuck we've level 100 talents which all favour different secondary stat setups.. Again???

They took away Shamanistic Rage and SWG without compensating us in any form. GoW and WRT are still on the same tier. No defensive talent tier. SK (probably the only non offensive ability of a caster dps artifact) has a cast time on it. AoE has been further split between more abilities.

I don't like doing direct comparisons to other classes, and some changes Elemental got were great, but simply not enought to have a ground against Mages:

- every spec has access to block / barrier / cauterize (sprint added in Legion)
- every spec has ice floes and blink (arcane even has a reverse blink)

On top of every mage spec now having 3-4 rotational spells with 0-1 DPS CDs paired with different and balanced flavours to them.

[Menubrea]

Nothing to be discussed any further at this point tbh. I myself is already giving up. Maybe on future patch, elemental will get another nerf or no news at all like usual. It's elemental shaman we're talking about anyway. It just happen that I don't know how OP elemental is

Right you are, we just don't get how OP the spec really is to warrant another batch of nerfs to our spell coefficients, and our burst. Meanwhile Unholy DK's get sustained damage buffs, while having Arbiter crit for 300k with 730 ilevel on the PTR.

[gambit998]

Perhaps the problem is us comapairing ourselves to the other classes? (Just saying)

Blizz has gone forward with this class identity thing. it has been there catch phrase during everything leading up to Legion. Why dont we see if we can actually get some clarification as to what there design goal is because that would at least give us a scale as to what the hell they are doing. In Alpha when they where doing the class unveilings i was excited and dissapointed with the direction they where going (The 5 min Elemental pet route) Since then it has been changed and i cannot for the life of me find anything that says what there idea is?? I think this is more the frustration we are having as a community because we are resorting to in fighting over a point that is moot and only Blizz can answer. WHAT ARE YOU DOING WITH ELEMENTAL SHAMAN?

I am typing this knowing full well that the answer will never come to an easy question like this just as we have been asking for clarifications on abilities and talents and received no feedback but honestly it is a simple question. I didnt mind not being a top damage class in the past, when i was actually adding buffs, abilities to the raid i earned my spot in a raid because i knew what totem to drop when not only for personal damage but for a entire host of different mechanics. but times have changed and that is no longer the case. Now i have almost 0 raid utlility and my damage is crap... really Blizz how the hell will i get into a raid?? Just because i am a nice person? No i dont think so. (before someone mentions AG and windwalk. AG - 20 percent of crap spell coefficients is still crap output. Windwalk - Why bring a Elemental shaman when we can bring feral and guardian and enhancment to the raid that actually can fulfill there role.)

[mkultra55]

No one really knows how Blizzard judges class performance. But we know how players calculate it - in rare cases they implement player feedback. They have dedicated class designers (previously Watcher, Holinka, Celestalon and ckali or whatever). All of them have a degree of some sort, they say of themselves that they are dedicated gamers and love their jobs.

The question is now - why Elemental is treated like trash?.

There was a post earlier about how the devs seem to have trouble dealing with Overload and Elemental Fusion. I wonder if it's as simple as that. It reminded me of the torture playing a Resto Shaman in early Cata when they introduced Deep Healing.

[Kralljin]

I don't like doing direct comparisons to other classes, and some changes Elemental got were great, but simply not enought to have a ground against Mages:

Comparing any Class directly is wrong, but mages are simply one tier above anyone.

Mages are, in terms of their toolkit at least, superior to any ranged class.

Any other ranged class would have a skill like Ice floes and Blink on the same tier, Mages basically receive both as baseline, because the Tier with Ice floes is nonsense.

[Mcbenchpress]

I guess this thread isn't about Elemental anymore?

[Deleted]

I guess this thread isn't about Elemental anymore?

The last 7 posts along with the past 82 pages were about Elemental. Before you started to derail it of course.

[Deleted]

On the Internet, the host of the Forum usually decides this, since he provides the platform.

3/4 people understood it at least. Good enought quota for sarcasm.

Do you think I go out on the street and call for such things or why did you get that insulted over 1 out of like ~1000 similar lines I've posted in this thread alone?

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No one really knows how Blizzard judges class performance. But we know how players calculate it - in rare cases they implement player feedback. They have dedicated class designers (previously Watcher, Holinka, Celestalon and ckali or whatever). All of them have a degree of some sort, they say of themselves that they are dedicated gamers and love their jobs.

The question is now - why Elemental is treated like trash? If you'd ask me which spec deserved some kind of rework in Legion or WoD, I'd always say Elemental. Yet some other classes got major reworks, several even got their 2nd/3rd reworks and on top of this some specs got reworked out of nowhere. The idea of abilities with the sole purpose of buffing other abilities got scrapped 2 expansions ago, yet it is still somehow okay for Ele with Unleash Elements in WoD and SK in Legion. Why?

Not to mention that Elemental ended up with abilities, talents and traits which work against each other yet again. People call them "Lighting" or "Fire" builds, where I call this bullshit. Only one way will be the right one, and if you happen to progress raid on your Elemental, you'll be lucky getting even one set of gear before hunters or the other the other Shaman specs. On top of this "builds" clusterfuck we've level 100 talents which all favour different secondary stat setups.. Again???

They took away Shamanistic Rage and SWG without compensating us in any form. GoW and WRT are still on the same tier. No defensive talent tier. SK (probably the only non offensive ability of a caster dps artifact) has a cast time on it. AoE has been further split between more abilities.

I don't like doing direct comparisons to other classes, and some changes Elemental got were great, but simply not enought to have a ground against Mages:

- every spec has access to block / barrier / cauterize (sprint added in Legion)
- every spec has ice floes and blink (arcane even has a reverse blink)

On top of every mage spec now having 3-4 rotational spells with 0-1 DPS CDs paired with different and balanced flavours to them.

Summarises current state of Elemental problems. A++

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Cya nerd. Enjoy your ban.

[Infracted]

Ingenious post. My infraction was reversed, what about yours?

Going to show your posts to one of your guilds officers. Should be fun.

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Not worth arguing here. I started elemental recently and people said I should keep silent because I have no experience and never played shaman. I just read here now.

Lol, we both know that this discussion was very different to what you just described.

[FalcFalcFalc]

HES BACK. In any case, I am waiting a couple more builds to see if they make any changes. Buffs to our AOE won't cut it, I want single target buffs. If we don't get those, I'm swapping to Warlock. Lock isn't the greatest caster but with them being a pure and receiving love in the past, if they are shit they will get the necessary tweaks to become viable. An expansion of being toilet paper is all I can take and it appears that we are heading for another "You Eles don't know that you're actually OP" launch in Legion. History repeats itself, Blizzard bit off more than they could chew for the class revamps and once again, hybrid dpsers are getting the short end.