Will Legion be worse than WoD?

[Deathquoi]

you mean, like.... traits of the artifact wpn ?

I don't remember being able to unlock every talent in the old talent system, when was that possible?

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You have your opinion I have mine. They've had catch up mechanics for legendaries in the past two expansions too... they sucked and were totally inadequate. I think these will too. And why would I be out there killing thousands of mobs?

And sure you can do whatever you want, but why do the hard stuff when you can get the reward more quickly for doing the easy stuff? So it seems to me that we're likely to just be doing the Legion version of killing frogs on Timeless when we're below the cap and need to reach it.

Your opinion is based on a complete lack of understanding on how any of it works. It seems that way to you because you have no clue what you're talking about.

[Sinyc]

According to the beta testers they pretty much did a WoD meaning that they didnt listen to the community feedback on the beta forums, the tuning for the classes is waaaay of the charts and basically destroyed them. Meaning that you play WoW to have fun with your class and spec as the main posture and if it dosen't feel right, it can make the game feel worse. So there lies my question in the topic.

While I realize Legion will have more content than WoD did, why does Blizzard keep reinventing the wheel?

Just because they don't put/change every little thing that some kid with a YouTube account wants put in/changed DOES NOT mean they did not listen to feedback.

You guys should be lucky the DEV team would even publicly talk to such a toxic and ungrateful community.

[Niwes]

Legion will be WOD part 2 but with a few more negative exceptions like NOT being able to make gold from your garrisons anymore because Blizzard realised after 8 months that a tonne of players weren't paying with RL money for monthly subscriptions rather they were levelling alts and garrisons and grinding the gold missions.

The general rule of thumb is that WOW Players normally love and chase freebies and are generally tight asses.

Legion looks set to be the last expansion for WOW.

Players that have been playing for 5+ years and having no purpose in their life other than going into lock down on their computer for large hours of the day ignoring life, seasons, family, friends, education even eating and sleeping at times - i suggest you work on a hobbie or get a job - to help deal with the rehabilitation of re-entering society.

my nr1 for the dumbest-post-of-the-year award. thumbs up.

first: you didnt even realize blizz earns 5 bugs more than a sub, for every token sold on the ah. second: no, sorry, for the rest of that idiot post i do not even find a way to type anything in here.

[deffusse]

I'd like to see hit rating comming back into game, and also all vanila stats and char tree.. Why does it always have to be easier, why not harden the game a bit. Wow seems like a facebook farming game nowadays....

[Fleckens]

As a current beta tester, I feel as though this is a very real possibility. The ability prune alone has dumbed down pve to the point where it feels as though there is no longer a class to learn; and PvP has lost a lot of utility and CC's, making it very bland.

Honestly, could see legion being a bigger letdown than WoD. MMO characters should have more skills by default than a character in a MOBA (i understand that you can talent for more, but it does nothing for the learning curve and you are unable to get utility/CC back through talents. For a lot of classes they are simply gone.)

To clarify, ive been playing this game for quite some time and have no real intentions of stopping. I'm not trying to come across as a naysayer or give into the negative stigma. I was actually pretty hyped for Legion before getting into the Beta. Now it just seems like less depth to every character.

I think you kinda exaggerated the amount of pruning they did, on most classes you can still easily fill your bars with stuff you need, you just don't have as much of the very situational stuff that you did before. Some classes have definitely been made fairly simply, but even they can get some talents to make it more interesting. I'm just hoping they tune those talents slightly higher than the ones that simplify the rotation.

Also a lot of classes will still need things like focus macros and such, as shadow in legion I at least am kinda happy that I don't have more skills than I do as already got most of my bars filled up.

I'm fine with it going dungeons > normal > heroic. I'm not fine with the months long pause that has accompanied leveling an alt through the legendary system in each expansion, and I'm making the assumption that's going to continue based on the obvious fact that the artifact is an extension of the legendary system and the devs' comments that they want you to feel like you're invested in your main char by making switching specs/mains annoying. Their goal with adding this stuff, with making it harder to play an alt or gear on offspec, is pretty obviously to stretch the content out longer by wasting our time.

I'm also not making an assumption about random legendary world drops, which a new addition that sounds like it'll just take hours of killing mobs pointlessly.

The best case for these systems is that they are too easy to finish so they don't matter, but there's no way that's going to happen. Their whole purpose is to be a pain in the ass.

Legion is actually looking like it will be significantly easier to gear up alts due to there being many more ways of getting good gear than just raiding. I can definitely agree with it being a pain in WoD, I was considering playing warlock in legion for a while and decided to play it a bit on live, but getting geared up to do heroics raiding is really difficult atm due to the requirements for raids as well as it being very difficult to get gear outside of raiding. In legion you can now do world quests and dungeons to get gear, not to mention crafted gear no longer having a limit of 3 pieces.

As for the legendary, you don't get them from random mobs but rather from doing content, and the harder content as far as I know have a higher chance of dropping them. They are however one of the main worries I have for legion as well as it's gonna suck if you get to be the guy that only gets the useless ones, although it's actually not that different than a lot of trinkets and such. A lot of hellfire citadel trinkets are in fact a lot more of power boost than most of the legion legendaries are.

[Deleted]

Im sure Legion will be better but being better than WoD is not enough at this point since so many players have been burned out so badly. Blizzard has used up the loyalty of all but the biggest fan boys and that will show in the numbers that actually play Legion.

Ehm..... what?

Not sure if you've touched WoW lately, but WoD is atm swarming with new players, and servers are getting more populated by the day, sure this is just from what I've seen and not actual statistics but still, there is less than 15 mins of wait time at any level be it for dungeons or pvp, that is a very very healthy game :P

Also, loyalty has nothing to do with Legion being a good xpac and it making WoW alot richer content wise, because it is.

These forums.... While better than the offical ones, still filled to the brim with a bunch of people who no matter what blizzard does, will twist it negatively instead of just enjoying the game for what it is, and if you dont enjoy it anymore then leave, because no ammount of whining is going to change things, then 5 year olds would rule the world.

[Deathquoi]

I do understand, you're putting words in my mouth and making assumptions about what I do and don't know. You're not clairvoyant.

I don't have to be clairvoyant to know from what you've said that you have no understanding of how it works.

[Deleted]

I don't really have high hopes for Legion at all.

There's a lot more world content than in WoD, but class design is atrocious. I was under the impression that class design couldn't be any worse than it was in WoD; I was wrong.

This was my first impression as well, but after having spent hours upon hours on the PvP test realm (dont want to spoil outdoor content) I can honestly say, I get it now, the specs are alot more refined and they play miles better than live. Yes going into it from live was a dive off the deep end in changes, but now that I've given them a chance to grow on me, I actually prefer legion by alot compared to WoD.

[Deathquoi]

Welcome to my ignore list!

Good, you can ignore me just like you ignore any actual information about the game before you cry about it.

[Asotcha]

Just from watching youtube channels and twitch this expansion looks way better than WoD, so much so that I am actually tempted to come back. I left WoD quite early because it was just a horrible gaming experience. A few specs really do interest me and I am going to resub just to test the game play out with the pre-patch.

Legion is already so much better then WoD that most of my guild on the beta can't even bring themselves to play Live anymore. One of those guys is someone who says his excuses for not raiding are getting more and more exotic lol

[Natrii]

As a beta tester, The classes are fun. The questing is great, and the dungeons are really fun. Yes the class tunning is rather horrid at the moment, but also keep in mind that is quite literally one of the last things that is done. Getting the classes to flow and the content content fun to do is what the beta test is about, making sure everything works. The numbers are the easy part to fix at twards the end.

[LadyLisanna]

I have played Beta. It is fun. The Game is fun. THe only sucky part so far is acquiring the Artifact. After that it get fun again

[Sarevokcz]

The people who say classes or specs have been DESTROYED are being massively and needlessly dramatic about it. Having played everything over the last several weeks/months they're all fine, maybe not every little thing you liked is in every place it was but it works and you'll get used to it. Most people have some choices to be made in each spec to tweak how it plays, and hopefully Blizzard can keep things balanced enough that those choices remain relevant.

You may not like what they did to your spec, but good lord bring it down a little bit.

well they did destroy survival for me, thats about all I care...

[Niwes]

I don't remember being able to unlock every talent in the old talent system, when was that possible?

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oh, you mean less choice (the loss of the descission which talent to take and which not) makes things more interessting ? sorry, i cant take ppl like you serious in the slightest. you talk about how unexcited the old talent system was, in your sarcasm post, but at the same time you argument with that shit above ? sorry, no chance to ever take you serious.

[Fleckens]

well they did destroy survival for me, thats about all I care...

Aren't most of survival things just put into bm and mm instead? I think it was a pretty good idea to make survival a completely different spec than just a slightly different bm spec. Only issue with it is that it just adds even more melee to the game, which of course can be a bit of an issue in raiding.

[Deathquoi]

oh, you mean less choice (the loss of the descission which talent to take and which not) makes things more interessting ? sorry, i cant take ppl like you serious in the slightest. you talk about how unexcited the old talent system was, in your sarcasm post, but at the same time you argument with that shit above ? sorry, no chance to ever take you serious.

No, champ, my point is that there was no choice with the talent system. There were very few talents that you could switch around and actually change how you play. Comparing that to artifacts where the ultimate point is to unlock all of the traits is idiotic, but nice try.

[The Stormbringer]

I think specs can only go up from wod.

Whoever enjoyed wod specs is nuts.

How so...? I haven't had any problems with the specs in WoD so far, aside from some minor issues here and there, and Mistweaver, Destro Lock, and Elemental Shaman being nerfed.

The current BM Hunter spec in Legion is stupid. There is no consistent way to gain Focus, you instead have to wait on a CD and just... run around and auto-attack instead of actually being able to manage a real rotation after you blow your load of abilities.

[Moon-Man]

Legion is pretty good (except Order Halls, Copy/paste Garrisons really.), but not that good to pull me from FFXIV. I am a Beta tester as well.
I probably going to play legion, but as casual tops.

FFXIV offers so much more.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

According to the beta testers they pretty much did a WoD meaning that they didnt listen to the community feedback on the beta forums, the tuning for the classes is waaaay of the charts and basically destroyed them. Meaning that you play WoW to have fun with your class and spec as the main posture and if it dosen't feel right, it can make the game feel worse. So there lies my question in the topic.

While I realize Legion will have more content than WoD did, why does Blizzard keep reinventing the wheel?

According to which beta testers? The ones I know have been loving it.

[Fleckens]

In WoD it was really easy to gear during HFC, except for the Legendary. You could hit 100 and be 690 in a week through mythic dungeons. That was actually too fast in my opinion - dungeons dropped way too much gear. The problem, however, was that at 690 you needed to stop and wait for your legendary to catch up, which meant hours of easy content each week through months of time gating. My concern with Legion is it's going to be the same with the artifact. You're going to be pretty far behind if you don't play the same character and cap it each week, so even if you catch up on everything else, that part's going to suck.

With regards to the legendary drops, it's as I said earlier - the best case is that the drop rates are so high that you just get them quickly and don't have to worry about them. That's obviously not going to happen, and the people who end up missing them will also end up grinding frogs or whatever even if the drop rate is lower (because you can do it faster, and do it alone, and not worry about wiping). People always gravitate to doing things the easiest way possible, and when you make it possible to get the best rewards in the game by playing the easiest content in the game, that's what people are going to do. Murder frogs all day. Because they don't really care about the reward, or progression. They just want to get it over with because it's basically a requirement for the content they want to do.

Yeah 690-700 is easy to get, but you won't get far with that as most expect you to have at least 710-715 for heroic raids. Also with the artifact with the way artifact knowledge scales, catching up will be significantly easier. At launch and if you keep playing every day, artifact research will be 5 days per research, so a total of 125 days to get it to level 25. In comparison, someone joining much later will have most of the first ranks only require 1 day to research, it's a much stronger catch up mechanic than those we had for the ring.

And did you just not read my post or are you acting stupid on purpose? You do not get legendary as a drop from mobs, you get it from doing content. Do world quest, do pvp, do mythic dungeons, do raids, do what you prefer to do. Will there be a most efficient way to get them, sure there probably will be, but that won't really be relevant for anyone but the most hardcore raiders that want to make sure they got the correct legendary for the start of raiding, and it will still be doing content, not grinding mobs.