Arms Legion Discussion

[Rorke]

This Focused Rage playstyle is hilarious. I honestly can't wait until everyone gets to play it because the amount of hate it is going to get is going to force people to play Fury.

I can't not play Focused Rage. There's no way the other two garbage talents in that tier compete with it. Arms damage completely sucks without it.

[Warriorsarri]

Focused Rage is a horrible talent that never should have been implemented. In PvP it will only cause Arms to be nerfed, as its burst potential is too high, even with the PVP specific nerfs to it. It also has no competition in that tier, other than if you want to get two MS to get a three global burst, rather than two global burst.

In PvE it will lead to a really bad and downright hurtful playstyle that requires more key presses in a shorter window than either Glad or 5.4Fury. With FR you'll use 3 buttons per global every time you have Reck up, meaning you press 12-15 buttons in 5 seconds, depending on haste. If you take AM that means you have that window every 30 seconds, resulting in an APM at between 90 and 130.

In an ideal world this talent would have never seen the light of day, but as I doubt they'll remove it before launch I simply pray that it will never become the optimal talent.

[Rafalga]

is there any new about the execute rage calculation problem? tactician doesn't really feel like %35ish at all during exec phase

[Deleted]

I feel like the FR build has the potential to do insane damage if you get good RNG, but gets shit on if you don't get the CS resets. Fervor seems like a more consistent option tbh.

[Warriorsarri]

is there any new about the execute rage calculation problem? tactician doesn't really feel like %35ish at all during exec phase

Currently a bug where only the base cost of Execute counts toward Tactician, will be fixed as soon as they can be arsed.

[Deleted]

Focused Rage is a horrible talent that never should have been implemented.

My initial reaction to FR was much the same as this, it's clunky and down right awkward to use properly.

Having said that after forcing myself to spend time using FR I'm now getting consistently better results with it by some margin, however I will concede that that APM inside Battle Cry (or Reck if you still want to call it that) is an issue. To compensate for it I've had to adjust my keybinds slightly and use a couple of macros but I wouldn't describe it as a "bad and downright hurtful playstyle". Can certainly see why you (and many others) disparage it so much though.

[Beardyface]

Focused Rage is a horrible talent that never should have been implemented. In PvP it will only cause Arms to be nerfed, as its burst potential is too high, even with the PVP specific nerfs to it. It also has no competition in that tier, other than if you want to get two MS to get a three global burst, rather than two global burst.

In PvE it will lead to a really bad and downright hurtful playstyle that requires more key presses in a shorter window than either Glad or 5.4Fury. With FR you'll use 3 buttons per global every time you have Reck up, meaning you press 12-15 buttons in 5 seconds, depending on haste. If you take AM that means you have that window every 30 seconds, resulting in an APM at between 90 and 130.

In an ideal world this talent would have never seen the light of day, but as I doubt they'll remove it before launch I simply pray that it will never become the optimal talent.

They really should just replace it with this talent:

Heroic Strike:
Replaces the Slam icon and sound effect with the Heroic Strike Icon and sound effect. Does the exact same fucking thing Slam does, except now it doesn't sound like someone smacking someone else with a wet pool noodle.

[Archimtiros]

They really should just replace it with this talent:

Heroic Strike:
Replaces the Slam icon and sound effect with the Heroic Strike Icon and sound effect. Does the exact same fucking thing Slam does, except now it doesn't sound like someone smacking someone else with a wet pool noodle.

That's dumb.

On a serious note though, you can do this with an addon quite easily (or even manually without an addon).

[Beardyface]

That's dumb.

On a serious note though, you can do this with an addon quite easily (or even manually without an addon).

But is it the right kind of dumb? That's the question.

[Archimtiros]

But is it the right kind of dumb? That's the question.

It'd fit in with Outburst.

[Bytch]

I havent looked, but can any1 point me to the Artifact build that's currently working/viable/best?

[Cortic]

Arms needs the furious charge treatment allowing us to use victory rush following charge.

Also, something that's been bothering me for a while: why doesnot arms at least have the stronger version of bladestorm than fury? It's become damn iconic of the spec for 8 years. And why does fury get our corrupted blood artifact baseline as a talent in bloodbath? There's so SO much work to be done to differentiate the 2 specs it's insane. As it is, fury is arms but better. It brings the burst for pvp, the sustain for pve, the self heals, the utility, better mobility with a ranged aoe slow. What does arms have that fury doesn't?

Arms self healing, while levelling, has been OP imo. Second wind brings you to full health in seconds between pulls, and Victory Rush healing for 30% is crazy too. Fury on the other hand, even with the charge talent, has nowhere near the self healing, and makes me think that questing in Azsuna first for the fighter chow recipe is mandatory.

[Archimtiros]

Arms self healing, while levelling, has been OP imo. Second wind brings you to full health in seconds between pulls, and Victory Rush healing for 30% is crazy too. Fury on the other hand, even with the charge talent, has nowhere near the self healing, and makes me think that questing in Azsuna first for the fighter chow recipe is mandatory.

The big difference is that Arms requires the kill to heal and Fury doesn't. Especially once you start doing world quests, you'll see a marked difference in Fury's ability to survive by making smart use of healing in comparison to Arms sole 3m defensive CD. The longer the fight, the better Fury's survivability will be.

Against questing mobs, Victory Rush is strictly better than Bloodthirst heal, no doubt about it, but I don't believe the margin is big enough that Fury struggles, especially if you're going in with better than average gear.

[Gateway Ewok]

The big difference is that Arms requires the kill to heal and Fury doesn't. Especially once you start doing world quests, you'll see a marked difference in Fury's ability to survive by making smart use of healing in comparison to Arms sole 3m defensive CD. The longer the fight, the better Fury's survivability will be.

Against questing mobs, Victory Rush is strictly better than Bloodthirst heal, no doubt about it, but I don't believe the margin is big enough that Fury struggles, especially if you're going in with better than average gear.

Arms self healing, while levelling, has been OP imo. Second wind brings you to full health in seconds between pulls

You're disregarding Second Wind.

[Archimtiros]

You're disregarding Second Wind.

No I'm not. Second Winds activation time is prohibitive for normal engagements unless you only group mobs up and AoE it down. That is certainly a strategy, but not always a very good, or even possible one, it's also something that Fury excels at just as good if not better than Arms.

Consider as well that Second Winds healing actually isn't that great. 6%/s is nice, but even normal (non buff) food provides approximately 5%/s and it doesn't have an activation time, so in truth, the only real benefit of Second Wind is that you can continue moving while waiting for the activation time/healing... but going 6s+ between engagements much less moving for 6s+ between engagements is very unlikely. If you're not actively moving the whole time you'd actually have less downtime simply eating for 2-3s and move to the next immediate pull rather than waiting for Second Wind to kick in.

The only place Second Wind is really of any use is if you're taking periodic damage while long distances, such as falling/aggro/incidental damage while moving from point to point, or if you for some reason have considerable downtime between pulls, which if you're aiming for efficient leveling, you should not.

Finally, it also has nothing to do with the main point that was being made, which is that Fury's healing provides in-combat sustain, which excels against strong individual enemies (rares, etc), and is something that Arms has no tool for.

[Deleted]

We need to take to account that fury NEEDS better selfhealing as they take more damage during Enrage

[Artunias]

Fury needs Victory Rush and Arms needs Touch of Zakajz in a much more reachable place, and perhaps buffed just a small bit.

[Deleted]

Fury needs Victory Rush and Arms needs Touch of Zakajz in a much more reachable place, and perhaps buffed just a small bit.

Touch swapped with Tactical Advance would be nice ^^

[Archimtiros]

We need to take to account that fury NEEDS better selfhealing as they take more damage during Enrage

No we really don't, and no it really doesn't. The increased health is the offset to damage taken, not self-healing.

- - - Updated - - -

Fury needs Victory Rush and Arms needs Touch of Zakajz in a much more reachable place, and perhaps buffed just a small bit.

They really don't. Touch of Zakajz is almost inconsequential, and it's one of the few reasons going down that bottom row of traits is worthwhile at all. As much as I dislike spending AP on worthless talents like Tactical Advance, there is pacing to consider.

Fury gets along fine without Victory Rush. You just need to be smart about how you pull and play. It's pretty obvious from having leveled multiple classes that you aren't simply supposed to pull 8 mobs at a time and AoE them down, they've removed a lot of self healing/sustainment tools because they want to institute more downtime (yes, this even applies to Arms, since Arms needs to be able to use Victory Rush on targets sequentially to heal).

Fury gets along fine without Victory Rush. I don't know how else to explain this except to say that it quite simple does. I've leveled up two of them from 100 with starter gear, and had very little problems. Yes, there is some downtime, there can be downtime on a lot of specs, including DK's (who have great survivability tools) or Arms Warriors; and while I do think that Arms self-healing is strictly better, it's hardly by a large enough margin that Fury isn't effective for leveling.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have Victory Rush, but that hardly makes it "necessary". If anything, Arms is the one hurt more by its lack of in-combat sustain.

[Flacko]

Focused Rage is a horrible talent that never should have been implemented. In PvP it will only cause Arms to be nerfed, as its burst potential is too high, even with the PVP specific nerfs to it. It also has no competition in that tier, other than if you want to get two MS to get a three global burst, rather than two global burst.

In PvE it will lead to a really bad and downright hurtful playstyle that requires more key presses in a shorter window than either Glad or 5.4Fury. With FR you'll use 3 buttons per global every time you have Reck up, meaning you press 12-15 buttons in 5 seconds, depending on haste. If you take AM that means you have that window every 30 seconds, resulting in an APM at between 90 and 130.

In an ideal world this talent would have never seen the light of day, but as I doubt they'll remove it before launch I simply pray that it will never become the optimal talent.

This..
Exactly agree!