Do you feel all classes are being dumbed down with each expac that comes out?

[Istaria]

Yes, there were major dumbdowns.
Prime examples but by far not the only ones is the suppression of DOT snapshotting, the suppression of many subtleties such as when to best use CDs/procs, mostly no more mana/resource management.
In PVP also the game has become much less interesting and it is harder and harder to differentiate between an outstanding and a good player. I'll let you watch Cdew's stream or other world-class PVPers that can go into much more details than I.

[Deleted]

I love how people who don't play arcane claim they are a 2 button spec. First off, they use three (Arcane Blast, Missiles, and Barrage) regularly, and the interplay between those abilities and their mana/mastery makes them one of the harder specs in the game.

I’ve played them and many friends who play even make fun of their own spec because it is pretty much a 2-3 button rotation. I don’t think that’s bad, the retarded part is they can top meters easily doing that. It’s not one of the "harder" specs.

[Deleted]

I’ve played them and many friends who play even make fun of their own spec because it is pretty much a 2-3 button rotation. I don’t think that’s bad, the retarded part is they can top meters easily doing that. It’s not one of the "harder" specs.

There is a difference between being 5th in recount from 5 mages and 5 in recount and first of all 5 mages.

I play mostly hunter (99% of the time). In vanilla our rotation was aimed - multi, in TBC - 1 macro, in wotlk - click chimera/aimed on cd, rest of the time spam steady (KC was binded with macro). Finnaly in cata it started to req some brain, how to manage ur focus etc, not only clicking 1-2-3. There is a way more depth in rotation than lower xpacs.

[ExtremelyCrusty]

Yes. dasdsdfsdf

[RedGamer030]

Some classes still have intricacies within their play-style, and some can easily Talent for it.

[Gaidax]

I feel that players are getting dumbed down with each expac that comes out.

[Turtel]

I started playing during WoD and from what I've seen from the PTR, all hunter specs seem to be getting much more difficult to play than their WoD versions (and this is without even having artifacts on the PTR), in the sense that it's very easy to make mistakes that will significantly negatively impact your DPS. One example with MM is the small window of the Vulnerability debuff (using the Patient Sniper talent) where if you accidentally use one extra Aimed Shot (or if you lag) then the Vulnerability debuff will drop off and your next Marked Shot (to reapply Vulnerability) will do significantly less damage than it would have if you didn't make that mistake. Another example from Survival is the 8 second buff (Way of the Mok'nathal) that requires you to use Raptor Strike (a focus inefficient skill) 4 times in order to apply 4 stacks, and then keep using Raptor Strike to maintain the buff, but if you miss a Raptor Strike by even a fraction of second then the entire 4 stacks will drop off, requiring you to use Raptor Strike 4 times again; this is an extremely vicious punishment that doesn't leave ANY wiggle room for mistakes.

In WoD, the rotation is extremely forgiving, a couple of casts of Cobra Shot/Steady Shot will fix any mistake you make (unless of course you misclick your cooldowns at the wrong time) for a minimal loss of DPS (if any at all).

[jettzypher]

My opinion is that some 'dumbing' has existed in the past, but I personally feel that the changes to classes in Legion serve more to tighten up the abilities of any given class. There are far fewer filler abilities and less generic options, with more emphasis being placed on things specific to the specialization as a whole.

[wowaccounttom]

and its not only classes... as i have tested the beta, i have slowly seen them nerf boss abilities in dungeons to the point that today our healer said it was a joke compared to a few months ago.

and i have to agree... 5m dungeons were hard... now, its like stepping into rfc at level 100

[papajohn4]

I'll pass, I'm just trying to stick 1 dw (mnk), one physical ranged (mch), and one 2-hander (drg) classes. I'll make another exception if they ever do a proper plate dps class or if we get freebie level 60s.

Also, holy hell, I tried unholy (I'll be sticking with frost but will unlock unholy weapon shit later on in Legion) on the PTR and that really is a 2-3 attack button class. Still fun and I'm quite sure its more complicated than that with macros.

Hehe i did something similar... 1 tank (paladin) 1 melee dps(ninja) 1healer(scholar) and 1 caster(summoner) .

I tried paladin (wow) on ptr and cant used to the new animations why they made new animations for old models? Maybe i ll get used to them and feel better but for now it feels very weird

[Lilija]

I feel that players are getting dumbed down with each expac that comes out.

I tend to have a very similar feeling. Especially when I spent too much time on wow forums

[Birgwow]

I'd argue that classes have never been dumbed down, but rather become more refined with every expansion. It's become easier to do decent for people with little knowledge of the game, but if you want to perform at the best of your potential it's not. I feel like the changes they do mostly remove the clunkiness (shaman mandatory totems, stance dance, rng) while still keeping potential for a complex rotation.

[Lilija]

I'd argue that classes have never been dumbed down, but rather become more refined with every expansion. It's become easier to do decent for people with little knowledge of the game, but if you want to perform at the best of your potential it's not. I feel like the changes they do mostly remove the clunkiness (shaman mandatory totems, stance dance, rng) while still keeping potential for a complex rotation.

Couldn't agree more I think that people who think playing classes is easier just don't see all aspects of the game. The number of buttons to push says nothing about complexity of a spec.

[Kuja]

For sure. Removing most of talent trees is a great example of dumbing down by giving less choices and less customization for players.

[infinitemeridian]

For sure. Removing most of talent trees is a great example of dumbing down by giving less choices and less customization for players.

But the new talent trees offer more choice than ever before.

[IBZ]

It's not a customization if end game content need the most efficiency way to do it anyway. In BC I use to do 51/0/0 to meet curator in karazan which immune to arcane.

After that my friend taught me to google the best build and never change until end of the style of talent.

[Brewhan]

I play a mage and looking at the Legion changes makes me sad. Is it just mage or is it all classes? It's just no fun.

after playing all the classes on beta yea nothing is really difficult or exciting game play. The most fun I had was with the class hall campaign story though which is probably what will you give the biggest class feeling as well. The rotation of 3-5 buttons for dps/healer/tank, 2-3 buttons for utility and 0 buffs won't be exciting.

[Justpassing]

Well...my rotation in TBC was:

Curse of Elements -> Shadow Bolt till OOM -> Life Tap -> Shadow Bolt

And tab Seed of Corruption on Hyjal trash.


So all in all I'd say Legion is, still, an improvement over TBC.

[Lilija]

Well...my rotation in TBC was:

Curse of Elements -> Shadow Bolt till OOM -> Life Tap -> Shadow Bolt

And tab Seed of Corruption on Hyjal trash.


So all in all I'd say Legion is, still, an improvement over TBC.

Exactly. I had to press moonfire at the start of the fight and then spam starfire the whole fight. Like litterarly, 1 button spam.

[Deleted]

Oh, cc was soooo hard. Ever tried doing dungeons w/o CC?


As a moonkin I've done it as well. And it required... doing dps. Actually that was easier than dealing with anything else on that boss.


That just ment you had crappy tanks. Aggro is not a dps mechanic - it's tank mechanic.

- - - Updated - - -


High DPS = high aggro

Nope.

Not really about that and I'm saying this from POV of someone who actually tanked with Warlock some AQ40 and Karazhan among others. It was mostly done due to certain combinations of talents and class abilities being extremely good. With Searing Pain on warlock you didn't have to do a lot of DPS to have high aggro because SP had an in built higher modifier for aggro.

On a side not it's good that days of watching OMEN and similar mods for threat are over.