New Motion Comic - Nightborne

[Zulkhan]

Pesky blood elves always trying to weasel their way past the worship thing to get the power ;P

Heh, to be fair:

"The storm could grow to be a mighty weapon either through sustained worship of Elune, or charged by spiritual energies of the fallen.

Looking down upon the newly revealed ghosts of Elune's disciples, you reason that you have neither the time, nor the inclination to worship the goddess of your enemy...."

http://wow.gamepedia.com/Quest:Firestarter

can't blame the Blood Elves here :P

that's not entirely how it worked. there's three alters that you present your gifts to, at each alter you gain a boon that i would assume is from elune. she knows you're dicking around there and doesn't do anything to prevent you from taking out her loyal worshipers. she actually kinda helps you by buffing you.

You dick around killing Satyrs, Elune's despised enemy, that's why she buffs you. The blessings you receive while doing that are kinda unrelated with the main progression of the chain. The power used later to level Nijel's Point wasn't willingly granted by Elune.

[derpkitteh]

You dick around killing Satyrs, Elune's despised enemy, that's why she buffs you. The blessings you receive while doing that are kinda unrelated with the main progression of the chain. The power used later to level Nijel's Point wasn't willingly granted by Elune.

she's a goddess, apparently with the foresight to know azeroth is special and choose a race upon her.

certainly she can sense your intentions in the area.

[roahn the warlock]

What is this thing with Blizzard where they create enemies who have supposedly seen all possible outcomes and foresee only their victory only to end up dying/defeated?

Off the top of my head:
Algalon
Deathwing/Most of his minions
Muruzond
Garrosh

Technically she's right, they will endure. She won't, some will.

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she's a goddess, apparently with the foresight to know azeroth is special and choose a race upon her.

certainly she can sense your intentions in the area.

She's not omnipotent. She has actually acted quite rashly in the past.

[Zulkhan]

certainly she can sense your intentions in the area.

I don't know how the player's intentions could be "sensed" honestly. Fact is, the player did nothing wrong most of the time and even purged Elune's shrine of the Satyr's presence. She may be a goddess but there's little she could judge apart your actions anyway.

[derpkitteh]

She's not omnipotent. She has actually acted quite rashly in the past.

idk, i still think she'd be able to know what you're gonna do, or take her power away when she sees what you're going to do.

she can interact with the world directly, we've seen it personally when she cures the satyr. don't understand why she wouldn't be able to take her power back.

[A dot Ham]

Story itself was interesting but god damn i hate this modern art style. It's so bland and messy. Hopefully we can get all the lore of the nightborne in-game.

I don't know how "modern" it is. Comics have been using it for a while a now. I remember several Aliens, Predators, and X-Men comics from the 90s that utilized a similar style.

[ravenmoon]

Pesky blood elves always trying to weasel their way past the worship thing to get the power ;P

i wonder if it mattered that the person who's research you continue was an Elf, it could be the system works off the Elven dna, which high/blood elves will definitely have at their core... unlike satyr and naga. So a blood elf would qualify. And the weapon is a device, it's not actually the goddess herself, but it may have been locked for an Elven user, and once an elf utilise it, then it can work, and anyone can complete the process.

It could also mean in the broader sense - in that, if all natural creatures are Elune's creation then only those modified by demons or old gods ( like naga/satyr) would be "enemies of Elune" ... enemies of Elune is not exclusively enemies of night elves ... despite what the blood elf may think and device usable by any Azeroth or Elune created being. THe night elves being custodians of such a device.

[Rhlor]

i wonder if it mattered that the person who's research you continue was an Elf, it could be the system works off the Elven dna, which high/blood elves will definitely have at their core... unlike satyr and naga. So a blood elf would qualify. And the weapon is a device, it's not actually the goddess herself, but it may have been locked for an Elven user, and once an elf utilise it, then it can work, and anyone can complete the process.

It could also mean in the broader sense - in that, if all natural creatures are Elune's creation then only those modified by demons or old gods ( like naga/satyr) would be "enemies of Elune" ... enemies of Elune is not exclusively enemies of night elves ... despite what the blood elf may think and device usable by any Azeroth or Elune created being. THe night elves being custodians of such a device.

Tae'thelan and the Reliquary are in Suramar to research ancient Highborne artifacts, no doubt many blood elves still have connection with their past

as a fan of the elves I hope that in the end all elves meet in Suramar to combat against the legion

[ravenmoon]

Tae'thelan and the Reliquary are in Suramar to research ancient Highborne artifacts, no doubt many blood elves still have connection with their past
http://i.imgur.com/SxMWAvp.jpg
as a fan of the elves I hope that in the end all elves meet in Suramar to combat against the legion

you and Mace seem to be really into that, but it's a pipedream I don't think will happen. I use to feel like that, I was never as big a horde fan, nor alliance which i preferred more as much as I Was an elf fan, and I use to long for that, but blizzard gave no signs of it - I felt the elves should be standing on their own, or at least be a major force independent or the human alliance or orcish horde, but it never happened.

My last hope was when the highborne came out of isolation, i was expecting to hear a lot on how the blood elves and high elves would react to the highborne, hoping for a highborne led initiative to unite the two elven groups - feeling that at least the blood elves would be in awe of the highborne but the night elves would be a little bit harder to come round but it would be a work in progress --- and nothing happen.

I realised as with many things that i was trying to force my own narrative, and this was not what blizzard was doing, so i gave up on that pipe dream and instead I just follow the evidence, and decided i would appreciate what they are doing. Blizzard wants a two faction system, they want distinct races on either side with counters to each other. They're not changing that system no matter how much I wanted it, because they like it that way, so everything they do is going to have to fit into that mould. No use me dreaming for independent elves - rather follow what I think blizzard wants, what they're actually showing, not what I'm wishing, based on that i can make projections and hopes along that model, rather than against it. Now I kinda like the night elves and day elves on opposite sides with contrasting themes etc, rather than forming some Elf union as you and mace are hoping for. It's actually kinda nice... I don't like the blood elves face rolling the night elves like that, so I'm thinking the nightborne are going to be that high arcane element to plug that hole in the night elven ranks - and i think blizzard are kinda making the night elves and blood elves contrasting opposites. Usually on opposite sides, but can come together for big threats, forever (for the forseeable future) being two separate sides - competing when in the horde anad alliance, but having the unusual rare aligning for threats that go beyond their dislike for each other.

it's kinda nice that, because this way, both groups can excel, but they also keep each other in check. You no longer have the night elves super powered, then really bad, now reinvigorated by nightborne return they can hold their own against the blood elves. The way I see it, the nightborne reunited with the night elves, creates an acceleration and an advantage for the night elves, but the blood elves after a couple of defeats, redouble and catch up (high elf re-union?) and this way you can write the elves forward because when one group goes ahead, the other can always peg them back without having to write that humans or orcs had to peg them back.

That's my thinking anyway.

[Rhlor]

you and Mace seem to be really into that, but it's a pipedream I don't think will happen. I use to feel like that, I was never as big a horde fan, nor alliance which i preferred more as much as I Was an elf fan, and I use to long for that, but blizzard gave no signs of it - I felt the elves should be standing on their own, or at least be a major force independent or the human alliance or orcish horde, but it never happened.

My last hope was when the highborne came out of isolation, i was expecting to hear a lot on how the blood elves and high elves would react to the highborne, hoping for a highborne led initiative to unite the two elven groups - feeling that at least the blood elves would be in awe of the highborne but the night elves would be a little bit harder to come round but it would be a work in progress --- and nothing happen.

I realised as with many things that i was trying to force my own narrative, and this was not what blizzard was doing, so i gave up on that pipe dream and instead I just follow the evidence, and decided i would appreciate what they are doing. Blizzard wants a two faction system, they want distinct races on either side with counters to each other. They're not changing that system no matter how much I wanted it, because they like it that way, so everything they do is going to have to fit into that mould. No use me dreaming for independent elves - rather follow what I think blizzard wants, what they're actually showing, not what I'm wishing, based on that i can make projections and hopes along that model, rather than against it. Now I kinda like the night elves and day elves on opposite sides with contrasting themes etc, rather than forming some Elf union as you and mace are hoping for. It's actually kinda nice... I don't like the blood elves face rolling the night elves like that, so I'm thinking the nightborne are going to be that high arcane element to plug that hole in the night elven ranks - and i think blizzard are kinda making the night elves and blood elves contrasting opposites. Usually on opposite sides, but can come together for big threats, forever (for the forseeable future) being two separate sides - competing when in the horde anad alliance, but having the unusual rare aligning for threats that go beyond their dislike for each other.

it's kinda nice that, because this way, both groups can excel, but they also keep each other in check. You no longer have the night elves super powered, then really bad, now reinvigorated by nightborne return they can hold their own against the blood elves. The way I see it, the nightborne reunited with the night elves, creates an acceleration and an advantage for the night elves, but the blood elves after a couple of defeats, redouble and catch up (high elf re-union?) and this way you can write the elves forward because when one group goes ahead, the other can always peg them back without having to write that humans or orcs had to peg them back.

That's my thinking anyway.

I love the concept of demon hunters, they are proof that can be achieved have a union of the Elves



they are not horde and alliance, are Illidari!! the most feared enemies of the legion. I hope demon hunters can talk to each other that would be very nice

[ravenmoon]

I love the concept of demon hunters, they are proof that can be achieved have a union of the Elves

they are not horde and alliance, are Illidari!! the most feared enemies of the legion. I hope demon hunters can talk to each other that would be very nice

Yeah, I liked that too, but alas it's only going to be the exception rather than the norm. Remember when it was blood elves and draenei working together in TBC after starting fighting, they end up being friends, that was nice, but nothing's really come of it. Because of wow's two faction system.

I've heard talk of aksing blizzard to be more race orientated than faction orientated. Really bump the identity of the races.. because when you count all their sub-races, races themselves are mini-factions of their own.. in fact that was how it was shaping up in WC3, a new race meant a new faction - so when we saw 8 races for wow, one was thinking 8 factions - but alas it was two.

The hope is that with a more race orientated focus, or at least race playing a prominent role like how classes are doing in Legion, race gets their own order halls mace was saying, this would raise racial identity and significane to the point where a lot of matters were race specific - and you would be experiencing them with regards to your own race, - if the class hall experience is like 10% of your questing experience, race can be another 10-15%, while the main expansion theme is like a good 50% and faction conflict is like 25%

Everyone experiences the same faction conflict and expansion theme ofc - but the race experience gives a race significance to everything that is going on in the new expansion zone and even the faction conflict. So you get to see what's happening with your race with regards to the new threat, its ambitions, more of its internal politics with its sub-factions and sub/alt races then ofc it's main enemies and friends.

In this scenario you may have been able to see a bit more blood elf and draenei corporation even though alliance and horde are enemies and generally hate each other, you don't necessarily have to have every race in one hate every race in the other, in fact a race in one faction can like a race in another faction more than it likes some of the races in its own faction - you can explore all of that nuance. With the advent of the Illidari you could even show some night elf/blood elf healing.. or you could show them still annoyed with each other, but the Illidari kinda being the common ground which causes them to work together more often than not and develop a mutual respect - atm there isn't a mutual respect - the blood elves think the night elves are rubbish and easily beat them, when that changes and they become a difficult challenge they can work out their bitterness and gain mutual respect.

The point with a racial focus you can show a lot of this stuff.. meanwhile for the main horde alliance thing - predominantly human on orc or worgen on forsaken - but ofc you will see npcs from all the different races in and out of that participation, sometimes the faction conflict can grow a bit more, the race quests can always shed light on how the different races are reacting or getting involved in the faction conflict, blizzard can show what night elves think of the squabbling or what blood elves feel about it - some races would be enthusiastic when it comes to killing Orcs or killing Elves, but when it comes to killing Tauren or killing Draenei less enthusiastic.

CAn you imagine the nuance if we had playable night elf worgen sub race and vampiric forsaken elf joining the worgen v forsaken conflict - it has so much potential.. but sigh.

[Wildmoon]

idk, i still think she'd be able to know what you're gonna do, or take her power away when she sees what you're going to do.

she can interact with the world directly, we've seen it personally when she cures the satyr. don't understand why she wouldn't be able to take her power back.

The mechanic was there to grant the power to anyone who does what's required. I don't think Elune was watching over that one specific place of worship. It was a system. It was not sentient.

[Mace]

The mechanic was there to grant the power to anyone who does what's required. I don't think Elune was watching over that one specific place of worship. It was a system. It was not sentient.

exactly, like a machine.

[Wildmoon]

I don't like the blood elves face rolling the night elves like that, so I'm thinking the nightborne are going to be that high arcane element to plug that hole in the night elven ranks - and i think blizzard are kinda making the night elves and blood elves contrasting opposites. Usually on opposite sides, but can come together for big threats, forever (for the forseeable future) being two separate sides - competing when in the horde anad alliance, but having the unusual rare aligning for threats that go beyond their dislike for each other.

I don't know. The Blood Elves are not strong enough to facerolle anyone. They are struggling with their problems themselves within the horde.

[Rhlor]

Yeah, I liked that too, but alas it's only going to be the exception rather than the norm. Remember when it was blood elves and draenei working together in TBC after starting fighting, they end up being friends, that was nice, but nothing's really come of it. Because of wow's two faction system.

I've heard talk of aksing blizzard to be more race orientated than faction orientated. Really bump the identity of the races.. because when you count all their sub-races, races themselves are mini-factions of their own.. in fact that was how it was shaping up in WC3, a new race meant a new faction - so when we saw 8 races for wow, one was thinking 8 factions - but alas it was two.

The hope is that with a more race orientated focus, or at least race playing a prominent role like how classes are doing in Legion, race gets their own order halls mace was saying, this would raise racial identity and significane to the point where a lot of matters were race specific - and you would be experiencing them with regards to your own race, - if the class hall experience is like 10% of your questing experience, race can be another 10-15%, while the main expansion theme is like a good 50% and faction conflict is like 25%

Everyone experiences the same faction conflict and expansion theme ofc - but the race experience gives a race significance to everything that is going on in the new expansion zone and even the faction conflict. So you get to see what's happening with your race with regards to the new threat, its ambitions, more of its internal politics with its sub-factions and sub/alt races then ofc it's main enemies and friends.

In this scenario you may have been able to see a bit more blood elf and draenei corporation even though alliance and horde are enemies and generally hate each other, you don't necessarily have to have every race in one hate every race in the other, in fact a race in one faction can like a race in another faction more than it likes some of the races in its own faction - you can explore all of that nuance. With the advent of the Illidari you could even show some night elf/blood elf healing.. or you could show them still annoyed with each other, but the Illidari kinda being the common ground which causes them to work together more often than not and develop a mutual respect - atm there isn't a mutual respect - the blood elves think the night elves are rubbish and easily beat them, when that changes and they become a difficult challenge they can work out their bitterness and gain mutual respect.

The point with a racial focus you can show a lot of this stuff.. meanwhile for the main horde alliance thing - predominantly human on orc or worgen on forsaken - but ofc you will see npcs from all the different races in and out of that participation, sometimes the faction conflict can grow a bit more, the race quests can always shed light on how the different races are reacting or getting involved in the faction conflict, blizzard can show what night elves think of the squabbling or what blood elves feel about it - some races would be enthusiastic when it comes to killing Orcs or killing Elves, but when it comes to killing Tauren or killing Draenei less enthusiastic.

CAn you imagine the nuance if we had playable night elf worgen sub race and vampiric forsaken elf joining the worgen v forsaken conflict - it has so much potential.. but sigh.

the blood elves and draenei are allies in WoD


And I also see the elves work together in Trueshot Lodge (hunter hall)

[ravenmoon]

I don't know. The Blood Elves are not strong enough to facerolle anyone. They are struggling with their problems themselves within the horde.

It's an odd one wow, when you think about it, no one should be strong enough to do anything after all they've been through and yet the sides keep doing stuff, and if you look at what they show with the blood elves then with the night elves, you do see contrasting fortunes. We haven't seen army against army full scale on, but it is significant that everytime blood elves have met night elves in wow, they've completely outdone them, outsmarted them and utilised their strengths against them. To me, the evidence is showing blood elves currently of superior calibre. They are doing better than the Nelves, they are actually winning a lot more than they, and they seem to be a lot more driven.

It's not a criticism of them, they are portrayed as strong, very bright, innovative and very determined and they get results, especially against night elves. Now in another topic there was a huge discussion that felt a bit like an argument about night elven numbers - we have no idea what they are so if we were to do army against army who knows. Night elves lost a lot during the 3rd war, it caused them to need to join the alliance, and every time they have been shown, they have been overwhelmed and needing rescued, barely escaped or badly beating.

I use to want to think of night elves as this amazing group and would take pains to explain to you how they were out manned here, or overwhelmed here, or this group didn't get there in time or that group wasn't present otherwise they would have succeeded - I was kidding myself, that was what I wanted to think but the evidence was showing otherwise. These days I've decided you enjoy wow a lot more by just accepting what they show you because it is there story, and try and figure out what is going. Night elves weren't the super strong, incredibly wizened and well skilled beings I had thought they were, at least not to the extent I had. They were been shown consistently over and over again to be a lot more modest, and a lot weaker than I was wishing.

WoW is not warcraft 3, whatever impressions I got about them from there, well their fortunes changed. I'm not confident night elves could hold up against a blood elf army, I really don't think they have enough. They've been shown to be completely overwhelmed everywhere - where are all the forces they supposedly had when it came crunch time in Ashenvale, Azshara, Stonetalon - it was pitiful - and they were routed (Azshara), beaten (Ashenvale), bombed (stonetalon) - i didn't see huge armies anywhere, they needed the humans and alliance to come in at stonetalon mountain or they'd been completely over-run by the horde, they don't have enough to match up against Orcs

Then I realized something - I'd been completely over-estimating them, and so have many of us, they're not some huge force, and special snowflake at all, they had their high moments ages ago, and now they're relic - a relic I hope blizzard will restore because that would just be awesome, They have no huge numbers coming out of the woodwork either - see Shalandris Isles, see Ashenvale, see Azshara, stonetalon, desolace - where are the huge numbers?

In Legion I haven't seen one report of huge night elf numbers in an army at all, they weren't even in the broken shore campaign until a recent build where they added some night elf sentinels. I'm not kidding when I say the night elves are in need of the strength the nightborne have, and on beta people have been pointing this out, the nightborne need the night elves' druids and priests to fix that magic corruption and the night elves need the proper magical strength of the nightborne seeing how the handful of highborne from Eldre'thalas were no where enough to gain any victories, but probably were the reason the night elves weren't annihilated completely.

Now I don't have any confidence that the night elves will ever be like the blood elves are now or ever be anything remotely like what they use to be pre-sundering or even pre-3rd war they don't have those numbers even if the nightborne add to them I think (but really don't know), it would take years to replenish. I'm hoping that maybe the nightborne's arrival might be a new beginning, a start of recovery --- an excellent post was written about this in beta. But it's only a hope. And I hope very hard, but it won't make anything happen - they can just as easily make nightborne neutral, hate the night elves, or join the blood elves and the horde, or just destroy them completely. They don't have to give a night elf recovery, they don't have to restore them, they have been tragedy central every time you meet them. Night elves suffering some great disaster or the other, the difference is you don't see them really recovering. I know others have sufffered too, but I'm seeing recovery signs, which is good. Hoping this would be a big recovery start for nelves, but i'm not banking on it.

If I'm honest to you, I think they'll just tank, so whiles i'm hoping, I'm not setting my expectations at all. I actually equally consider that nightborne would have nothing to do with night elves or not be written into their story, or unite or play a key role to each other, but would either be destroyed or as most of you expect go to the blood elves even though I think that would be a waste and just doesn't fit, but hey , lots of things that don't fit happened already in wow, a lot of nice or neat things that could have happened didn't, - but they also keep doing cool things so we keep playing.

Frankly I have learnt just to enjoy what they give, and whatever they give, I'll probably enjoy it and follow it. Might get excited about it if it's nice. I was really excited they finally got to show an arcane night elf culture - i've been writing tons of threads about this and one day seeing it, and finally i do, even if these nightborne i view as night elf version 2.0 end up choosing not to associate with night elf version 1, at least I got to see it, and it looked amazing - Suramar is what the night elves built, and the nightborne kept it going instead of falling to ruin like the Shen'drelar Highborne did with Eldre'thalas and like the demons and the sundering did with the rest of their cities. In effect my wow dream came true with Legion - it shall be my last expansion too most likely - unless some amazing story development or game tech development occurs, but I don't know, I may still pop on and catch up.. who knows.

I just enjoy it now, rather than try to force things. Doesn't stop me from hoping or seeing hopeful potential. I really think on magical issues nightborne and blood elf magisters would be on par - they won't know the same things, i think the nightborne mages would have extensive knowledge about a lot of things lost something only other living highborne and moonguard might match - that seems like a huge advantage, but then you remember that blood elves have made some outstanding progress too, all the things they learnt in the Netherstorm, they have come into contact and mastered technologies the nightborne and highborne night elves are completely unaware of, they have new knowledge and huge amounts of it, making up or at least countering the vast knowledge advantage nightborne/highborne may have - remember Kael'thas best and brightest scholars and magisters defected - these guys were probably the ones that cracked the naaru tech and were at the cutting edge of the blood elves research before on seeing the burning legion fascination Kael'thas was going down combined with the visions and dreams of A'dal - made a u-turn.

I think with nightborne teaming up with the rest of the night elves (cos they're too isolated by themselves, only a city - they'll need the rest of the nelves not just for healing but to supplement integration), the first few hostile exchanges whenever they occur, if they occur would swing the night elves way because of this advantage, this would cause the blood elves to tight up, and start calling on some their own newly learnt knowledge and the playing field will even up. All the nightborne have atm are mages, the rest of the night elves could fill in as a counter to the other blood elf institutions like their priests/blood knights - matching against the priesthood of elune altho night elves don't have paladins, the farstriders can meet with the hunteresses and possibly druids although most druids are neutral, it's probably going to be the huntresses and rogue scouts, - sort of making them kinda matched like for like.

this is one of the reasons why nightborne on the horde with the blood elves is not that great an idea - Suramar feels more of a counter to Silvermoon, nightwell to the sunwell, night elf to blood elf, night to day, moon/stars to sun. the day and the night a separated - it feels weird if they team up. People have been pointing this out already. But hey blizz can do what they want. Frankly I agree with those who feel the nightborne's arrival is a boost for the night elf group. It's nice to see something amazing and different coming from the night elves, at long last we see the arcane civilization in its fullness - at least one city that survived. Should be a joyous occassion to many night elves who came from that city, and vice versa after all the Legion nastiness is done, and Thalyssra and Lunastre are in charge, they should also be happy to find out about their kin who left to fight and actually survived where they had thought them dead 10k years ago, and vice versa. You don't get these type of moments in wow, so it would be nice if we saw something like that. To me that's nice, but maybe tos ome others it's not.

[Zulkhan]

I love the concept of demon hunters, they are proof that can be achieved have a union of the Elves



they are not horde and alliance, are Illidari!! the most feared enemies of the legion. I hope demon hunters can talk to each other that would be very nice

Holy shit, these guys look so edgy that I can feel the cut from here.

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idk, i still think she'd be able to know what you're gonna do, or take her power away when she sees what you're going to do.

she can interact with the world directly, we've seen it personally when she cures the satyr. don't understand why she wouldn't be able to take her power back.

Except there was no correlation between the blessings and the power you harnessed to stomp Nijel's Point. The blessings worked quite straightforward, you killed Satyrs, brought pieces of them as "gifts" and Elune rewarded you for such efforts. The end.

The power you harness later could have been achieved by worshipping Elune but ofcourse the Horde player has no time/inclination for that and simply exploits the disciples' souls to power the gems up. Once those were powered, the gems became nothing but a tool in the player's hands. Elune couldn't have took it from you anyway, at that point.