Illidan was a god or something

[Lycanroc]

guys Guys GUYS

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Let us return to the original question
Was Illidan something else before he was born us a night elf?
remember Lo'gosh was reborn through Varian

Well, I think the story just implied that his destiny was foretold of long before his birth. So...was he some embodiment of the light prior? I don't really think so, or at least I hope to the GODS he isn't. So yeah, gonna go with 'no' and/or 'please no' as my final answer(s) to that question.

[Deleted]

Well, the stories implied that his destiny was foretold of long before his birth. So...was he some embodiment of the light prior? I don't really think so, or at least I hope to the GODS he isn't. So yeah, gonna go with 'no' and/or 'please no' as my final answer(s) to that question.

thank you darling

NEXT

[vaeevictiss]

How illidans true path was a secret to anyone is a surprise. Years ago when the novel War of the Ancients came out i read it in its entirety and it was, in my opinion, the best wow book ever, still to this day. Anyway, you see Illidan and Malfurion as normal night elf brothers and both of them loved Tyrande. Tyrande loved Malfurioun romantically, but thats not to say she didnt have complete love for Illidan. The only thing that Illidan was really mad about was that his brother got her and he didnt. He still cared deeply for both.

When the legion came, he cared for them so much that he was ready to die for them to try and stop the legion so Malfurion and Tyrande could be together. He let Sargeras basically gift him with the pain and a fate worse than death so he would have what was needed to even have a remote chance of stopping the Legion. He hated the legion with every fiber of his being and even while taking Sargeras "gift" and working alongside him, his ultimate plan was still to destroy the legion. The only time he was pissed at malfurion, was when he was locked up for 10000 years and Malfurion did nothing to get him out. They only released him after the legion made its return and they realized he was the only one on the planet with the knowledge to stop them. Id be a bit fucking pissed off too after being imprisoned for 10,000 years for trying to do something to stop the legion.

Hes basically like an Anakin Skywalker. Wanted only the best for his family and was willing to do whatever it took to make it happen, even if it made him look like the bad guy. Blizzard has literally been setting up Illidan to be the chosen one since Burning Crusade. Then, a few years ago at Blizzcon, someone asked Metzen if we've seen the last of Illidan and all he said was "who knows...ive always loved a good redemption story". That pretty much set it in stone what their intentions were with him.

The instant we killed him in BC, i knew that was not how his story ended. Medivh has always been my favorite lore character, and even he had his redemption (i still dont think we've seen the last of medivh yet either, but possibly not, now that Khadgar has taken on that role), but illidan is a close second just for how long his storyline is and just how long they have waited to bring him back at the perfect time.


as for the other discussion, i dont feel Illidan was anything other than a night elf, in this life or any past one. He was just an ordinary elf that, in his eyes, had nothing to loose and was willing to risk everything to save the people he loved. I really dont see it needing to be anything more simple or complex than that.

[Eazy]

Like siding with the Burning Legion on three separate occasions?

Someone didn't see Godfather.

[Qualia]

It's disappointing, out of character, lazy, and bland. It's entirely illogical and it makes us seem like morons for not trusting his judgement when there's everything stacked up against it. Not only that, the story rubs it in our face how wrong we were about him as a person. I don't have an issue with us being wrong, but that doesn't forgive his actions.

The story doesn't force us to forgive his action, though. Xe'ra showed us the true nature of them and let us know he was doing it for the greater good. That's all about it for now. Whether we'd agree or forgive his actions is another thing. Malfurion understood Illidan's reasoning for creating another Well in WoTA, yet that didn't stop him from imprisoning Illidan for thousands years because the guy killed other NEs who tried to prevent him from doing that. I doubt Blizzard is going to stop Illidan story here with a "...and thus, after hearing Xe'ra's words, Azeroth citizen started worshiping Illidan. Happy end". Pretty sure letting us know he was doing it for good purpose and forcing us to accept that he didn't do anything wrong are two completely different things.

Also, in regards to your issues with plots, all of those could be explained in "Illidan" based on his thoughts, motives and decisions

- Why were the Nether Dragons enslaved if they were perfectly willing to fight the Legion? Seems like you're just making more enemies for yourself. They are intelligent beings and can be reasoned with.

The Netherwing Dragonflight weren't "perfectly willing to fight the Legion" unless I missed something (feel free to correct me if they showed any intention to fight the Legion during TBC, it has been almost a decade after all). They were just trying to survive and live their lives, but nothing indicated that they were (or weren't) willing to fight the Legion. Illidan, as we know it, cares about the result not the means - he (probably) wanted to boost his force wasn't willing to spend months trying to convince them to be his ally.

- Why did he enslave some Broken instead of convincing them to fight the Legion. A lot of them already hated the Legion. Only the Ashtongue actually swore fealty. The other groups were forcibly enslaved. He could have even provided something for workers and it would have been no skin off his back.

Because, as depicted in the book, he didn't trust them - or anyone else for that matter. He didn't even trust Xe'ra fully even after it showed him the vision, why should he trust a group / race whose leader already betrayed him once? Not only that, it was shown multiple times in the book that Illidan didn't actually care about his reign in Outland. His ultimate goal is to destroy the Legion, and he has his DH team for that. Other than that, Illidan didn't really care what his followers do to gather more force.

- I understand why he would ally with the Fel Orcs, but why kidnap normal orcs and forcibly turn them into Fel Orcs? It's not like he really needed additional soldiers on Draenor, seeing as how the Sha'tari, Horde, Alliance, and other factions were fighting Legion forces there. He also had plenty of demons on his own side to act as a bulwark if he really needed the extra protection. Seems like again, he was just making more problems for himself. (I know they were imprisoning Magtheridon.) And if he really needed additional soldiers, he probably could have convinced others more peacefully. It's not like the Legion is friends with anybody sane, really.

See the answer above. He wanted to boost his force with strong soldiers, and he didn't care about the method to do so. Good ol' "For the greater good" Illidan, basically. Also, hating the Legion and willing to take extra steps to fight them are different things. Akama surely hated the Legion, yet he betrayed Illidan because he didn't agree with Illidan's treatment. How many orc do you think were going to agree to fight for him if he tried to convince them peacefully to be injected by Magtheridon's blood? "Hey, I want strong soldiers to fight the Legion. Join me, there is just this chance that you'd go mad or die in the empowerment process". Not that many, I suppose, and I believe Illidan thought so as well.

Additionally, he started turning Orcs into Fel Orcs way before the Alliance and the Horde arrived. The Sha'tar, if we go by A'dal's decision, didn't have that much problem with his doing - be it enslavement of the broken or turning orcs into fel orcs forcefully - as long as he fought against the Legion. He only started having problem when the A & H arrived on Outland and by then he already stopped caring about his Outland realm and single-mindedly focused about assaulting the Legion. Illidan himself also reflected about it at the end.

- Why did A'dal and the other naaru attack Illidan if he had a great destiny as fortold by the wise windchime beings themselves? Yes, I know it was the Naaru Prime that told him, but it doesn't explain why they really wouldn't know if they're scions of these beings. Shouldn't they already know he's actively fighting against the Legion anyways and about his efforts? Why isn't Xe'ra bitching at them for ruining her master plan, since the NAARU WERE THE ONES ON THE MAIN FRONT AGAINST HIM?

Firstly, the Naaru don't seem to have any idea about Illidan's destiny at that time. If the Titans Keepers who have telepathy connection to the Pantheon (other than Ra) never realized that they (the Pantheon) were dead for thousands years, is it really illogical that the Naaru who don't seem to have a hivemind (and might not even work together) didn't communicate properly? Illidan pointed out as much in the book, if you recall ("He discerned the pulsing of naaru. So much for the promises the elder naaru had made back on Argus. It looked as if only one of them had faith in his destiny.").

However, they already knew he was fighting the Legion. A'dal wasn't going to attack Illidan at first. When Maiev asked A'dal to help her to fight Illidan, A'dal flat out refused her because Illidan too was the Legion's enemy. Using his words - "At this moment Illidan opposes the Legion. He is its enemy. We take advantage of this to gather our strength". The reason why he changed his decision wasn't stated in the book, but it wouldn't be a stretch to assume that the Alliance and the Horde (including us) took part in swaying his decision. That, plus the fact that Xe'ra is a Naaru (which means it wouldn't be too far off for her to be biased for her fellow Naaru), explained why Xe'ra blamed us instead.

- It makes Akama's reasons for betrayal seem stupid. He felt like his people were not being treated properly, yet he knew Illidan was about to take the fight to Argus itself. Why would he betray him at such a moment that could cost not only his life, but almost everyone else's life and safety? Seems strange.

Akama is not the brightest character, neither was he *that* eager to fight the Legion. I believe this was discussed when the book was released. It seems he only wanted to get BT back, and return the temple back to its previous glory. He never expected the Legion to be defeated, or at least, he prioritized his people over the Legion.

Akama was distrustful towards Illidan's promise to return BT and the demonic nature of his force for most of the book - admittedly, that wasn't wrong due to Illidan's lack of communication to his followers (as he couldn't trust any of them not to be a KJ's spy). He actually thought Illidan could have been another agent of the Legion and the promise to return BT were just lip service, which started Akama's betrayal. Later on, when he realized that Illidan actually was fighting the Legion, Illidan already created the Shade of Akama, enslaved the Brokens, and clearly Akama didn't like that. He knew that Illidan was serious in bringing the fight to the Legion but considered that madness and then hated Illidan for treating his people and the BT like craps. The hatred keep deepening when Illidan decided to use the souls in Auchindoun for his portal. Akama wanted to put Illidan down for revenge and regain the Black Temple, yet he decided that without his betrayal, the temple would be able to withstand the siege for years - thus, the final assault. He might be stupid / kind of selfish, but that wasn't illogical. This is just another one of the example that some people are aware that Illidan was doing the right thing, yet still disagree with his method.

[Faerillis]

In reply to Nelinrah, you should really read the Illidan novel.

No one should 'Really read the Illidan novel.' The book was a mess, not a Knaak level mess, but a serious mess none the less. The writing quality was iffy. The character development was incredibly shoddy at best — Maeiv, Akama, what's-his-DH all have a singular motive that were told, not shown, and stick to it ardently. The plot was far too fractured to be a good read and didn't even approach the idea of introducing concepts like Mardun (in fact, considering they make the idea of going to Mardun when we do seem incredibly unlikely).

Seriously, while giving motives to Illidan and trying to give his side is an interesting idea I cannot honestly recommend ANYONE read the Illidan novel.

[FelPlague]

Nah, just read the new Illidan novel. He's the chosen one. Naaru talks with him, shows him his future etc.



Not really, he received Mark of the Naaru in the novel, which fought with his "demonic part of him" but eventually stopped and they matched/mixed up.
So
...
I don't know what they're doing with him.


He was a cool character because he sacrificed himself, he joined the BAD guys because he wanted to help the GOOD guys. He was misunderstood and had greater plans than others. He became first Demon Hunter, his main plan was fighting with Burning Legion. The only good ending for him would be sacrificing himself and killing Sargeras/Kil'jaeden or stopping Burning Legion for good in the Azeroth and then dying.

That would suit his character perfectly, not becoming a paladin and fighting with Old Gods. I honestly have no idea what the hell is Blizzard doing now...
Anduin or Wrathion, even Med'an would suit for that job much better.


Don't compare Illidan to Arthas, they're different.



He actually was doing everything in most effective ways, best ways and nicest ways. Give a an example when he didn't.

Taking skull of Gul'dan?
He could't kill Tichondrius without it, no one could.

Using eye of Sargeras to destroy the Lich King?
How else he could've done that? Going to ICC and duel Arthas in 1v1 fight? We saw in the Wc3:Tft animation what happened.

Sacrificing his mages because he needed power to stop demons in WoTA?
If he didn't Legion could probably won and destroy his mages, his people and probably whole Azeroth.

Not saying about his plan to Horde/Alliance?
They think that he's The Betrayer, they wouldn't believe him.

Opening portal to Nathreza and destroying one of the most imporant Burning Legion planet wih the Draenei souls?
There were no other way, they were dead anyway, so...

Not giving Akama Karabor back?
That's simple, he was the master of Outland, he needed a fortified base for his people/armies.

His every decision was pretty much justified.

i dont think you get it, were on the same team :P

when i say nicest i mean the "i dont look evil" kinda way, taking the skull he became a demon, making people think he was a monster, and im saying ,their may have been more effective ways if he took his time to think, but as we know, there was no time to think, so he did what needed to be done

same with saccing his mages, yes it was needed, but it made him look like a monster, same with not saying his plan cause he dident trust us to not tell the legion of his plans,

the portal thing we never know until recently really, and that was amazing

again, it made him look evil, and maybe wasent the most effective, as it turned akama to betray him... like akama wtf... you couldent wait to take it back? your like "nah fuck you we want it now, dont care if the whole universe dies, i want it now"

[Eazy]

their may have been more effective ways if he took his time to think, but as we know, there was no time to think, so he did what needed to be done

So if there were no time to think, then he made right choices...

again, it made him look evil, and maybe wasent the most effective, as it turned akama to betray him... like akama wtf... you couldent wait to take it back? your like "nah fuck you we want it now, dont care if the whole universe dies, i want it now"

Yeah, I hope that Akama is going to die in Legion, I hate him.

[FelPlague]

So if there were no time to think, then he made right choices...



Yeah, I hope that Akama is going to die in Legion, I hate him.

yeah thats why i said he made the right choices, maybe not the nicest, maybe not the most moral, but he got shit done, and im pretty sure we enslave him as demon hunters get the shade of akama as a follower

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guys Guys GUYS



Let us return to the original question
Was Illidan something else before he was born us a night elf?
remember Lo'gosh was reborn through Varian

most likley he just has a destiny, he was nothing before hand, as well varien is ah uman they havent lasted long, illidan is a night elf, hes been around a long, long time, he was alive with all the the wild gods, so hes not a ressurection of them

my theory is him and malfurion are the children of elune, as we dont see their parents, they are labled as "gifted by elune" and illidan has this great destiny, and a preistess of elune is showing them off

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I also find it funny when people say "now people on Azeroth consider Illidan a good guy". no one on Azeroth said that he is the good guy. that's our headcanon. the only one who sees Illidan as a savior is Xe'ra who accepts him. people on Azeroth hates him, especially his own former people.

exactly, some people cant tell the difference between present, and omnipresent...

[Enthralled]

Missed the part about the intentions.

Why did he want to destroy the Lich King? Because he wanted to gain Kil'jaedens favor, it's not like that Illidan decided on his own that he needs to defeat the Scourge to prevent them from killing more people.

He wasn't trying to gain KJ's favor -- KJ gave him the proverbial "offer that can't be refused".

[Wildmoon]

He wasn't trying to gain KJ's favor -- KJ gave him the proverbial "offer that can't be refused".

It doesn't really matter. The 2 event were entirely different in intentions. Malfurion did break the world to prevent Sargeras from coming and did not even intend to destroy the continent. Illidan didn't give a fuck. He just wanted to escape KJ's wrath.

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Aren't you throwing Thrall in the same basket of Med'an right? Because if we're doing that, we could pretty much throw Malfurion in there too.

Unlike, the two Malfurion was not the chosen one who was chosen out of nowhere.

[Qualia]

It doesn't really matter. The 2 event were entirely different in intentions. Malfurion did break the world to prevent Sargeras from coming and did not even intend to destroy the continent. Illidan didn't give a fuck. He just wanted to escape KJ's wrath.

He did it to buy time to destroy the Legion, though. It's true that he wanted to escape KJ's wrath, but ultimately it was so that he could survive to destroy the Legion.

Unlike, the two Malfurion was not the chosen one who was chosen out of nowhere.

You must be kidding. What's the difference between Thrall and Mr. I-control-entire-Azeroth-nature-AND-the-Dream?

[Niwes]

thats the thing, yes their may have been other ways, but what he did, is what he saw as the best way... same with the culling of stratholme, there may have been many other ways, but that is the way he saw best

thats illidan... he may not have the most effective ways, best ways, or nicest ways of doing things... but he allways knows what needs to be done, and chases those goals...

illidan isent evil, hes a chaotic good... he is working for the good team... but he does it in ways you may not allways call good... wrathion for example, he wanted the alliance/horde to kill the other faction, so that faction could grow over the whole planet to kill the legion... its for the good of the planet... but its not the best plan for the people... same with sargeras... hes a good guy... he wants to stop the void lords from destroying the universe.... allthough in a pretty fucked up way... but yeah... he wants to destroy all the planets, so the void lords cant corrupt them, so he cant spend as much time as he needs to find out how to kill them, then once their dead he can rebuild these planets best he can...

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because people loved deathwing, the bosses in mop? mhm.... and people rather play wotlk, bc, and vanilal all day, doing all the same old stuff... then scoff at the new stuff... >_>?

i have a hard time to follow all your weird stuff and writings. sorry, but there are a lot of contradictory and strange statements in your texts. and i am not sure what type of english that should be sometimes. but thats maybe me, cause i am not a native english speaker. maybe you too.

i agree that illidan is not that straightforward evil guy. and in the first 1,5 books of the WotA trilogy he had good intensions. but he also later did things, not under pressure, that werent nice. its not that illidan ALWAYS had to do whats to do for the greater good. he is also a heavy egoistic, angry, self-centered character.

all i get from your weird writing is your point of view of illidan. you think he is the dark-knightish sacrficing "when no one can handle the hard descissions, then i do, cause i can stand the moral downsides" guy. got it. but i dont agree, that he is purely and always that person. he is also a bad guy, just doin whats good for him and what HE wants, not whats needed.

[FelPlague]

i have a hard time to follow all your weird stuff and writings. sorry, but there are a lot of contradictory and strange statements in your texts. and i am not sure what type of english that should be sometimes. but thats maybe me, cause i am not a native english speaker. maybe you too.

i agree that illidan is not that straightforward evil guy. and in the first 1,5 books of the WotA trilogy he had good intensions. but he also later did things, not under pressure, that werent nice. its not that illidan ALWAYS had to do whats to do for the greater good. he is also a heavy egoistic, angry, self-centered character.

all i get from your weird writing is your point of view of illidan. you think he is the dark-knightish sacrficing "when no one can handle the hard descissions, then i do, cause i can stand the moral downsides" guy. got it. but i dont agree, that he is purely and always that person. he is also a bad guy, just doin whats good for him and what HE wants, not whats needed.

have you read illidan?

also yes he has allways been selfish, he wants the power, he could give the power to him and 4 others, but he rather have it all for himself, he wants HIM to defeat the burning legion, not US to defeat it... he is selfish, but hes still doing the right thing, doing anything and everything he can to defeat the legion, and no im a native english speaker, just minor dislexyia

[Wildmoon]

You must be kidding. What's the difference between Thrall and Mr. I-control-entire-Azeroth-nature-AND-the-Dream?

There was a prophecy foretelling the coming of Thrall to kill Deathwing out of nowhere when Thrall and DW had absolutely nothing to do with each other and zero interaction in the past.

You must be kidding. Being powerful doesn't make one ridiculous and forced. Aegwynn,Medivh,Khadgar and Malfurion are all very powerful but their roles in the story are not forced. Thrall was forced into the role that didn't suit him with bad writings.

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He did it to buy time to destroy the Legion, though. It's true that he wanted to escape KJ's wrath, but ultimately it was so that he could survive to destroy the Legion.

Of course, he would want to destroy the people who wanted to destroy him. That doesn't change a thing.

[Zulkhan]

There was a prophecy foretelling the coming of Thrall to kill Deathwing out of nowhere when Thrall and DW had absolutely nothing to do with each other and zero interaction in the past.

Who cares? Thrall and Deathwing were connected not by "past interactions" but by the very roles they fulfilled (or more precisely, one used to fulfill his on a titan-level scale and the other began to fulfill a similar role on a "mortal" scale).

Being powerful doesn't make one ridiculous and forced.

Except Malfurion is so powerful to make him ridiculous and forced. Every time Knaak had the chance to put his hands on Malfurion he turned the character into an overpowered joke.

[Shampro]

People still bitching about Dragon Soul Thrall in 2016.



Is Illidan the new meme? Since hes one of the main characters of the story? Seems like it is.

[My User Name]

this is what happens when you cry " gib illidan " every expansion that came after bc

[Deleted]

Remember what Xe'ra said about his birth



The great ordering was the clash between the light and void but gods like Elune may have also been present at that time what if Illidan was there as well and he lost his life fighting the void or he may not have been a god but something else
It doesn't even have to be the same person I mean the death of an other may have created Illidan, like a reincarnation
That will also explain his attraction to Tyrande maybe it is not the person that he is enamored with but the force behind it which is Elune, who he probably knew.

That sure was a long sentence.

[Enthralled]

People still bitching about Dragon Soul Thrall in 2016.

Even players who started as late as Warlords bitch about Thrall, not because they have any personal experience with the character outside of running DS for transmog, but because they've been taught to do so by players who were around back in the day. I will never forgive Blizzard for what they did to Thrall during Cataclysm. It stands as the ultimate monument to what their "good intentions" can do to a beloved character and why people are so strongly resisting what seems to be happening with Illidan here.