Paul Ryan: Democratic Party Moved 'Far Far Far To The Left'

[Felya]

The Bush tax cuts didn't turn a Clinton surplus into a deficit, that is the common "myth" of it and of tax rates in general. Clinton had a surplus yes, but was it the result of tax rates? No, tax rates were raised in '94 and we didn't start seeing surpluses until the late 90's. So what happened in the late 90's? The dot com bubble. The late 90's were a great time, the internet was going mainstream and there was a ton of economic activity happening due to that. The more economic activity, the more revenue the government gets, so revenues increase. Of course it all dropped in early 2001 with the dot com bubble crashing, and a lot of people forget there was a recession prior to 9/11 as well with the economic turmoil that cause. So, revenues were already dropping prior to the Bush tax cuts, so did they go down further afterwards? No, they went up actually.

I didn't say Clinton cut or increased taxes. What you are describing is the folly of cutting taxes without cutting spending. It's simple math... You cut revenue and increase spending, resulting in loss of a surplus, instead of using it to fight recessions. The market is a force as well, but even if markets were identical, the cut removed the revenue covering the surplus.

You are not actually disagreeing, but are putting more weight into spending, to ignore that even equal spending with a lower tax rate, would result in lower tax revenue. As in, if the issue was solely the market, it would have returned to the previous surplus when recession ended. Which, it simply did not...

People like to make a big deal out of tax rates, but the reality is they don't mean much as far as government revenue goes. It's called Hauser's Law of Economics, and revenues don't really care about tax rates honestly, it's all a function of GDP. Tax rates influence the economic activity that happens, but they don't actually or decrease revenue, because people adapt and change their behavior in the face of benefits or penalties. This keeps revenue relatively stable around 18-19% of GDP (and higher during bubbles, lower in recessions).

Which is why I am talking about the deficit, not GDP. If the GDP percentage in taxes is stable, it doesn't mean that the taxes generated match the spending causing a deficit. If GDP drops along with taxes, the yearly budget does not drop along with it.

The Clinton magic was primarily working with the Republican congress and keeping spending down (around 20% of GDP) and benefiting from the dotcom bubble causing revenues to hit just under 21%.

That would mean I am correct, unless Bush cuts matched spending cuts, which is absolutely did not.

[Noradin]

You can see the Democratic train moving the other way as well though, with the face of the party being more Sanders and Warren. Which if you're on that side of the aisle you see as what you want, but as a centrist it's a move a way, so maybe Ryan is right?

Most of us in the middle see it happening on both ends, it just comes down to your perspective I guess.

Just because someone is moving down the train looking for an empty compartment doesn't change the general direction the train is moving in.

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Why do you guys always confuse the left with the far left?

Because they are too far away to make out properly.

[Deleted]

Well they won't get elected anytime soon anyway

I've voted strictly Republican since the days of the man in my avatar himself (rip), but this election I'll vote for Clinton, because fuck that clown Trump. Reagan's turning in his grave, I'm sure.

Isn´t that a good thing? Since Reagan was one of the all time shittiest presidents?

[Xeones]

Isn´t that a good thing? Since Reagan was one of the all time shittiest presidents?

He certainly did devastate our economy in a way we still haven't recovered from.

[Deleted]

He certainly did devastate our economy in a way we still haven't recovered from.

Smashed the unions as well, among other things.

[Grummgug]

The United States has a very large rural population that actually wields a significant amount of power in federal government via the House of Representatives.

People in rural areas mostly want to be left alone. They aren't interested in a bunch of free handouts. I've talked to many of them and their value system is that they'd rather live a simple, free life instead of paying lots of taxes in exchange for government funded "free' college and healthcare. They live out in the woods because they WANT to depend on as few people as possible.

For these people, there is currently NO reason to vote democrat. They hate Obamacare. They hate government healthcare. They hate gun control. They hate government meddling in religion (including abortion and marriage and silencing religious people in public areas).

You cannot govern in the United States unless you win these people over. With their current platform, the democrats will never win congress again. So they will never govern again. They will always be opposed by a GOP congress even if they win the white house. And executive orders aren't the answer because you know a GOP president will use executive orders in the same way.

If the democrats do not make a sharp turn right, the GOP will eventually control everything and they will repeal Obamacare, privatize social security, boost religion, and make a lot of changes you don't seem to want (but their constituents do).

[sheggaro]

Isn´t that a good thing? Since Reagan was one of the all time shittiest presidents?

No, he's one of the best.

[Thepersona]

Does catching up also involve criminalizing whistling at women on the street as a hate crime?

it is at least a part of sexism. she hasnt asked for that, and you are violating her safe space

[Xeones]

The United States has a very large rural population that actually wields a significant amount of power in federal government via the House of Representatives.

We know all about the republican gerrymandering that has allowed the house to grossly misrepresent the American people.

[Vivapin8]

Power is like a human body.

The Left and the Right political parties are really just the legs, and the corporations are what hangs inbetween - all the centrists suckle at the cock. Policy is a fart that occurs when both parties squeeze something out between them. The two legs are unable to walk anywhere unless they work together.

None of them are actually in power, because far above is where the real power probably lies - illuminati, or aliens, or super AI, or whatever.

We can't see that far, because we're the feet, they stomp around - we get the callouses and blisters: and we blame the hips because that's where the problem seems to be, but far above the hip somebody is dancing - and that's why none of the motion makes any damn sense from our perspective.

(You inspired me to flesh out your crude analogy!)

OMG That´s deep, you should save it and create a meme or something with it

[Xires]

And? Is moving "far far far" to the left bad?

Yes. it means less bipartisanship and more gridlock. It means a party that will use "feelings" "race" "gender" and "Sexuality" as a means of hiring practices rather then by merit, hard work, or experience. It means more complaining while having no clue on how to actually fix anything. It means more radical idea's- they are already trying to radicalize children that are only 4-5 years old with the gay/trans agenda because kids now apparently need to learn not just about sex...but gay sex because when we were all 4-5 that is what we thought about, right? lol

It means more marxism and a race to judgement before any facts are in and it means that looting and rioting until you get your way will be the new norm. The 21st century sucks ass.

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They all suckle the cocks of corporations, so they can't be that far to the left.

Hillary has had everyone in wallstreet up in her and she says she is "as progressive as you can get" so...yeah.

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Minimum wage, free healthcare and free public uni are things that have been established in developed countries "far far far in the past". It's time we caught up.

We have a minimum wage, free healthcare is not "free" even in Europe- they pay VERY high taxes on...everything. In Canada people have gone to the US for medical treatment because the waiting list is that long in some area's. Caught up? Who wants to "catch up" with an entire continent that has been stagnant and is constantly having to bail out one country after another?

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I will never understand why so many Americans are afraid of leftie politics.

Would people hate free health care? Free Education? Social Safety net? Higher minimum wage so you dont have to work 2-3-4 jobs just to afford living? - Payed by taxes, nothing is free Per se.

Can someone ELI5 why Americans are afraid of people on the left wing and their politics? What good has conservatism done for the average joe the last 20 years in America? I dont think I am the only one sitting in Europe and sometimes just shaking my head of the people you vote to power. And yes, I know you dont care about anyones opinion because you are AMERICA, the best country on earth.

First, NOTHING is free. To give to one you have to TAKE from another. You pay for it with higher taxes. A higher minimum wage? Sure you make more in Canada.....BEFORE taxes. Afterwards it evens out. Unemployment is a BIG thing across Europe and you are constantly having to bail out member states...looks like Italy is next in line. Socialism has always failed and it always will. Venezuela went socialist in the 90's and kicked out those "evil capitalist corporations" only now they can't even feed their own people and it is getting worse. Greece has failed and others are not far behind. Eventually you will run out of someone else's money.
We already have the highest corporate taxes in the western world...which is why corporation headquarters are now based in places like Ireland yet the left wants to tax them even MORE.
Free education? First it is NOT free and it costs TRILLIONS for education. You can have everyone go to college and get a degree...but it wont matter when their aren't even enough JOBS in that field...which makes that degree a waste.
We have scholarships where if you get good grades you can go for free. You can enlist in the military (the military is not CoD) and then not only go to school for free but get PAID to go to school.
We do have a "social safety net" and many take advantage of it and even live off of it.
You have super high taxes- I dont want more money taken out of my paycheck so some liberal man-hating femnazi can go to college and major in "Women studies" so she can go around bitching that not enough women are in the math and sciences.

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We know all about the republican gerrymandering that has allowed the house to grossly misrepresent the American people.

No, that is the left. It will get worse if Hillary makes it in...which she won't. Old people vote in mass and this time they WILL be at the polls. Even people in their late 20's to early 40's are going to vote against her in mass. You don't have a "Obama" this time so you won't get the voter turn out he had either. You people predicted that the Brits would stay and continue to be bound by the left global elites and they gave you a huge finger...in Nov...America will give the race baiting left the finger too.

[Xeones]

No, that is the left.

Yea, the left has gerrymandered the states so that literally millions of democratic votes are stolen in favor of the republicans.

[Healing Rain]

Democrats are becoming tyrants. They demand people to blindly follow their party line and then eviscerate anyone who does not blindly follow that party line.

[Espe]

Democrats are becoming tyrants. They demand people to blindly follow their party line and then eviscerate anyone who does not blindly follow that party line.

I don't see how the Democrats are anything close to that.

On the other hand you have Republicans: actively enshrining discrimination and religion into law, forcing young girls and women to carry the products of rape and incest to term, blocking US citizens from voting, poisoning their own constituents for profit, building a coalition of racists, sexists and homophobes for the votes they can't outright steal, gleefully denying science in favor of willful ignorance, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.

It's not exaggeration, when you actually look at the Tea / Republican legislative agenda, to see how many consider them to be obstructionist traitors who advocate for mass harm. That is exactly what they are, after all.

[Fahrenheit]

What an asinine comment. Modern Dems and especially hawkish Clinton and anything but "far to the left".

I think maybe me meant, the Dem are far to the left of the bat shit crazy current iteration of the GOP.

[Paranoid Android]

Yeah Paul. Well thanks for your Instagram pic showing the "diversity" of Republican Interns.

[Aeriedk]

The majority of the country does not benefit from those things. Especially not the working people who make decent money.

None of the things you call free are free, it's paid for by the tax payer.

It's as simple as that.

How does the majority of the country not benefit from those things? Perhaps not the current generation, but if implemented all future generations would benefit.

EVERYONE needs heathcare, almost everyone needs education, and I don't know who hasn't fallen on tough times once or twice in their lives.

Sure none of its free, but at least then it doesn't limit some of these things to only wealthy people that have inherited advantages over the rest of the population from prior generations. That's not a level playing field and when something is inherited, it is not earned.\

I understand that conservatives hate the idea of taxes and obsesses over the idea of free market (corporate America loves you), but if we actually added some of these left wing policies perhaps there would be less people that need that safety net and the equivalent of the safety net we have now, and help the economy as a whole.

[Jotaux]

Yeah Paul. Well thanks for your Instagram pic showing the "diversity" of Republican Interns.

http://ll-media.tmz.com/2016/07/18/0...nstagram-8.jpg

I see a bunch of interns, what exactly do you see?

[Aeriedk]

When you're far to the left of the conservatives, you end up right in the middle as a moderate, so I'm pretty sure he's wrong.

[Aeriedk]

I see a bunch of interns, what exactly do you see?

I could be wrong, but they could see a bunch of interns, you know, with no diversity.