1. #1961
    I do think our aoe would be a good bit better if Crash Lightning also copied our autoattack damage into its cleave.

  2. #1962
    Deleted
    In the trinket sheet Heirloom trinket is 3rd, that is considering a non demon boss right?

  3. #1963
    Quote Originally Posted by Taeldorian View Post
    That's what I'm talking about. They balanced classes during the pre patch and that affected how certain classes like us performed when the expansion hit. Beta is still open and feedback there should still be provided, but ONLY about the beta. Balancing around the pre patch only yields negative results when the expansion goes live, as shown with WoD.

    That's what happened to us, we were really good during the pre patch, got hit with a few nerfs that were unnecessary because the pre patch content isn't a valuable way to judge anything in relation to class balance, and performed poorly until getting the buffs to correct those nerfs.
    I've played shaman for so long now, that history has a way of repeating itself :P.
    It feels like it might be WoD all over again! I don't really mind it that much though. As long as I don't get benched, I'm ok! ^^
    Legion is 1 month away, so I guess I'll just have to be patient and wait. Hopefully I won't feel like they did the class wrong.

  4. #1964
    Quote Originally Posted by Tome View Post
    Is Healing Surge not working properly? I only heal myself for 15k in PvP, my health bar doesn't even move.
    Yeah, they went way overboard with healing surge restrictions. For some reason the enh template includes an additional -50% mod in pvp, which is odd since the baseline spell is already pretty weak. Pile on the gcd, mana, and malestrom cost and its not worth casting imo.

  5. #1965
    Quote Originally Posted by Karlz0rz View Post
    I've played shaman for so long now, that history has a way of repeating itself :P.
    It feels like it might be WoD all over again! I don't really mind it that much though. As long as I don't get benched, I'm ok! ^^
    Legion is 1 month away, so I guess I'll just have to be patient and wait. Hopefully I won't feel like they did the class wrong.
    Im not sure if your misunderstanding me or ignoring what Im saying.

    Its okay if were behind in the pre patch. Thats completely fine. The main reason we were behind in the beginning of WoD was because they balanced all classes during the pre patch. Everything during the pre patch is unbalanced, and we were one of the classes that was doing really good. Because of that, we received unnecessary nerfs during the pre patch that carried over into live, causing us to under perform when the actual content came out.

    Right now, they need to leave everything on live alone. Its not WoD all over again, I have no idea why your even saying that. If they started tuning classes right now on live, then it would be WoD all over again because certain classes would get buffed, others nerfed, and it would result in disaster when Legion goes live. As of now, they are balancing everything with the artifact in mind, they are ignoring the class balance during pre patch and balancing it based on the Beta and the actual expansion.

    In short, they balanced all classes during the pre patch according to pre patch numbers which led to us getting nerfs we didnt need before WoD actually hit, and we performed poorly until we got buffs to correct the nerfs we got during the pre patch.

    I hope you understand what Im saying, I really dont want to repeat this again. Stop focusing on pre patch numbers, start focusing on beta numbers. pre patch numbers mean absolutely nothing. They balanced us around the pre patch in WoD and we got fucked when the expansion went live. So, stop focusing on how we perform during the pre patch, start focusing on how we are doing on beta, because thats how live numbers will actually look.

    TLDR- Stop focusing on how we are doing during the pre patch. If they balanced us around how we performed during the pre patch, the live numbers would be unbalanced when Legion goes live. Thats exactly what happened in WoD and so far they are trying to avoid that, which is good. If you want a real representative of how we are doing, look at beta logs, watch wordups stream, anything that involves the beta. Stop. Focusing. On. The. pre patch. Numbers. You want us to do good during the pre patch but it doesnt matter, if they gave us buffs right now the numbers once Legion goes live would be fucked. See what Im saying? Go look at beta logs if you wanna see how we are actually performing.
    Last edited by Taeldorian; 2016-07-20 at 08:04 PM.

  6. #1966
    Quote Originally Posted by Taeldorian View Post
    TLDR- Stop focusing on how we are doing during the pre patch. If they balanced us around how we performed during the pre patch, the live numbers would be unbalanced when Legion goes live. Thats exactly what happened in WoD and so far they are trying to avoid that, which is good. If you want a real representative of how we are doing, look at beta logs, watch wordups stream, anything that involves the beta. Stop. Focusing. On. The. pre patch. Numbers. You want us to do good during the pre patch but it doesnt matter, if they gave us buffs right now the numbers once Legion goes live would be fucked. See what Im saying? Go look at beta logs if you wanna see how we are actually performing.
    Time will tell! Like I said, I'll still play my shaman .

  7. #1967
    Quote Originally Posted by Karlz0rz View Post
    Time will tell! Like I said, I'll still play my shaman .
    Sounds good to me.

  8. #1968
    Quote Originally Posted by Guinness View Post
    I'm sorry but you seem to not see the writing on the wall as far as Blizzard devs are concerned.
    Not really sure what you mean.

  9. #1969
    So yeah... after raiding tonight I gotta say, everything is pure chaos.
    We're still around the middlefield. So I guess we're somewhat fine, considering our Artifact is missing. Also, Stormlash is pretty good, considering Im at 28% haste or something, it truly helps managing the maelstrom while giving decent damage output. Managed to get to 100% perfection rating on Kil'rogg because my Guildlead said I should just go into the vision phase.. ended up with around 177k dps. Overall its hard to keep up with all the GOOD demolocks, shadowpriests and even ele shamans. They're truly strong currently, but it's prepatch after all.

    Edit: Personal victory; beat both evermaw and werdup on that fight!
    Last edited by Darleth; 2016-07-20 at 11:35 PM.
    Sometimes streaming on Twitch.tv, leave me a follow or a message if you like!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dugraka View Post
    *tips m'fedora*

    M'lady if you would be so kind to slob me knob seeing as I held this door open for you.

  10. #1970
    Quote Originally Posted by Darleth View Post
    So yeah... after raiding tonight I gotta say, everything is pure chaos.
    We're still around the middlefield. So I guess we're somewhat fine, considering our Artifact is missing. Also, Stormlash is pretty good, considering Im at 28% haste or something, it truly helps managing the maelstrom while giving decent damage output. Managed to get to 100% perfection rating on Kil'rogg because my Guildlead said I should just go into the vision phase.. ended up with around 177k dps. Overall its hard to keep up with all the GOOD demolocks, shadowpriests and even ele shamans. They're truly strong currently, but it's prepatch after all.

    Edit: Personal victory; beat both evermaw and werdup on that fight!
    Demolock has a broken tier interaction with the current class revamp. It's about as legit as end tier arcane mages were, that is broken OP. Nobody should be wanting to compete with that.

    Ele was already trashed in Legion at lv110, it's just right now with set bonuses that it's overperforming. It'll be back to low mid tier.

    Shadow priests, well, they're really strong at single target and cleave, pretty terrible at AoE though. Pretty much like assassination rogues, where they need to nerf their single target and bring their aoe up.

    Unholy DK's will be overtuned to hell, they're too good at everything.

  11. #1971
    Could someone give me some advice on how I should be playing if I'm using windsong and fury of air?

  12. #1972
    Good Morning guys, after all have tested the enhacement, i want that will opinion that if shaman is nerf o buff. I think great nerf, in this lvl, but lvl 110 will be different.

    I have seen some logs and i dont understand as haven a high DPS. Here put a link of what I speak:

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking...ent&bracket=17 (I have put 730-733 ilvl) as i have this ilvl, but comparing with my DPS, only do 37-49k DPS.

    Ohter things, i dont undertand why trinkets cost 14k (War of Skull in fase 0/6) and 49k (Stone of Elements) What happen? I have wait drop Trinket`s Kazzak or Infaliblr tranking charm? In this pre-patch there are putting a trinket and other? (I talk in DPS)

  13. #1973
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkoxa View Post
    Good Morning guys, after all have tested the enhacement, i want that will opinion that if shaman is nerf o buff. I think great nerf, in this lvl, but lvl 110 will be different.

    I have seen some logs and i dont understand as haven a high DPS. Here put a link of what I speak:

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking...ent&bracket=17 (I have put 730-733 ilvl) as i have this ilvl, but comparing with my DPS, only do 37-49k DPS.

    Ohter things, i dont undertand why trinkets cost 14k (War of Skull in fase 0/6) and 49k (Stone of Elements) What happen? I have wait drop Trinket`s Kazzak or Infaliblr tranking charm? In this pre-patch there are putting a trinket and other? (I talk in DPS)
    You're playing it wrong I guess. I'm able to hold about 80k dps at ilevel 740 without a problem.
    They've nerfed the HFC trinkets, mainly their damage output and proc chances on some of them, while Profession based trinkets weren't touched at all. They kept all their proc chances and stats the same. The Kazzak Trinket is just a PURE stat gain, which makes it so good currently, as it is just a passive damage increase overall.

    For example a Log of my guild, where some people currently have no Idea how to play or are playing without a working interface etc. Its logged in german unfortunatly, but its an mythic iron reaver fight.

    We're absolutely fine at 110. We just have a bad time NOW because we're missing a lot of vital things that we gain through the artifact (Alpha Wolf for cleave for example).
    Last edited by Darleth; 2016-07-21 at 10:10 AM.
    Sometimes streaming on Twitch.tv, leave me a follow or a message if you like!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dugraka View Post
    *tips m'fedora*

    M'lady if you would be so kind to slob me knob seeing as I held this door open for you.

  14. #1974
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkoxa View Post
    Good Morning guys, after all have tested the enhacement, i want that will opinion that if shaman is nerf o buff. I think great nerf, in this lvl, but lvl 110 will be different.

    I have seen some logs and i dont understand as haven a high DPS. Here put a link of what I speak:

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking...ent&bracket=17 (I have put 730-733 ilvl) as i have this ilvl, but comparing with my DPS, only do 37-49k DPS.

    Ohter things, i dont undertand why trinkets cost 14k (War of Skull in fase 0/6) and 49k (Stone of Elements) What happen? I have wait drop Trinket`s Kazzak or Infaliblr tranking charm? In this pre-patch there are putting a trinket and other? (I talk in DPS)
    Have to agree with the poster above. I'm in the 721-723 bracket (I know, super casual), and I was in the 60k range on most fights. Little lower on fights like Soc (57) and a little higher on other fights (Gorefiend was 75, Zakuun was 64).

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking...ec=Enhancement

  15. #1975
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Taeldorian View Post
    That's what I'm talking about. They balanced classes during the pre patch and that affected how certain classes like us performed when the expansion hit. Beta is still open and feedback there should still be provided, but ONLY about the beta. Balancing around the pre patch only yields negative results when the expansion goes live, as shown with WoD.

    That's what happened to us, we were really good during the pre patch, got hit with a few nerfs that were unnecessary because the pre patch content isn't a valuable way to judge anything in relation to class balance, and performed poorly until getting the buffs to correct those nerfs.
    No we werent nerfed in prepatch. Other specs were 20 to 50% ahead in WOD aside of elemental. The beta balancing was completely crappy like it is now.

  16. #1976
    Quote Originally Posted by Darleth View Post
    You're playing it wrong I guess. I'm able to hold about 80k dps at ilevel 740 without a problem.
    They've nerfed the HFC trinkets, mainly their damage output and proc chances on some of them, while Profession based trinkets weren't touched at all. They kept all their proc chances and stats the same. The Kazzak Trinket is just a PURE stat gain, which makes it so good currently, as it is just a passive damage increase overall.

    For example a Log of my guild, where some people currently have no Idea how to play or are playing without a working interface etc. Its logged in german unfortunatly, but its an mythic iron reaver fight.

    We're absolutely fine at 110. We just have a bad time NOW because we're missing a lot of vital things that we gain through the artifact (Alpha Wolf for cleave for example).
    Then my principal pblem are trinkets no?, Righ now have Archimonde trinket, Mirror, and Socretar's trinket.

    I believe that my rotation/priority of abilitys are goods, like everybody.

    I look you armory, and see that wear the skull of war and relics trinket ( I hope have luck)

    By last i have 57% mastery ans 22,65 haste, it is influence in my DPS?

  17. #1977
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Darleth View Post
    You're playing it wrong I guess. I'm able to hold about 80k dps at ilevel 740 without a problem.
    They've nerfed the HFC trinkets, mainly their damage output and proc chances on some of them, while Profession based trinkets weren't touched at all. They kept all their proc chances and stats the same. The Kazzak Trinket is just a PURE stat gain, which makes it so good currently, as it is just a passive damage increase overall.

    For example a Log of my guild, where some people currently have no Idea how to play or are playing without a working interface etc. Its logged in german unfortunatly, but its an mythic iron reaver fight.

    We're absolutely fine at 110. We just have a bad time NOW because we're missing a lot of vital things that we gain through the artifact (Alpha Wolf for cleave for example).
    But alpha wolves has been nerfed by 60!!!!!!!% in the latest hotfixes.....

  18. #1978

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkoxa View Post
    Then my principal pblem are trinkets no?, Righ now have Archimonde trinket, Mirror, and Socretar's trinket.

    I believe that my rotation/priority of abilitys are goods, like everybody.

    I look you armory, and see that wear the skull of war and relics trinket ( I hope have luck)

    By last i have 57% mastery ans 22,65 haste, it is influence in my DPS?
    Trinkets should not matter as much as you think. Still plenty of logs using HFC trinkets. I would guess trinkets could 10% of DPS, not 25%+. Trinkets are normalized a lot more now, which should be evident in wordup's sims on the pre patch guide.

  19. #1979
    Quote Originally Posted by Klatar View Post
    But alpha wolves has been nerfed by 60!!!!!!!% in the latest hotfixes.....
    Its still a part of our Cleave Damage though for example, which is a huge deal currently in the pre-patch. We're missing some Damage overall because of it. That doesn't change that fact. Same goes with every perk we get via Doomhammer.
    Sometimes streaming on Twitch.tv, leave me a follow or a message if you like!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dugraka View Post
    *tips m'fedora*

    M'lady if you would be so kind to slob me knob seeing as I held this door open for you.

  20. #1980
    Enhancement isn't really unique in that aspect. Balance druids are the same, their astral power generation is wholly tied to their artifact. Affliction warlocks also have considerable output tied to their artifact as do destro locks.

    Quite frankly, enhancement got one of the best talent revamps and one of the best artifact weapon traits in the game, so I'm not too bothered.

    I mean, compared to my Windwalker who has utter garbage traits like 9% increased chance to dodge, their healing tied to a teleport skill you use for mobility, and a useless trait that only triggers if you use a cooldown badly and it doesn't go off.

    Enhancement shaman is a benchmark for spec revamps and talent design imo. Shamans and DK's got really, really lucky in that regard while classes like warlocks and druids had their baseline abilities remove and to add salt in the wound made them talents. Druids had their forms gutted and tied to affinities that make these forms no better than they were in Warlords of Draenor, and Warlocks have like 3 talent rows made up of skills that used to be baseline for them as they were pruned to hell.

    At least shamans besides totem were left relatively intact. I can still fill my action bars, which isn't something I can say about my balance druid or warlock who can't even fill a full single bar.
    Last edited by Lucrece; 2016-07-21 at 01:42 PM.

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