Whats wrong with Liberalism? Do you like it?

[Deleted]

Do conservatives think the status quo is great, or the past was better than what we have now? Because those are some specious opinions.

A bit of both.

[Kraenen]

If that means what I think it means, no, you are wrong and misrepresenting their views and goals.

They literally want diversity for its own sake - not for any purpose or goal. They think skin color or religion is itself a qualification.

[Deleted]

Liberalism is simply a philosophy of personal freedom. It isn't something that is necessarily the anthesis of conservatism.

What Americans mean when they use the term is stuff to do with the Democratic party in the US. It isn't that. The organizations demonized as "liberal" are often fundamentally illiberal. This may or may not be a bad thing.

I just mention this because it is fucking sad that people just accept the Fox news definition of these terms and ignore the other 500 years of political history. And no, it doesn't mean something different in the US. Language doesn't work like that. Don't force your stupidity onto other peope.

[Gamdwelf]

I like liberalism because
My body
My choice
No consequences.

[Kraenen]

Do conservatives think the status quo is great, or the past was better than what we have now? Because those are some specious opinions.

In terms of personal dispositions (putting it simply),

Liberal - Comfortable with change
Conservative - Status Quo, skeptical to change
Reactionary - Past was better

[PC2]

Do conservatives think the status quo is great

The status quo of the world is literally better than ever for most important stats.

[HardlyWaken]

I'd be fine with the core idea if most liberals weren't naive, hypocrites and self-serving. I don't find that true liberalism exists and I also find it doesn't exist with logic, so in the end, it doesn't serve its purpose very well in reality.

[Deleted]

Language actually does work like that.

No, it doesn't. Common usage is not everything. Because many people are too fucking stupid to understand 2+2 does not equal 5 does not change the truth.

[Zomis]

The problem with liberalism today is that it over takes common sense.

[Kraenen]

No, it doesn't. Common usage is not everything. Because many people are too fucking stupid to understand 2+2 does not equal 5 does not change the truth.

Working with your example, 2+2 would = 5 if we just defined 5 as 'four things'. 5 is just a connotation to something real.

On the original topic though, we should probably distinguish modern left-liberalism with classical liberalism.

[Nihilist74]

I like liberalism and I like political correctness. I do think that young college students are going to far with political correctness. As a liberal I believe that everyone should be entitled to a decent living, not extravagant. I believe everyone should have a decent home, food, basic clothing, education and health care. I believe everyone should work unless you are disabled or elderly. I believe if you are not working in the private sector, then you should be working for a government job to help provide the population with the basic necessities.

[Damajin]

Fuck everything mentioned in the OP.

[May90]

Well, if you aren't open to new ideas and stick with your old dogmas forever, then your brain is idle, and you are, pretty much by definition, stupid. Unless you see stupidity as a good thing, you should like liberalism.

At least, I'm talking about the OP's definition. Real definition of liberalism is just being for liberty and equality. Which, again, isn't something a smart person should dislike, IMO.

[Kraenen]

Well, if you aren't open to new ideas and stick with your old dogmas forever, then your brain is idle, and you are, pretty much by definition, stupid. Unless you see stupidity as a good thing, you should like liberalism.

But not every new idea is a good one, and might waste your time. Doing a new brain activity could be good or bad. Certainly bad ones are terrible since habits and the brain in general by nature enjoy their first the most.

What's more is if you find a good way of thinking, why change it?

[May90]

But not every new idea is a good one, and might waste your time. Doing a new brain activity could be good or bad.

What's more is if you find a good way of thinking, why change it?

If a new idea is wrong/stupid, you will reject it; no harm done. But if you refuse to even consider it, and not because you've considered it before and found it stupid, but because you think that your idea is just objectively right - then yes, you are not being smart.

The approach "If it works, why change it?" is horrendous, and if this approach was taken by everyone, we would never have gotten out of caves.

[Kraenen]

If a new idea is wrong/stupid, you will reject it; no harm done. But if you refuse to even consider it, and not because you've considered it before and found it stupid, but because you think that your idea is just objectively right - then yes, you are not being smart.

The approach "If it works, why change it?" is horrendous, and if this approach was taken by everyone, we would never have gotten out of caves.

Not at all. We got out of caves because "this stuff works even better"

But it's interesting you hint that evolution is in a way conservative in that it motivates us to regularity

[Mackeyser]

Liberalism seems fine, I guess, but much of the good it might be reflecting is mitigated by the malaise if not malpractice and lack of engagement by those who align with the philosophy.

Liberals tend to align with parties, identities or causes and then treat them like teams. There is a distinct lack of principle in the practice of liberals practicing liberalism. (I'm not going to equivocate, I'll let that statement stand on it's own) So much so that Liberals wouldn't even own their own identity in the 90s and 2000s, adopting the moniker, "moderate" instead because they allowed the Republicans and Conservative movement to turn "liberal" into a dirty word. And rather than retake the name "liberal" on principle, they ran from it. They've even gone so far as to co-opt Progressive on occasion, which is laughable. You cannot embrace neoliberal economics, support regime change and a host of other things and then just call yourself a Progressive. I mean you can, but it just wouldn't be true. Words have meaning.

I contrast that with actual progressives who focus on principle and policy. Straight meat and potatoes. It's far less sensational, that's for sure... (I mean, have you ever read a Bill? Read the Environmental Impact Reports before a House Subcommittee? You get the idea. It's details that matter regarding policies that matter based on principles that matter to that person.

I actually find as a progressive (and, funnily enough as a former conservative), that I have an easier time and a better time exchanging ideas with people who are grounded in their principles, be they Conservatives or even Libertarians (although I joke with them that Libertarianism is only half a philosophy) than with people who are associated with parties, for example.

And I don't think it's about a purism, per se, because I've found PLENTY of common ground where SMART solutions would really improve the lot of people in the situation we were discussing by melding aspects of Progressive and/or Conservative and/or Libertarian ideas. Rather, it's about not making compromises on the principles which brings an earnestness to those deliberations.

Every time I talk to a Dem-Liberal or a Rep-Conservative... it's face-smashingly aggravating. It's all about team. The only Principal they know is the lady who runs their kid's Elementary school. The OTHER kind of principles are just chips to be bartered so that hard choices don't have to be made.

[derpkitteh]

i'm mixed on liberalism. because there's definitely good things about it. but then you get into the white guilt, the tolerance of intolerance, the safespaces and generally poor attitudes towards the freedom of speech and right to bare arms.

remove all those negatives i've listed and it's amazing, it's the best philosophy.

[Medusa Cascade]

Liberalism is fine as long as it's not taken too far

[Anax]

Because only conservatives get to try and control other's sex lives.