An example of ''freedom of speech'' issues in Canada : Mike Ward (stand up comic) ...

[Tyrianth]

No, why, normal kids love to be told that should go drown in pools, why ? And if they can't take this cheerful joke ''they are wuk beta liburals KEK''

Justice is blind, being a kid has nothing to do with it.

What was the evidence used against Mike Ward to prove that Jeremy's reputation and career were wrongfully damaged?

"And if they can't take this cheerful joke ''they are wuk beta liburals KEK''"

Don't think I ever said that. In fact, I even said I could get behind this ruling if there was sufficient enough evidence for libel.

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And the America hating Canadians here think they have any right to criticize America?


At least we don't fine someone because they were a big, mean, poopy head.

I'm going to send a care package of pink tutus and rainbow stickers to every Canadian here. What's the address of your safe space?

No, you just fine them $115 million for defamation.

[sarahtasher]

There is a whole judgement of several dozens pages with specific examples of libel, slander and impact on the life of the kid.

BTW, Mike Ward is known for making very dubious jokes for the sole goal of shocking people. For instance, he made another hilarious joke in 2008 about another kid, Cedrika Provencher...

...who had committed the crime of having been abducted and murdered by a pedophile. She clearly desserved to be mocked.

[Tyrianth]

There is a whole judgement of several dozens pages with specific examples of libel, slander and impact on the life of the kid.

BTW, Mike Ward is known for making very dubious jokes for the sole goal of shocking people. For instance, he made another hilarious joke in 2008 about another kid, Cedrika Provencher...

...who had committed the crime of having been abducted and murdered by a pedophile. She clearly desserved to be mocked.

So link me the actual court case. Not a news article. I tried searching and couldn't find it.

[Jotaux]

Its one thing to be demeaning toward celebrities, one other thing to be demeaning (200 times) for a specific kid, that is actually mentally and physically crippled

You shouldn't discriminate against him because of his mental and physical disability.

[sarahtasher]

So link me the actual court case. Not a news article. I tried searching and couldn't find it.

Here it goes, in extenso.

https://fr.scribd.com/document/31887...nne#from_embed

Yes, it's in French. Court rulings in Québec are in French.

[Tyrianth]

Here it goes, in extenso.

https://fr.scribd.com/document/31887...nne#from_embed

Yes, it's in French. Court rulings in Québec are in French.

If you have no intentions of translating the key points then I'll wait until it's on CanLII before making any judgement on whether the judge was in the right or wrong.

[Deleted]

There is a whole judgement of several dozens pages with specific examples of libel, slander and impact on the life of the kid.

BTW, Mike Ward is known for making very dubious jokes for the sole goal of shocking people. For instance, he made another hilarious joke in 2008 about another kid, Cedrika Provencher...

...who had committed the crime of having been abducted and murdered by a pedophile. She clearly desserved to be mocked.

So what?
You cannot create a class of people you cannot attack without it hurting free speech, and free speech is not more important than people's feelings, it is just important.
(that is to say people's feelings have no importance)

[Tyrianth]

So what?
You cannot create a class of people you cannot attack without it hurting free speech, and free speech is not more important than people's feelings, it is just important.
(that is to say people's feelings have no importance)

Well if it is in fact libel it goes beyond just feelings. Libel is extremely hard to prove, and I can't translate the court case until it's in plain text on CanLII (Canadian court case database).

Which is probably why Sarah provided a link to the court case in pdf form from scribd, where it can't be translated.

[sarahtasher]

Well if it is in fact libel it goes beyond just feelings. Libel is extremely hard to prove, and I can't translate the court case until it's in plain text on CanLII (Canadian court case database).

The mother was awarded 7000 out of the 42 000 for a specific libel issue, brought on page 19-Mike Ward said on a podcast and in shows that she was using the money from charity to buy a sport cars. This is libel.

[Kalador]

Mike Ward went to far and probably got what he diserved, yes by singing in front of the pope ''little jeremy'' became public personality exposing himself to jokes, but the thing here is when Mike Ward choose to name him and joke on his ''uglyness'' and ''bad singing'' for more than 230 shows it's gona affect the life of the personne being joked on, i think the responsability is shared a bit as he could have choosen to never became a public figure and by choosing to become one you expose yourself to jokes but it's moslty Mike Ward responsabilty. Also part of it is that he sugested that his parent were making money out of is back witch is close to diffamation.

Mike ward is a funny guy and he's humour is always border line, i went to see him 1 week ago in a free show in a festival and it was funny as hell, that doesn't change the facts that even if he's jokes are funny it can destroyed the life of somone... Canada as freedom of speech but this right is not something that goes over anything... we had another case similare to this where some radio host (jeff filion) would just go on mocking a girl doing the weather (Sophie Chiasson) evey day saying she was dumb and ugly, that she had sex to get her jobs and other thing, he lost is case to as it was considered diffamation judge said ''comment were sexist, mean, incited hatred, were without cause, wounding and injurious. These comments are a threat to the dignity and honour of human kind in general and particularly to Miss Chiasson'' here to i support the judgement, it's not cause your victims is a public figure that you can say anything without consequence...

also the case is going to appeal, higher court might view thing the other way around....

[sarahtasher]

Mike Ward went to far and probably got what he diserved, yes by singing in front of the pope ''little jeremy'' became public personality exposing himself to jokes, but the thing here is when Mike Ward choose to name him and joke on his ''uglyness'' and ''bad singing'' for more than 230 shows it's gona affect the life of the personne being joked on, i think the responsability is shared a bit as he could have choosen to never became a public figure and by choosing to become one you expose yourself to jokes but it's moslty Mike Ward responsabilty. Also part of it is that he sugested that his parent were making money out of is back witch is close to diffamation.

Mike ward is a funny guy and he's humour is always border line, i went to see him 1 week ago in a free show in a festival and it was funny as hell, that doesn't change the facts that even if he's jokes are funny it can destroyed the life of somone... Canada as freedom of speech but this right is not something that goes over anything... we had another case similare to this where some radio host (jeff filion) would just go on mocking a girl doing the weather (Sophie Chiasson) evey day saying she was dumb and ugly, that she had sex to get her jobs and other thing, he lost is case to as it was considered diffamation judge said ''comment were sexist, mean, incited hatred, were without cause, wounding and injurious. These comments are a threat to the dignity and honour of human kind in general and particularly to Miss Chiasson'' here to i support the judgement, it's not cause your victims is a public figure that you can say anything without consequence...

also the case is going to appeal, higher court might view thing the other way around....

Jeff got his mike back and promptly lost it for yet another brilliant idea : mocks the son of a businessman he did not liked (for a story of green business that was, yes, a subvention trap. Jeff had a point there) . The son had killed himself.

[mvaliz]

Standup comics today haven't changed with the times:

making racist and sexist jokes and making fun of victims is out

Making fun OF racists and sexists and making fun of those who make fun of victims is in!

[Kalador]

Jeff got his mike back and promptly lost it for yet another brilliant idea : mocks the son of a businessman he did not liked (for a story of green business that was, yes, a subvention trap. Jeff had a point there) . The son had killed himself.

yes jeff is really not the most brilliant guy... i'm not a fan of alexandre taillefer but the jeff move was really really stupide...

[Tyrianth]

The mother was awarded 7000 out of the 42 000 for a specific libel issue, brought on page 19-Mike Ward said on a podcast and in shows that she was using the money from charity to buy a sport cars. This is libel.

If that's the case then that would be libel, assuming that what he said wasn't true. But that doesn't account for the other $35,000.

[Powerogue]

And you US Americans can't seem to grasp your type of "Freedom of speech" is not something the majority of people around the world want, I'm happy for you guys that you can obsess over it but stop pushing your shit on us.

The thing is everything offends someone. If there's one thing I've learned from the internet, it's that. Someone, somewhere, hates your guts for your opinions, no matter what they are. So you'd prefer a society where that subjective experience is punishable by massive fines or prison sentences, and thus anyone who says anything someone doesn't like is automatically guilty?

That's not me being american, that's just me liking being able to express what I think without winding up in prison. I thought that was a more universal position.

[Dhrizzle]

The thing is everything offends someone. If there's one thing I've learned from the internet, it's that. Someone, somewhere, hates your guts for your opinions, no matter what they are. So you'd prefer a society where that subjective experience is punishable by massive fines or prison sentences, and thus anyone who says anything someone doesn't like is automatically guilty?

That's not me being american, that's just me liking being able to express what I think without winding up in prison. I thought that was a more universal position.

It wasn't just because someone found it offensive, it's because the artist targeted a particular individual and caused a decrease in their quality of life. The court decided the comedian's right to free expression did not outweigh the victim's right to live their life with dignity and fined him appropriately.

Free speech or freedom of expression is not an absolute right that trumps the rights of everyone else.

[Zenfoldor]

Feelings should not be translate into the physical realm of courtroom proceedings. Financial damages are one thing, and there is a lot of debate there, but when you start arresting(Germany) and/or fining/convicting/punishing people for making statements with their artwork, you've already gone too far.

Imagine if we said that music could no longer contain sexist statements, or that editorial news coverage(John Stewart/Bill Maher) could no longer criticize private companies or individuals because it hurt their feelings(not even their pocketbooks)? This isn't a slippery slope,this is the result of a previously misunderstood slippery slope, which has now reached rock bottom.

I'm fairly certain at some time in the past, people burned paintings and books because they hurt their feelings. It isn't good to start burning books, and this is the same thing.

It seems like all the liberal activity I've seen lately has involved silencing the speech of those entities that oppose the liberal world view. When you are silencing your opponents instead of promoting your views, you are morally corrupt.

[Varitok]

It's CAD so it's more like a nice BBQ gone to waste.

Im Canadian, Thats pretty funny to be honest :P

I can see where both sides are coming from here, I'm on the side of freedom of speech but it all comes down to whether the kid is considered a public figure since he hes a singer, if not then they have the right to sue. It's sort of hard to judge whether or not he is. This seems more like a deformation of character lawsuit, which happens all the time everywhere but its screwed up with the government getting involved, which shouldn't happen.

Regardless, it was a shitty joke,, Never been a fan of mean spirited "comedy" like Howard Stern.

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Feelings should not be translate into the physical realm of courtroom proceedings. Financial damages are one thing, and there is a lot of debate there, but when you start arresting(Germany) and/or fining/convicting/punishing people for making statements with their artwork, you've already gone too far.

Imagine if we said that music could no longer contain sexist statements, or that editorial news coverage(John Stewart/Bill Maher) could no longer criticize private companies or individuals because it hurt their feelings(not even their pocketbooks)? This isn't a slippery slope,this is the result of a previously misunderstood slippery slope, which has now reached rock bottom.

I'm fairly certain at some time in the past, people burned paintings and books because they hurt their feelings. It isn't good to start burning books, and this is the same thing.

It seems like all the liberal activity I've seen lately has involved silencing the speech of those entities that oppose the liberal world view. When you are silencing your opponents instead of promoting your views, you are morally corrupt.

I agree but you have to realize, its not just liberals who want to silence shit. Stop giving all the leeway to conservatives or other groups who actively try to limit rights to marriage because someone is gay. Both sides are pretty shitty a lot of the time but you shouldn't pretend its so one sided.

[Powerogue]

Eh what are you even talking about, I'm not advocating anything like you seem to think.

I've dropped it at this point. Dhrizzle explained it fairly well, even if I still personally disagree, I can see where he's coming from.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Here it goes, in extenso.

https://fr.scribd.com/document/31887...nne#from_embed

Yes, it's in French. Court rulings in Québec are in French.

So, you should be fined for all the mocking you've done on MMO-C, right?