Legion will be another WoD, thoughts?

[miffy23]

not only it can end up as another WoD but it has huge potential to end up even worse with all the changes they made , no flying , classes gutted and very boring even though visualy nice , pugging dead now that they removed ML , the only thing they need now is decision to not give us more dungeons and 3rd raid tier and legion will be rememeberd as even worse then wod

No flying is a different discussion, so won't comment on that here. It's no argument between WoD and Legion, in any case.

Classes are not "gutted". Many specs gain more depth and feel better with artifact abilities later, take it from someone who's played them. Some specs are certainly underwhelming in their Legion form as of now, but many others have gained a lot and are fantastically fun to play, often a lot better than before. Shadow, Guardian, Enhancement, Unholy to name only a few.

ML for non-guild groups being removed is a godsend for all puggers. Never again do you have to endure the occasional selfish asshat, and everyone is on equal footing. I fail to see how this is a negative in any way, unless you like abusing people for numbers and denying them loot.

And we are getting more dungeons, and we are getting 3 raid tiers, so it's a silly thing to mention.

- - - Updated - - -

It will definitely be like WoD in the sense that people will bitch about anything on the forum.

First it was how shit Garrisons were and how it took you out of the world, yada, yada. Now they are disabled and you cry how you lost the ability to make gold.

So...how did you ever make gold from Classic to MoP?

People got used to it and didn't comprehend how much it changed their perspective of the game, it was to be expected.
And of course you always have the flip-flop of "wtf this sucks" - "wtf why take it away now that I'm used to it".

[Deleted]

I hate to say it, but it seems as if Legion is headed in the direction that WoD took. As in, a subpar expansion that was worse than Cataclysm.

Legion is the ultimate counter approach to what WoD was.
The main criticism everyone had about WoD that unless you were a raider there was nothing to do (and that criticism was completely valid).

Legion on the other hand with the changes to loot system and the artifact grind goes the completely other way. Every day you log in and play, you will advance your character (either by gaining Artifact power or even getting lucky on a drop).

As a raider I don't like the idea of having to spend that much time on easy dumb content every day but that is the way they are going so that's fine. The raid bosses are still fun so I won't quit. Personally I think the casual community will dig legion.

Easy, linear, consistant and rewarding character progression for time spent. That's what its all about. People don't want challenge but feel like makiong progress nontheless.

[Deleted]

It's not Legion yet. It's still WOD. Thus still #NO CONTENT

I like garrison nerf. Finally no compelling to sift through 11 meaningless alts just to keep up with gold making.
I log in the character I actually want to play with. Then I de-log it and that's it. No checking of this fucking command table.
WHY there is one in Legion? Don't you think WOD had enough facebook game playstyle?

I don't like current state of classes. I got nerfed by like 50%, my damage numbers are like in patch 6.1, with BRF gear. All the Draenor Perks are gone, I'm balanced around having the artifact weapon... except I won't have one for another 5 weeks or so. I can't even go soloing older content (MOP) I was soloing with ease pre-patch.

[miffy23]

It's not Legion yet. It's still WOD. Thus still #NO CONTENT

I like garrison nerf. Finally no compelling to sift through 11 meaningless alts just to keep up with gold making.
I log in the character I actually want to play with. Then I de-log it and that's it. No checking of this fucking command table.
WHY there is one in Legion? Don't you think WOD had enough facebook game playstyle?

I don't like current state of classes. I got nerfed by like 50%, my damage numbers are like in patch 6.1, with BRF gear. All the Draenor Perks are gone, I'm balanced around having the artifact weapon... except I won't have one for another 5 weeks or so. I can't even go soloing older content (MOP) I was soloing with ease pre-patch.

The missions in Legion are far, far less important and not worth doing for just gold, for example.
There are far less of them, as well as far less followers, and they are largely there just to interact with Class Order campaigns and provide a bit more of sideshow distraction. Honestly they could have left them out completely, except for the Artifact Knowledge, which is basically gating your character progress (which is a good thing imo).

Anyway, missions in Legion are nothing like WoD where you felt you had to log in all the time on alts to check them. They're fluff.

[Soeroah]

It's almost a complete reversal from WoD.

Way more varied end game content.

Way more lore.

Way more class-specific stories than even Vanilla.

Way more collectibles.

I can't see how it could be any worse than WoD, or anything close to it. The Beta alone trumps the entire WoD expansion and it's got no patch content yet.

[kamuimac]

It's almost a complete reversal from WoD.

Way more varied end game content.

Way more lore.

Way more class-specific stories than even Vanilla.

Way more collectibles.

I can't see how it could be any worse than WoD, or anything close to it. The Beta alone trumps the entire WoD expansion and it's got no patch content yet.

*promised ,

its way more promised

we will see with time what they will deliver

[miffy23]

*promised ,

its way more promised

we will see with time what they will deliver

No, we actually played it in Alpha and Beta already lol.
We already know what we are getting.

[Deleted]

I think the OP is part of the Doomsayer event that will roll out in the pre Patch

[miffy23]

I think the OP is part of the Doomsayer event that will roll out in the pre Patch

So we have to come back every 20 minutes to reply?

[Darkguyver2020]

What's everyone's thoughts on Legion and the future of WoW in general?

My thoughts? I think you're an ignorant twat.

[FelPlague]

Legion is looking much better then wod did at launch, however the issue with wod was the lack of content AFTER launch... so we wont know till patches start coming out...

[Deleted]

See, this I don't get.
It's the pre-patch. They changed your free gold source, I can see how horrible it is for you, that you have to leave your Garrison in order to get gold through actually playing the game. How will WoW ever recuperate from such loss?!
I for one like the pre-patch very much, the spec changes and all, which of course aren't balanced at the moment, as they are centered around a mechanic which isn't released yet. There's what, a little over a month until release of Legion? Blizzard couldn't - and shouldn't - give two shits about balance at the moment, it's only going to be a problem for 30 days.
You're going to spend the last month in this.. failure of an expansion pack called Warlods of Draenor and that alone should make you dance around and cheer
Jokes aside, I really like the changes the pre-patch brought with it. It's gotten me back into the game, leveling the few chars I don't have at level 100, and I'm honestly having fun, the new specs are good, though the Paladin Tank spec has got me wondering if I should go Retri for the first time since TBC, that's a minor bummer, but other than that, I'm really looking forward to seeing how we'll fare with our artifacts and all. We haven't seen enough yet to really give a long sighted opinion about Legion, if you think it's shit a month in, I can respect that, but you haven't even given it a chance yet.
Oh, and regarding lore, explain to me how they fucked it up, please.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

I found amazing how so much bitching came from a PRE PATCH that blizzard said would only add 2-3 things for now.Yet people are acting like Doomsayers.

Yeah, it only added 2-3 things. What it took away is what people are upset about, because literally dozens of things have been removed.

[Pantalaimon]

I hate to say it, but this failure of a pre-patch, combined with them ignoring everybody's feedback on beta for the most part is very concerning. They've gutted our ability to make gold. For me it's plain and simple, the day I don't have enough gold to pay for my sub is the day I would stop playing. They are balancing the game around us having artifact weapons. They've fucked over the lore. Blizzard seems to love the color green because this will be the 3rd expac in a row where they shove that color in our face everywhere. Also, there's barely any new mounts coming out this expansion compared to past expansions. I hate to say it, but it seems as if Legion is headed in the direction that WoD took. As in, a subpar expansion that was worse than Cataclysm.

What's everyone's thoughts on Legion and the future of WoW in general?

So much facepalming I don't know where to start.

In reality they didn't gut your ability to make gold. If you had simply leveled a small handful of toons to 100, got your garrison/shipyard, and did gold missions with Treasure Hunter followers and did high reward Shipyard gold missions you obtained tens of thousands of gold per month by doing that alone. Blizzard removing the ability to do this at the tail end of the expansion isn't "gutting our ability to make gold" but is curbing the overabundance of gold inflation from the mistake of allowing players to amass fortunes in game from doing literally almost nothing. You're just going to have to actually work a little harder again to make your gold through more active means. In MoP for me this meant selling ore at the early part of the expansion & then literally only farming Zandalari Scouts & Warbringers solo or with my sister for months on end for hundreds of thousands of gold. If you think there is nothing you can do in game to earn gold, other than by a passive garrison gold farm, then you're doing it wrong.

If you only played WoW because you could pay for it for 'free' via tokens then I am going to assume you aren't the one paying for your account with real money when you played prior to this expansion? I could be completely wrong, but if you're going to quit because you can't play for free then I have to call into question your level of actual enjoyment for the game? Many forms of enjoyable entertainment aren't free.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole balancing us around artifacts is Blizzard creating and establishing new lore, which in turn is being turned into gameplay. The game changes and classes need retuning, redesigning to avoid becoming stale & stagnant, and all of this alters how combat is performed. If you don't want to play the pre-turning phase right before Legion then unsub and come back when Legion launches so you can quickly get your artifact and see how normal it ends up feeling when you're able to actually get into it.

The color green is very much in lore. It has long been established to indicate all things fel, plus it is practically the Legion's favorite color (Even some of their fire is green!). Plus as early as Warcraft rts games green made up the color of one of the main races that was being pit into war against the other human dudes. I don't know how you feel that they've messed up the lore since you provided no big details in your initial post, but I'll just say this; Blizzard needs to establish new lore eventually if they don't want all of the older established lore to eventually be consumed about things like the Naga, Old Gods, Sargaras, etc. You don't produce new lore and you risk either drawing out plotpoints for old enemies too long that the story becomes predictable and stale, or as I just mentioned you consume the story to kill the biggest 'big bad' and trying anything after that risks the next big bad failing like a sequel B-movie.

As a big mount enthusiast I say that even if Legion doesn't bring a ton of new mounts I won't be worrying too much because that gives me more time to grind out, do achievements for, or amass gold to buy the few I still don't have from previous content instead of having to commit all of my time on the current stuff. It's a welcomed breather after having amassed over 250 other mounts.

TL;DR: Don't judge a new expansion based merely on the gameplay of a pre patch event or its changes.

[Darkguyver2020]

This is the worst expansion yet. I've already unsubbed. This wardrobe expansion is a joke. instead of repairing stormwind park, they should of given us a raid.

Can't tell if troll or if you're just stupid.

[Tojara]

I can't see it.

On the premise alone that there are many different ways to obtain loot outside of raiding (which I do anyways). One of the reasons I wasn't too engaged in WoD outside of raiding was that I'm at a point in my life where I don't want to raid on alternate characters in order to advance them, I do that enough on my main character. Raiding normally takes scheduling to do properly, and I already commit a lot of time to doing it with my main character. Lately (not just WoD) WoWs model is almost exclusively raid to advance your character, which really isn't that fun for alternate characters.

Hard activities should reward you well, and I'm glad they are trying to extend that to avenues outside of raiding. I still think raiding should be the most consistent and easiest way to obtain advancement (it still does) but I don't think it should be the only way. Spontaneous mythic + dungeons on alternate characters (or even my main) gives me something to do on non raid nights if I so choose, and the fact that I can get random upgrades for doing basically anything (albeit a low chance) makes doing anything outside of raiding actually appealing in a sense. Also a fan of their design philosophy of how PvP gear works (at least template wise, not sure about random boxes, but we will see).

WoDs failures to me weren't the CMs, raids, leveling or dungeons, it was the lack of content. Huge content gap after HFC, bad pacing issues at the start and the lack of any sort of bridge between BRF and HFC.

The pre-patch hasn't even really started yet. It's suppose to roll out slowly over a 6 week period, judging it after several days isn't really fair in my opinion. They literally rolled it out and gave us a week to acclimate to the class changes first.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

TL;DR: Don't judge a new expansion based merely on the gameplay of a pre patch event or its changes.

Unless you have been keeping track and you know that your spec's artifact is going to do fuck-all to fix the problems that currently exist with your spec. Ashbringer doesn't magically give Ret the utility that was stripped from it, nor does it give Ret any of the mobility that was stripped from it, nor does it fix the fucking terrible Colossus Smash playstyle that Ret now has thanks to the new mastery. And I don't have any interest in tanking without being able to see what the fuck is happening behind me, so the camera change has killed my desire to tank.

All of my issues with the Legion changes have already happened, and Legion is fixing absolutely none of them.

[Madmajix]

Good riddance, you're only leeching on other paying players. Blizzard doesn't get a penny from you, so why would they care if you like it?

LMAO. For every sub paid in gold BLIZZ MAKES $5 more than a cash paid sub

[Deleted]

Another useless thread.

[Pantalaimon]

Unless you have been keeping track and you know that your spec's artifact is going to do fuck-all to fix the problems that currently exist with your spec. Ashbringer doesn't magically give Ret the utility that was stripped from it, nor does it give Ret any of the mobility that was stripped from it, nor does it fix the fucking terrible Colossus Smash playstyle that Ret now has thanks to the new mastery. And I don't have any interest in tanking without being able to see what the fuck is happening behind me, so the camera change has killed my desire to tank.

All of my issues with the Legion changes have already happened, and Legion is fixing absolutely none of them.

Then take a break. Complaining will do almost nothing at this point with it being so close to release.

The classes aren't dead, and the game isn't dead. Things change, get 'better' or 'worse' and then everything changes all over again for 'better' or 'worse'. People will always have something to complain about with a new expansion. The expansions keep coming though. You either enjoy the game enough to sub to it & play the content despite the changes or you don't play through much of the content. If I could stomach being an RBG target caller as an elemental shaman, before the ability to cast LB while moving, in a pvp guild before yolos were ever a thing and still enjoy my class and the game I don't see why you couldn't at least try. Change sometimes sucks, but it is solely up to you to decide if the change will break your enjoyment of the 'hobby' or not.