Bye masterloot, farewell alot of pugs?

[cFortyfive]

What a lot of people fail to realize

No. What you fail to realize is nobody forces you into those groups.

And I've seen very few items actually ninjad either. Most of the time it wasn;t in random pugs either... it was in Wrath/Cata LFD era.

Personally while I basically stopped pugging in mop I have seen maybe seen five items being ninjaed total - one of those wasn't even that long ago admittedly those guys were scum and I stopped raiding in their weekly group immediately.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

What a lot of people fail to realize is that a lot of people were not doing LFG pugs because of how master loot worked. A few of my friends are ready to give it a go now that they know they won't lose gear to the "friend of a friend".

Again, rarely have I seen this happen since 2005.

[HealTree]

personally i enjoy the change. Since a couple Guildies and i often signed up to all roll for one another on ML, or see stuff getting torn away by someone who clearly "cheated" the ilvl-req. ML for Guilds is the way to go i guess. First, this also supports players actually looking for Guilds to somehow maximize their possibility to get certain items, secondly this gives Guilds something Unique which was missing for a long time, apart from "Community" and Lvlgear

[judgementofantonidas]

What a lot of people fail to realize is that a lot of people were not doing LFG pugs because of how master loot worked. A few of my friends are ready to give it a go now that they know they won't lose gear to the "friend of a friend".

No. A lot of people refuse to do LFG pugs because of the deep morass of bad players that nobody wants in their guild runs that populate it. Face it, if a player was helping to support a successful guild in being successful they would have no need to be looking for a group in group finder.

[Deleted]

another terrible decision by blizzard. not surprised though.

[Makorus]

By removing them from your group.

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Here is a idea....

Don't let those people in your group.

This guy has been doing extremely well until Mannoroth. On Mannoroth, he screws up several times and wipes the group 10 times. Before, I could tell him that yeah, I will keep him, he can bonusroll, but he isn't going to get loot, but he will still get it for Archimonde.

Now, you can be as shit as you want, there is no real risk outside of being kicked. You still have the same chance as everyone else to get loot. There is no real incentive to put some effort into. As a group leader, you can either be an insanely huge dick by kicking people who have been in the group since the beginning just because they are weak on one fight, or you just let it slide that they clearly underperform, effectively showing them that putting effort into something isn't necessary.

[Jtbrig7390]

"No interest in heroic". That says all anyone needs to know about your ability in a raid setting.

Not really. I am fine with NM raiding and I have been since T12. Heroic holds no interest to me at all. Just because I chose not to do it doesn't mean I can't.

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And that is exactly what I am saying genius. Blizzard effectively removed any chance of experienced players acting out of any feelings of generosity by removing their control over how loot is disseminated in their group if they go over the magic number of pug players.

And I am telling you that ur wrong. You are trying to speak for everyone when you can only speak for yourself.

[Triskell]

"No interest in heroic". That says all anyone needs to know about your ability in a raid setting.

It actually says NOTHING about their ability. All it does say, is that they clear it once, and have no need or desire to do it again in heroic.

[Jtbrig7390]

No. What you fail to realize is nobody forces you into those groups.

And no one forces you into LFG where its PL or Guild ML. You have a choice make one.

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No. A lot of people refuse to do LFG pugs because of the deep morass of bad players that nobody wants in their guild runs that populate it. Face it, if a player was helping to support a successful guild in being successful they would have no need to be looking for a group in group finder.

Or maybe just maybe there is good players who do not wish to join guilds. I gave up on the guild idea a long time ago because I was tired of the drama from it.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Not really. I am fine with NM raiding and I have been since T12. Heroic holds no interest to me at all. Just because I chose not to do it doesn't mean I can't.

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And I am telling you that ur wrong. You are trying to speak for everyone when you can only speak for yourself.

The issue is that Blizzard has taken a choice from us all. Raiding with PL was already an option. People not using that option speaks for itself.

[oplawlz]

They will get even more complain Tickets since now the "reserved" Items depend on the cooperation of all players that joined.

A requester that all need to confirmed when the leader wants to change the loot Option after entering the instance would have been better.

Blizzard CS will not support reserved loot in a Personal Loot group. Tickets will be met with a polite "Nope, can't do that."

[Jtbrig7390]

This guy has been doing extremely well until Mannoroth. On Mannoroth, he screws up several times and wipes the group 10 times. Before, I could tell him that yeah, I will keep him, he can bonusroll, but he isn't going to get loot, but he will still get it for Archimonde.

If you allow him in ur group he has just as much equal right to loot as anyone else. If he is wiping ur group 10 times on Mannoroth then kick him and replace him.

If you allow him to stay and ur group gets the kill he has just as much right to loot as anyone else.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

Again, rarely have I seen this happen since 2005.

Anecdotal. Your experience differ from mine.

No. What you fail to realize is nobody forces you into those groups.

Indeed. Nobody forces you to do raiding if that means getting screwed time and time again.

Now, I can finally do them. That's a great thing!

Again, rarely have I seen this happen since 2005.

Anecdotal. Your experience differ greatly from mine.

In any case, you won't convince me you're right. Master Loot still exist for guild groups with over 80% of guild members. You can still sell runs or handle gear if you're doing a guild run.

For everybody else, people like me who won't run with Master Loot groups because it's utter crap, I'm happy this change was made.

[Jtbrig7390]

The issue is that Blizzard has taken a choice from us all. Raiding with PL was already an option. People not using that option speaks for itself.

They didn't take anything away. You can still use ML just make sure 80% of ur raid is guldies.

Don't like it go unsub and tell blizzard how you feel.

[judgementofantonidas]

Honestly I agree. I've never ninjad a single item since I started playing. How many fucking runs is that? And I've seen very few items actually ninjad either. Most of the time it wasn;t in random pugs either... it was in Wrath/Cata LFD era.

In all honesty it is the "players" and I use that term loosely who are there simply for loot and see their ability to ninja gear for themselves removed by master loot that cry ninja the loudest. A few weeks ago I ran a pug alt run of heroic Citadel and clearly in the pug advert it stated two things. Nothing reserved, and NO MUMBLE NO LOOT. For each person that joined the pug mumble was posted. About half way through the raid one player who had been standing in everything, not responding to direction over mumble and being generally terrible spouted all sorts of filty and ninja accusations when he was not awarded an item that he would have won based on his roll but I chose not to award to him because of his refusal to follow our group loot rules. Was that a ninja move? No. By initiating a system that supports shitty players like this guy Blizzard simply removes my desire, or anyone else that is often willing to pug and help the slow to learn, too stubborn to join, or simply players on alts that get no guild time.

[cFortyfive]

And no one forces you into LFG where its PL or Guild ML.

Of course you need lfg to pug and here I was thinking you were not that dense.

if that means getting screwed time and time again.

I don't believe you.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Anecdotal. Your experience differ greatly from mine.

In any case, you won't convince me you're right. Master Loot still exist for guild groups with over 80% of guild members. You can still sell runs or handle gear if you're doing a guild run.

For everybody else, people like me who won't run with Master Loot groups because it's utter crap, I'm happy this change was made.

Just as anecdotal as any of the shit you type out. You always had the option to make PL groups. YOu're just forcing your ideals on people, which is wrong in this case.

[Jtbrig7390]

Of course you need lfg to pug and here I was thinking you were not that dense.

No you don't. Use trade chat and get people from your server. You don't have to pug at all really, just get some guildies and go with it.

Also since LFR can reward up to max ilvl of the current tier you can just do that.

[judgementofantonidas]

If you allow him in ur group he has just as much equal right to loot as anyone else. If he is wiping ur group 10 times on Mannoroth then kick him and replace him.

If you allow him to stay and ur group gets the kill he has just as much right to loot as anyone else.

No he doesn't. If he pulls the same weight as the rest of the group he is entitled to the same rewards. If he gets knocked off the platform during the first push back every pull and everyone else does the fight for him, then no he absolutely is not.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

They didn't take anything away. You can still use ML just make sure 80% of ur raid is guldies.

Don't like it go unsub and tell blizzard how you feel.

Its been taken away. I often don't PuG with my Guild. I form groups with 1-3 friends and PuG the rest on ML ... (and have literally never ninjad a thing)