Isn't Trump / Le Pen THE argument for being against Big Government?

[Felya]

Because the Conservatives have really shown how pro small-government they are, with all the regulations to personal freedom they constantly want to impose, only to get bitch slapped by the SCOTUS
...

Barry Goldwater must be rolling in his grave.

Goldwater didn't burn the country down to give rise to American conservatism. He stood by his principles and gave clear reasoning for his beliefs. Something that the 30 sec or less generation simply cannot do... >.<

[Deleted]

Liberals believe in Big Government. They think the central government should be able to directly control education, health care, housing, investment, factories, companies, and everything else. But isn't it inevitable that a crisis will arise that will scare voters into voting for a "strong man/woman"? For a thug? If you assume the liberal description of Trump and Le Pen is the correct one, that they fit into the thug category, isn't this a huge argument against big government?

Liberals create all these government mechanisms to control everything in society, and then the voters elect a dictator (who promises to protect you) and corrupts it all to personally suit him or herself? How do you prevent that except by never constructing all of those mechanisms in the first place?

Isn't the ONLY sane choice to be for small government?

It's ironic, because if anything, both Trump and Le Pen are for a powerful government controlling people.

Isn't Liberalism for big government, so that personal freedom can be maintained and protected? I mean if the government doesn't have any power to protect the people, nobody protects them.

You protect democracy by being part of it, by spreading knowledge and understanding of its function so that all can participate. But also through big transparency measures and accountability, so that none that act badly can just get away with it.

[Belize]

Goldwater didn't burn the country down to give rise to American conservatism. He stood by his principles and gave clear reasoning for his beliefs. Something that the 30 sec or less generation simply cannot do... >.<

That, and the guy was ACTUALLY pro small-government. As in, don't interfere with the daily lives and personal freedoms of the people.

As in, don't try to regulate religious freedoms, sexuality, abortions, etc, etc HINT HINT, REPUBLICANS.

[Adam Jensen]

I didn't know liberals believed in big government.

I personally don't see the merit in the government being some arbitrary size.

Government needs to be as big or small as it needs to be to function efficiently.

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Because the Conservatives have really shown how pro small-government they are, with all the regulations to personal freedom they constantly want to impose, only to get bitch slapped by the SCOTUS
...

Barry Goldwater must be rolling in his grave.

But Republicans must be small-government. After all, a government has to be very small to fit inside a vagina and make sure no abortions happen without their consent.

[DeadmanWalking]

The reason republicans rail against big govt is because big governments require more taxes to fund and R's run on a lower taxes promise. They are not at all interested in it to stop strong men or dictators.

The hypocrisy lies in that they also believe in a massive military to the point we buy weapons of war that we don't need and the military is a huge and expensive function of the govt that taxes pay for but as far as they are concerned should get as much tax money as it wants, just keep throwing money at it... Unless of course you are a former soldier then fuck off.

[Ryme]

I didn't know liberals believed in big government.

He's confusing liberalism with authoritarian left. It's easily done lately since a lot of the authoritarian left claim to be liberals.

[Theodarzna]

Being abused by your landlord without anyone to turn to is better than being abused by your mayor without anyone to turn to, hm?

Do you have a pitchfork? Much of the Landlords power comes from the fact that he or she knows the courts will be at their disposal, as will the police.

[Kasierith]

Exactly what part of building a massive wall, destroying private citizens livelihoods and seizing their property in the process, is small government?

[Alydael]

They really shouldn't be called liberals to describe such a wide variety of ideologies.

Classic liberalism typically is for small government and more freedom and free market.

Just look at who is pushing for the globalist agenda in the USA. You can't get bigger than a "global government." The far, far left- like Sanders opposes it but the regular "liberals" we have (Hillary, Obama) are pushing hard for it. Despite most of their convention holding up anti trade agreement signs, they still support it. It shows: their personal agenda > voters. Hey who cares if you lose your job to some global trade agreement. At least Obama and Hillary will get to pat themselves on the back knowing they furthered the globalist agenda.

[Kasierith]

Just look at who is pushing for the globalist agenda in the USA. You can't get bigger than a "global government." The far, far left- like Sanders opposes it but the regular "liberals" we have (Hillary, Obama) are pushing hard for it. Despite most of their convention holding up anti trade agreement signs, they still support it. It shows: their personal agenda > voters. Hey who cares if you lose your job to some global trade agreement. At least Obama and Hillary will get to pat themselves on the back knowing they furthered the globalist agenda.

Why should the democratic party cater only to the fringe far left and ignore the majority of its constituents? Berniebros aren't entitled to anything, no matter how much they think otherwise.

[Alydael]

Why should the democratic party cater only to the fringe far left and ignore the majority of its constituents? Berniebros aren't entitled to anything, no matter how much they think otherwise.

Most Americans oppose the trade deal (TPP or whatever it is called). We have a representative government, a government "by the people- for the people." Our officials are supposed to be our voice or the voice of our beliefs. The problem we are currently having is that most of our officials seem to forget that as soon as they are elected and just start stubbornly pursuing their own agenda. When most Americans oppose something, our officials should as well.

[Bollocks]

How can you possibly say that knowing his opponent is the face of fascism?

The joke flew over your head.

[In Ogres We Trust]

Liberals believe in Big Government. They think the central government should be able to directly control education, health care, housing, investment, factories, companies, and everything else. But isn't it inevitable that a crisis will arise that will scare voters into voting for a "strong man/woman"? For a thug? If you assume the liberal description of Trump and Le Pen is the correct one, that they fit into the thug category, isn't this a huge argument against big government?

Liberals create all these government mechanisms to control everything in society, and then the voters elect a dictator (who promises to protect you) and corrupts it all to personally suit him or herself? How do you prevent that except by never constructing all of those mechanisms in the first place?

Isn't the ONLY sane choice to be for small government?

I don't care about the size of government; I care about the efficiency of government, and the accountability of government to the interests of the people that it claims to represent.

[SirBeef]

In the U.S., the liberals are typically the big government, nanny state, big brother party. They want government to regulate all parts of your life. It might be different in other countries though. The conservatives trend towards a weaker fed government (at least weaker socially, but strong in military) and want most of the decisions to be made locally by the states.

Funny, since WW2 Republicans have grown governtment while the Dems usually shrink it.

[Theodarzna]

Most Americans oppose the trade deal (TPP or whatever it is called). We have a representative government, a government "by the people- for the people." Our officials are supposed to be our voice or the voice of our beliefs. The problem we are currently having is that most of our officials seem to forget that as soon as they are elected and just start stubbornly pursuing their own agenda. When most Americans oppose something, our officials should as well.

Most of our elected officials do not come from the same social classes that make up the majority of the American populations. More over most of them have this sense of DC Consensus of what benefits the social classes they come from and consider worthy or important.

TPP is the scourge of many and will blight many, its just those people don't live in NYC or Silicon Valley.

[SirBeef]

I don't care about the size of government; I care about the efficiency of government, and the accountability of government to the interests of the people that it claims to represent.

Given the size of the US we need a very large government to meet the needs of the people. However it can be made to run much more efficiently. In turn that will drive down the cost of running the government.

[infinitemeridian]

Nobody cares how big the government is, so long as it works and is efficient. This whole notion that the bigger a government is, the less freedoms we have or whatnot is nonsense.

[Sky High]

Buzzwords, nothing but buzzwords from this guy.

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I don't care about the size of government; I care about the efficiency of government, and the accountability of government to the interests of the people that it claims to represent.

Also this. I don't think te government needs to be any defined size. I think there are areas the government should have control: banking, Wall Street, public utilities like Internet, and infrastructure. And arenas I DONT want them in: drugs, pharmaceuticals. Just give me a check list instead of some insipid category.

[Sunseeker]

I swear I lose brain cells reading the idiocy of these threads.

[Machismo]

Only the last thing had any relation to the size of government.
and on topic, yes, shitty leaders (authoritarians too) are One of the reasons against a big government.

Those all have to do with the size of government. All of them are examples of big-government solutions, as well as unnecessary government intrusion.Trump supports them all, because he's a strong authoritarian. There is nothing in his rhetoric that would imply that he's in favor of smaller government.