In the land of the free, 1% of the population is incarcerated

[Deleted]

1% isn't going to sound impressive to anyone, which makes it a really bad way to try to persuade anyone there is a problem.

How about this: Per capita americans are 1000% more criminal than people from belgium. (belgium has 0.1% of the population in jail)

[Cthulhu 2020]

I didnt say, nor did I imply that, I only stated that until such a time that unjust laws are fixed, breaking them can result in jail time. It sucks but thats life. None of these "unjust" laws, are secret after all, or are things you just slip into on accident. Its a willful choice to break them.

So you're all for removing laws which create criminals out of victimless actions, and reviewing case files of people in prison for said laws? Cool.

[Gib Lover]

The way I look at these figures is we have some dumb laws that need reform and our prison system could use some work, but overall if 99% of the country is out of prison (it's actually higher, the Wiki article OP cites says 1 in 110 people are in prison) then that is an acceptable place to be whilst we work out our issues. We are a massive country with what are essentially 50 mini-countries with their own laws on top of the federal laws, so we have a bit more of a jumbled legal system then say, Italy.

Also privatized prisons is also an issue, but it's one that is blown out of proportion. Something like 30% of American prisons are privatized, though it should be smaller or gone altogether.

[PC2]

How about this: Per capita americans are 1000% more criminal than people from belgium. (belgium has 0.1% of the population in jail)

Sounds right after you look at the populations.

[IIamaKing]

So you're all for removing laws which create criminals out of victimless actions, and reviewing case files of people in prison for said laws? Cool.

Certainly, but until that time, they are still laws and breaking them is a bad idea.

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How about this: Per capita americans are 1000% more criminal than people from belgium. (belgium has 0.1% of the population in jail)

With just that info, I could easily say that Belgium just has really soft laws and there are tons of un-tried criminals running around.

[Deleted]

Sounds right after you look at the populations.

https://www.mathsisfun.com/percentage.html

[fabific]

In this video there's a very interesting conversation between an 11 year vet from Chicago and a very well known pro marijuana individual.
They speak towards the injustices versus many people stuck inside a vicious unjust cycle powered by money. Whether it's the Private Prison Industrial Complex, the NRA or Citizens United's fault he states that most people believe they are doing good in their community but are in fact not.

https://youtu.be/Ndg-JGmYryA

[Soeroah]

Land of the free to live your life without others screwing you over, not land of the free to do whatever you want without consequence.

Rich people aside, of course.

[Ghostpanther]

We could also analyze our punitive system, since a lot of other countries employ rehabilitation systems, and only apply harsh jailing sentences for people who are obviously beyond redemption. Otherwise there are a lot of people who are good people who just break a law, and can be rehabilitated to never do it again. Redaction rates in those countries are low, making crime overall much less of an issue.

Meanwhile in the US we just throw em in prison for 30 years, then release them into the world with $40, no friends, no family, and their only other contacts are other criminals. Guess how often that ends in them going back to prison.

So hard line conservatives believe in harsh sentences, that if you break a law you "deserve" whatever punishment you're given, meanwhile other countries employ methods that see far lower redaction (repeat) offenses by rehabilitating.

I'd say the US deserves its elevated crime rates for all of the criminals we give deserving punishment.

Did you not tell me in other thread the US crime rate is lower now then it has been in decades? I seriously do not think our punishment of criminals is contributing to a non existent increase in the crime rate, if that is true. :P Firearm violence may have increased and this has little to do with our penal code ( other than lax reactions for enforcing the laws ), but rather the increase in drug related gangs. If anything, the hard core drug pushers should be put to death. They are certainly responsible for destroying thousands of lives each year.

[Shibito]

How about we start analyzing some retarded laws, like ones that will turn teenagers experimenting with marijuana into hardened criminals?

Or are we still under the delusion that all laws are just if it's a law?

That too but lets not pretend marijuana is harmless like pro potters claim it does cause brain damage. Im so sick of the pro weed smokers claiming marijuana does no damage.

[Deleted]

With just that info, I could easily say that Belgium just has really soft laws and there are tons of un-tried criminals running around.

And in America they all get caught right

[PC2]

https://www.mathsisfun.com/percentage.html

Don't worry, at the rate Germany is going you'll be catching up on the fun before long.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Did you not tell me in other thread the US crime rate is lower now then it has been in decades? I seriously do not think our punishment of criminals is contributing to a non existent increase in the crime rate, if that is true. :P Firearm violence may have increased and this has little to do with our penal code ( other than lax reactions for enforcing the laws ), but rather the increase in drug related gangs. If anything, the hard core drug pushers should be put to death. They are certainly responsible for destroying thousands of lives each year.

It's lower than it has been in decades, but still elevated beyond what it could be.

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That too but lets not pretend marijuana is harmless like pro potters claim it does cause brain damage. Im so sick of the pro weed smokers claiming marijuana does no damage.

Zero damage, no, but among recreational substances let's not pretend it's that dangerous, or if fully legalized and regulated like alcohol, is all that dangerous.

[Deleted]

seems legit.

not sure the graph is entirely correct/honest with how it labels things, but you get the idea. violent crime is down, incarceration is up a lot.

[Ghostpanther]

It's lower than it has been in decades, but still elevated beyond what it could be.

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Hehe. Of course it could be better. Life could be better. We could all live to be 200 would be better. Prisons exist for the betterment of society. Without laws and consequences of not obeying them, it would lead to anarchy. I am not saying we do not need some changes. But I also think there are extremes in both lines of reasoning. The real answer to high crime rates is basically a better life for those who feel a need to resort to crime. And those who want prey on the poor and vulnerable, need to be eliminated.

[ComputerNerd]

"Land of the Free" doesn't mean "Do whatever you want with no consequences". And I am fine with that.

Exactly.
Freedom isn't just personal.

[JohnBrown1917]

You can thank for profit prisons for that.
Truly one of the most moronic things anybody ever came up with in all of human history.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Hehe. Of course it could be better. Life could be better. We could all live to be 200 would be better. Prisons exist for the betterment of society. Without laws and consequences of not obeying them, it would lead to anarchy. I am not saying we do not need some changes. But I also think there are extremes in both lines of reasoning. The real answer to high crime rates is basically a better life for those who feel a need to resort to crime. And those who want prey on the poor and vulnerable, need to be eliminated.

The problem with this line of thinking is that criminals are those who take advantage of others. Who steal or harm in other ways. There are a lot of people in prison who are there for victimless crimes, such as possessing a couple of ounces of marijuana.

And just to be clear, I am not a pot head, have only smoked a few times, and think stoners are pretty annoying. But understand that we jail far too many people for simple possession. It creates poverty and more crime where it shouldn't.

[JohnBrown1917]

Exactly.
Freedom isn't just personal.

Like going to prison for possession of weed.

[Mayhem]

Don't worry, at the rate Germany is going you'll be catching up on the fun before long.

Because the crime rate in 2015 dropped compared to 2014... therefore germany is catching up. /derp

Damn, it must be easy living in a world where you can blame everything on immigrants.