[FIRE] Legion Beta Megathread

[Sturmcantor]

It's fine, it really was way too powerful. Not all nerfs are bad.

100% this. Even reducing my Flame Patch damage on my last kill of Iskar I'm easily 40k dps ahead of the 2nd dps. It was ridiculously strong on big AoE and on the super short 20-30s kills of bosses we've been seeing over the last week.

[nukeskywalkr]

100% this. Even reducing my Flame Patch damage on my last kill of Iskar I'm easily 40k dps ahead of the 2nd dps. It was ridiculously strong on big AoE and on the super short 20-30s kills of bosses we've been seeing over the last week.

Wish I caught up with this thread before an HFC run last night -- all the haste on my gear for flame patch ticks was a waste.

I was getting used to consistently out-damaging better geared mages. Oh well, back to +crit>mastery and not +crit>haste (at least for my gear)

[Swaghou]

Is Living Bomb better than Flame Patch on beta atm after the recent nerfs or? Also I can't find it documented anywhere, but I feel like they nerfed Horn of Valor, the numbers look different.

[Meleti]

What really worries me is the spec's popularity. On Beta, the other 2 specs are barely represented, which will eventually lead to either a massive and hasty boost to those 2 specs (and, like every Blizzard's hasty thing, is broken) or to a massive and hasty nerf to Fire (same rule apply).

Having a single spec SO strong before the launch of an expansion is not a good thing. Trust me.

This is because of two things, tuning and versatility. Fire is stronger in almost every situation for the time being, and even if the other specs get brought up, Fire has the single target, AoE, cleave, and burst (single and AoE) to be a preferred raid spec in Legion.

I see Frost as being a strong versatile spec in the future with tuning, I'm just not sure about Arcane on cleave/AoE fights.

[Biomega]

Is Living Bomb better than Flame Patch on beta atm after the recent nerfs or? Also I can't find it documented anywhere, but I feel like they nerfed Horn of Valor, the numbers look different.

A big part of why Flame Patch is so ubiquitous on live is the class trinket, which obviously does nothing at all with LB.

Once we're at 110, I expect LB to be quite competitive in terms of AoE damage.

[deadman1]

I understand that Flame Patch is OP with the class trinket, but if they nerf it because of an unintended interaction, then it's going to turn the talent into garbage for the level 110.

[Deleted]

Is Living Bomb better than Flame Patch on beta atm after the recent nerfs or? Also I can't find it documented anywhere, but I feel like they nerfed Horn of Valor, the numbers look different.

If you are 3+ adds that will stay in the patch, i think Flamepatch will end up being stronger since you can stack them, 1 patch is not stronger than 1 LB but you can get 3 FS down easily before LB comes off cooldown, plus on 3 targets FS does more damage than a single pyro plus ignite.

If adds move around and wont be static then LB will no doubt be better because it front loads the damage in short amount of time, also on 2 target cleave it will be superior as long as the two targets stay in range, its DPCT is almost as high as pyro.

Artifact traits could well change this however.

[Wootmonkey]

I understand that Flame Patch is OP with the class trinket, but if they nerf it because of an unintended interaction, then it's going to turn the talent into garbage for the level 110.

It was pretty OP even without the class trinket, that just made it more obvious

[Deleted]

I understand that Flame Patch is OP with the class trinket, but if they nerf it because of an unintended interaction, then it's going to turn the talent into garbage for the level 110.

Nah it was too strong, what people are not noticing just by reading the tooltip is that the patches stack, you could easy get 4 down on top of each other resulting in a total of 1920% SP damage from 4 gcds which is 240% per tic per target, without even considering the Flamestrike direct damage.

With the nerf the above situation maintains the same flamestrike direct damage but stacking 4 patches will result in a total of 640% SP damage from 4 gcds and 80% per tic per target, which seems like a realistic figure since its roughly just below half a fireball damage, which is still pretty strong AoE damage.

[Deleted]

Also I can't find it documented anywhere, but I feel like they nerfed Horn of Valor, the numbers look different.

they nerfed horn of valor by about 25% afaik.

- - - Updated - - -

Nah it was too strong, what people are not noticing just by reading the tooltip is that the patches stack, you could easy get 4 down on top of each other resulting in a total of 1920% SP damage from 4 gcds which is 240% per tic per target, without even considering the Flamestrike direct damage.

With the nerf the above situation maintains the same flamestrike direct damage but stacking 4 patches will result in a total of 640% SP damage from 4 gcds and 80% per tic per target, which seems like a realistic figure since its roughly just below half a fireball damage, which is still pretty strong AoE damage.

its also more in line with other class' aoe, well maybe with the exception of demon hunters, they are only going to look stronger for aoe after this nerf, but with that said, it was a needed nerf.

[masterprtzl]

100% this. Even reducing my Flame Patch damage on my last kill of Iskar I'm easily 40k dps ahead of the 2nd dps. It was ridiculously strong on big AoE and on the super short 20-30s kills of bosses we've been seeing over the last week.

Any idea if this makes class trinket worse than lets say prophecy or world boss trinket?

[Deleted]

Hello fire mages!
I've leveled a mage to 100 (included boost) in preparation for Legion and with that I have pretty much no mage experience.

I've been trying some on the dummy and I got a question.
How do you handle RoP/Flame On/Combustion CDs? I know that on combustion you want em all to line up and ready to use in the same burst window. But inbetween combustions how do you handle RoP/Flame On? Is it okay to camp on 2/2 RoP waiting for Flame On for X seconds etc?

Lookin for some quick guidelines. Thanks!

[deadman1]

It was pretty OP even without the class trinket, that just made it more obvious

Yeah but in typical blizz fashion they over nerf things.

[Deleted]

Yeah but in typical blizz fashion they over nerf things.

and whats even more outragous is that they do it to the mage class, like wtf?! it never happens, but i will say that the nerf was needed but i dont know if it should have been nerfed by 60ish% but i guess its alright when you consider that you can stack the patches.

[Sturmcantor]

Any idea if this makes class trinket worse than lets say prophecy or world boss trinket?

WarcraftMages posted some sims on AT that show class trinket still ahead of prophecy/gaze/alch trinket on a single target, so I assume we will continue to use sandmans/class trinket on most fights.

[Deleted]

The talent is a passive while LB is active. It makes sense that eventually it wouldn't be designed to be the best in most AOE situations (it can happen but it's rare). I expect LB to be the go to spell for almost all regular AOE, UM perhaps for ST or other niche uses and FP will likely remain for some AOE niche uses that I can't determine at the moment.

- - - Updated - - -

Adds that die extremely fast could be where FP is at, when LB doesn't have time to tick fully. I heard Frosted say something alluding to that.

[pyrostorm9001]

Yeah but in typical blizz fashion they over nerf things.

Not in this case.

Flamepatch ticks were 20% spell power once 7.0.3 hit
there was a massive bug and blizz only saw the damage output and buffed the spell to 60% spell power per tick
The ticking bug was fixed and it was nerfed down to 25% spell power

So in short, we good.

[Biomega]

Did some mythic dungeons after the nerf, and it's totally fine. Yes I no longer beat 740 people with my 710 gear, but then again I shouldn't. Still doing very well in terms of DPS.

[Shadow Fox]

WarcraftMages posted some sims on AT that show class trinket still ahead of prophecy/gaze/alch trinket on a single target, so I assume we will continue to use sandmans/class trinket on most fights.

Doesn't the class trinket just purge the hell out of your mana as a Fire mage with the auto-cast of Flamestrike? Has over double the mana cost of your DPS when it procs.

[Deleted]

Adds that die extremely fast could be where FP is at, when LB doesn't have time to tick fully. I heard Frosted say something alluding to that.

They would have to be a lot of them and die before 4s as even the initial explosion of LB would over take it, then 8s blows 1-2 FP out of the water. The fact that you can stack the patches alludes more to targets that live longer, so you can get the added damage of stacking the patches and are static so they stay in them.

Because LB has such a long cooldown(for a dot) it feels like it should have a detonate function, this would enable it to perform better at what it is good at, high density that wont live long enough to benefit from full FP stacking or adds that spawn together but then move around. You would still keep the 4s detonate time as that still has its benefits, but have the option to immediately detonate so you have more control if you need it, this can't be abused since it has a 12s cooldown anyways.