Fury Legion Discussion

[Roiids]

Not with current artifact power cost scaling. U will see how hard is to level up perk already after first major trait is finished. Especially with low artifact knowledge. Another thing is, u will often find yourself delaying CDs on mythic boss fights, cuz the point is not to pop CDs the second u get them, it about delays and use it at the right moment, or on targets with higher priority. CD management is really important for progression, that's why I would go for Helyas Wrath after 3 major traits are done. Sense death is another great perk to pick up after major traits, especially with juggernaut being a pretty bad perk with the amount of haste and crit we will have in the first tier of raiding. It's debatable. I just don't know if Sense death have a chance to trigger on legendary ring procs? If it does then Sense Death is far better.

I thought the ring was useless at 110?

[Deleted]

I thought the ring was useless at 110?

I'm talking about this ring http://www.wowhead.com/item=137052/ayalas-stone-heart ... It gives you a chance on your attacks to proc free Execute which you can use regardless of health level. Old WoDs Sudden death fury/arms talent.

[orgonutil]

Delaying rampage for max enrage uptime seems not hard to me without inner rage, but with inner rage i can't do it properly to get more dps than just BT-RB-X(Rampage if up, WB proc, FS),repeat =(

[Roiids]

I'm talking about this ring http://www.wowhead.com/item=137052/ayalas-stone-heart ... It gives you a chance on your attacks to proc free Execute which you can use regardless of health level. Old WoDs Sudden death fury/arms talent.

Ah my bad, so used to people talking about the current ring. As long as you are lucky enough to get all these legendaries. A lot of people are theorycrafting like they will have them all right away.

[Artunias]

Ah my bad, so used to people talking about the current ring. As long as you are lucky enough to get all these legendaries. A lot of people are theorycrafting like they will have them all right away.

Yeah...I still don't have one. Tomorrow will be 2 months of max level play on beta. Granted, I haven't been doing much beside my emissary quests and the occasional dungeon. But these things aren't going to be just falling out of the sky.

Not to mention that half of the ones you can get are complete garbage as well..

[Critizin]

I'm talking about this ring http://www.wowhead.com/item=137052/ayalas-stone-heart ... It gives you a chance on your attacks to proc free Execute which you can use regardless of health level. Old WoDs Sudden death fury/arms talent.

Why would you spec ur artifact on the premise that you even get the ring... sure if you get the ring while ur still progressing ur artifacts go for sense death. but its actually a dps waste to go for it with out the ring... Which has a very low drop chance not to mention you might get a legendary but it might not even be the ring..

Bad info is bad.

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IMO in all honesty the tree speccing path would look more like this.

[Valy]

What else?)

[Smog]

@Valy Rage of the Valarjar is the worst Dragon on the artifact. No reason to prioritize it and delay the other two.

[Qoma]

@Valy Rage of the Valarjar is the worst Dragon on the artifact. No reason to prioritize it and delay the other two.

It sounds good on paper - what makes it the worst? Low proc chance or something?

[Tellof]

It sounds good on paper - what makes it the worst? Low proc chance or something?

This is pure speculation on my part, but isn't Juggernaut kinda crappy? With how awkward the execute phase is on Warrior paired with only a 6 second window to use the next Execute, I can imagine the buff falls off fairly easily. Yes? No?

[Artunias]

This is pure speculation on my part, but isn't Juggernaut kinda crappy? With how awkward the execute phase is on Warrior paired with only a 6 second window to use the next Execute, I can imagine the buff falls off fairly easily. Yes? No?

It's easy enough to maintain, it just feels like shit to play. Any execute phase that's at least 30-40 seconds (almost all raid bosses on progression) it's really strong.

But we're also balanced around this infinity stack wonderland. They need to make the execute phase mechanically sound and cap juggernaut at some balanceable and reachable number. Juggernaut only works on raid bosses, which is the only thing that lets execute work. That's shitty.

If you aren't a raider, then yes, don't get Juggernaut until your last gold dragon.

[Critizin]

It's easy enough to maintain, it just feels like shit to play. Any execute phase that's at least 30-40 seconds (almost all raid bosses on progression) it's really strong.

But we're also balanced around this infinity stack wonderland. They need to make the execute phase mechanically sound and cap juggernaut at some balanceable and reachable number. Juggernaut only works on raid bosses, which is the only thing that lets execute work. That's shitty.

If you aren't a raider, then yes, don't get Juggernaut until your last gold dragon.

How does the execute phase feel shitty? it feels like the normal rotation just taking out the odd furious slash we would ever press lol

[Artunias]

How does the execute phase feel shitty? it feels like the normal rotation just taking out the odd furious slash we would ever press lol

Maybe on live with all of our gear and class trinket. But without Juggernaut it's a real garbage button to press due to all of our enrage handicaps not working. And even with 30-35% crit Bloodthirst can go some long streaks without critting.

Losing your mastery damage bonus, and all the rage income from the 100% increased auto attack speed, not to mention the raw auto attack damage as well. Kinda ruins everything.

On the beta you certainly don't have the rage to BT - Exe - Exe - BT unless you have really solid enrage uptime. Which all comes down to luck since all of our enrage handicaps become non functional. You can't Furious Slash due to GCD constraints (Juggernaut forces you to keep hitting execute every ability cycle even if not enraged to maintain your stacks). You can't use Rampage because you don't have the excess rage.

Juggernaut is the only thing that makes execute as a button work at level 110. It fails miserably without it. I have all my gold dragons and sense death on the beta. Sense Death is nice, but 15% chance for a free execute hardly makes up for your butchered enrage uptime. And heaven forbid some mechanic targets you that causes you to reset your stacks, might as well afk at that point.

Now yes, you can take Massacre. But Massacre is only good on a pure or at least huge majority single target encounter.

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Now, there's definitely a world out there with Tier Bonus and Legendary Helm/Ring that Massacre most likely becomes the default choice. The ring has a solid proc rate, and the enrage helm is A LOT of extra rage to limit the usefulness of Carnage (especially post nerf). You combine that with occasional free rampages and a longer enrage duration. Carnage loses even more value.

But that's requiring two Legendaries, out of a possible eight, and even people playing hard AF I don't know anyone who has gotten more than two Legendaries coming up on 3.5 months of playtime? Most people only have one or none.

That's hardly a scenario you can just expect to find yourself in after some reasonable amount of time. It could be a very, very long time to get the Legendaries you need.

[Tellof]

It's easy enough to maintain, it just feels like shit to play. Any execute phase that's at least 30-40 seconds (almost all raid bosses on progression) it's really strong.

But we're also balanced around this infinity stack wonderland. They need to make the execute phase mechanically sound and cap juggernaut at some balanceable and reachable number. Juggernaut only works on raid bosses, which is the only thing that lets execute work. That's shitty.

If you aren't a raider, then yes, don't get Juggernaut until your last gold dragon.

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately I'm probably not going to play Fury because of how much I hate the execute phase. I can tolerate Furious Slash making zero sense to have as an ability, and also live with the short enrage windows that feel pretty crammed, but when you add the execute phase onto it I just can't. I'm currently playing around with Arms to see how that feels, and so far I'm pretty happy with it.

[Archimtiros]

And in current M dungeons where the mobs melt in 2 seconds the AOE from rampage suffers often from that primary target issue.

That's an unavoidable issue of gear inflation, rather than an issue with the ability itself. Another reason why trying to use prepatch as an indication of balance is a bad idea.

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It's easy enough to maintain, it just feels like shit to play. Any execute phase that's at least 30-40 seconds (almost all raid bosses on progression) it's really strong.

But we're also balanced around this infinity stack wonderland. They need to make the execute phase mechanically sound and cap juggernaut at some balanceable and reachable number. Juggernaut only works on raid bosses, which is the only thing that lets execute work. That's shitty.

If you aren't a raider, then yes, don't get Juggernaut until your last gold dragon.

The infinite stack is definitely dumb, but I wouldn't call Juggernaut shit to play by any means. It works quite well with Massacre.

[Bigbazz]

Having a discussion about pre-patch pull rotation with a Warrior mate.. I've been doing Charge > Dragon Roar > Battlecry/Avatar + Bloodthirst > Raging Blow > Furious Strike > Rampage since as far as I can remember and to be honest since I've been slacking away from the game for a while I have not put much further thought into it.

However he saw me do that in a video and told me I was doing it wrong and I was a bad player. The only initial thought I had was that you would not have 10 stacks of Worldbreaker when you hit Dragon Roar if you do it as the first GCD, nor will you have any initial stacks of Empty Drinking Horn. What I'm seeing in logs is people delaying the Dragon Roar on the pull until after the first Bloodthirst + Raging Blow, often with an empty 3rd GCD with no FS (probably to avoid delaying the next BT/Rampage) and then Battle Cry + Avatar with either Bloodthirst or Rampage.

I can't see how this can actually make a big difference, but I haven't exactly been lighting the rankings on fire with my dps in my brief return to HFC this patch, which is why I'm fishing around to see what others are doing, and their findings.

[Timberwind]

@Archimtiros Hey I've not seen any bugfixes, or change threads, but our Rampage damage has changed to a ramp style, instead of 100, 100, 100, 200, 200. Now its 50, 150, 100, 300, 175. What is the point in doing that? I can see this being a problem in PVP.

[Archimtiros]

@Archimtiros Hey I've not seen any bugfixes, or change threads, but our Rampage damage has changed to a ramp style, instead of 100, 100, 100, 200, 200. Now its 50, 150, 100, 300, 175. What is the point in doing that? I can see this being a problem in PVP.

That was awhile ago. What is the problem? Keep in mind those numbers are misleading because different hits are MH, OH, or even both hands. Without getting technical, each hit is stronger than the last.

[Deleted]

Why would you spec ur artifact on the premise that you even get the ring... sure if you get the ring while ur still progressing ur artifacts go for sense death. but its actually a dps waste to go for it with out the ring... Which has a very low drop chance not to mention you might get a legendary but it might not even be the ring..

Bad info is bad.

I know ppl on this forum tend not read before they reply, but let me clear the air. I said Sense Death is debatable regardless if u have a ring or not. I was wondering if Sudden Death can trigger Sense Death, cuz tooltip on Sense Death doesn't specific is it working only when the target is below 20% health, and obviously that would make Sense Death perk priority. Also, I would actually prefer to get cloak or waist before the ring, maybe even helm, considering how weak fury's execute (hits slightly harder than raging blow with inner rage) is without juggernaut perk. My personal experience with mythic raiding is that u almost always have to delay CD for something. Either it's some other CD, or trinket, or there is higher priority target spawning for which u have to save your CDs, or there is some type of mechanic in which u can't be near to boss like example pillars on Tichondrius etc. So my info is not bad and until its proven wrong by theory crafters and actual big DPS loss ill stick with it

[Archimtiros]

I know ppl on this forum tend not read before they reply, but let me clear the air. I said Sense Death is debatable regardless if u have a ring or not. I was wondering if Sudden Death can trigger Sense Death, cuz tooltip on Sense Death doesn't specific is it working only when the target is below 20% health, and obviously that would make Sense Death perk priority. Also, I would actually prefer to get cloak or waist before the ring, maybe even helm, considering how weak fury's execute (hits slightly harder than raging blow with inner rage) is without juggernaut perk. My personal experience with mythic raiding is that u almost always have to delay CD for something. Either it's some other CD, or trinket, or there is higher priority target spawning for which u have to save your CDs, or there is some type of mechanic in which u can't be near to boss like example pillars on Tichondrius etc. So my info is not bad and until its proven wrong by theory crafters and actual big DPS loss ill stick with it

Sudden Death can proc Sense Death, however it's dependent on two separate forms of RNG to do what you have in mind (three if you include getting the ring in the first place):
1. Sudden Death proc.
2. 15% chance for Sense Death to proc.
*edit: Sudden Death doesn't have to crit to trigger Sense Death, was thinking about Massacre.*

So it's not going to be reliable in the least, and you certainly wont be proccing either enough to stack and maintain early Juggernaut stacks throughout the fight. It's a mediocre bonus if you happen to have these things, but not something that will come into play often at all. Even sub 20%, Sense Death is a very weak trait. Like most Fury mechanics, it's dependent on too much RNG (read: low chance to work) for the mediocre amount of damage it provides.