[Megathread] Pokemon GO

[DisposableHero]

There was software, I mean, they data mined the values in order to make that spreadsheet, was it not?



@ http://www.ign.com/wikis/pokemon-go/...d_Hidden_Stats

If so... according to the ToS:



@ https://www.nianticlabs.com/terms/pokemongo/en

Splitting hairs, but people using the IV calculator aren't deciphering, decompiling, disassembling, or reverse engineering any of the software as it states in the ToS, they are profiting from the use of knowledge that has entered the public domain that was gleaned by users breaking the ToS in the ways mentioned above.

[Rixis]

Doesn't really matter, it's still cheating. They broke the ToS to create a tool that allows you to acquire knowledge that you were not supposed to have, that will give you a slight of advantage over players who do not use that tool… isn't it so?

If it's not done inside the game, it's not part of the design, and thus unintended.

[GoKs]

Speaking as someone from a state with a huge amount of territory, I don't think you quite get the rural life fencers. Lured only work if you have a poke stop. Incense only works if you have Pokemon spawning at all. Eggs only work if you have poke stops, and travel can be impossible if you live 50 km away from the nearest town.

There are plenty of small towns like this, especially in West Texas, so don't dismiss their concerns because you don't know what it's like out there.

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Like it's really annoying to have someone from a major metro area dismiss rural concerns out of ignorance

Off topic..... Must be real difficult to catch some mon's on the moon hey? =P

[Crissi]

Off topic..... Must be real difficult to catch some mon's on the moon hey? =P

Only clefary, clef able, jigglypuff and wigglytuff here!

[Seegtease]

I think it happens if you by a chance find mon higher lvl than your level as a trainer is. That's why it happens more often when you start playing and happens rarely once you are higher level. And yeah, I can confirm it still happens for new trainers as my wife started play two weeks ago and got several CP?? mons during first few days...

Nope. According to the IV calculator, after powering it up once, it's level 23.5

I'm level 25. The only noteworthy thing I can think of is that the CP exceeds anything I've caught.

[-aiko-]

Apparently twitch is going to start cracking down on streamers who use third party apps or GPS spoof.

http://kotaku.com/twitch-cracks-down...ers-1784977822

[GoKs]

Splitting hairs, but people using the IV calculator aren't deciphering, decompiling, disassembling, or reverse engineering any of the software as it states in the ToS, they are profiting from the use of knowledge that has entered the public domain that was gleaned by users breaking the ToS in the ways mentioned above.

So... nvm not even gonna say it.

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Only clefary, clef able, jigglypuff and wigglytuff here!

Spoof baby.... come back to earth every once in a while =P.

Fencers.... change your location to "Niantic Headquarters".

[Deleted]

whats the point in having these IVs, if you have to use a 3rd party calc to know what they are? why not just either make IVs visible in game or just make CP the only stat?


its annoying me because i feel like i should check IVs of all my pokemon, but entering their stats on a calculator all the time is tiring, so far i havent really bothered with it, ive just been evolving my highest CP pokemon :\ im not really sure how much of an effect the IVs have, so not sure how much i am disadvantaging myself.

[Fencers]

No, there isn't any randomness except what spawns, not how much spawns. We're talking about how much here, not what it is.

How much is decided by how many people are playing, which is just flat out ridiculous that there is no minimum to allow people to play. Oh, and yet again, pokestops and gyms are chosen by Niantic, yet again, no degree of randomness.

I said there is a degree of randomness in the game. Right in the post you are quoting. Picking the spots beforehand and you happening to not live in an area with high density or near plenty of pokestops is bad luck.

Think it is 'ridiculous' is just subjective.

No it's not fine. It's bad game design.

That is your feeling. Unless you were there for the DD/T drafting. Otherwise, a designer/asrtist is free to create the game in any manner they wish.

There is no holy rule on how games should be.

You haven't even given a reason why it's fine besides YOU think it's fine.

Because the designers made it up, obviously. Whatever they wish to do in their design is up to them. How you feel about it is up to you.

Both of which are fine and dandy.

Yet again, can you give an actual reason why it's fine that people literally cannot play the game in rural areas?

They can play. It's just harder and/or less convenient from what such players are saying.

Travel, go somewhere else, live somewhere else, use incense, get a group together, etc, etc. The game is still functioning for these players. Circumstance of their location is their problem.

I'd beg to differ, since you don't want them to improve gameplay it appears by saying it's fine that rural players cannot play.

I did say I hope the situation improves for rural players. Twice, I believe. What I do not do or suggest is how that gameplay should be improved.

Niantic responding, that's a funny joke.

But seriously, all they've done is soft ban people for 30 minutes. There hasn't been a single permaban for spoofing. They clearly don't care that much in that case.

That's a subjective interpretation of the developers caring, or at best speculative. I am simply saying they consider it a violation of use as they have drafted their terms for the game.

So you don't care if they do cheat, but you need to put your opinion out on how it's wrong that they feel like they have to cheat to play the game?

Correct, I do not care if others cheat in the game. It seems like an interesting experiment to be frank. I do not have an opinion on them cheating either- I have repeatedly said that the game does not encourage cheating by design or gameplay expression. That is not an opinion. Gameplay is not opinion at all- no such thing can exist currently.

If a user states the gameplay or design does X, Y and Z it has to be directly expressed in the game or it is not valid at all. No one's opinion matters on subject for any game.

Your "commentary" isn't worth anything more than any of ours, unless YOU were there when Niantic designed the game either.

To the contrary, my commentary is flat statement of the game design as expressed in the gameplay of Pokemon Go. Commentary that is predicated on anything otherwise is not in the purview my addressment or the game itself.

Also, I'm not quite sure how you're even managing to try to argue that criticism isn't allowed/valid

This is a misunderstanding on your part. I said how you feel is fine. I am not necessarily interested on how you feel though. I am interested in game design, however.

especially considering you were criticizing the game yourself earlier for your own opinions.

I am quite critical of the game actually. I do not agree with many of the design decisions Niantic made in POGO.

Though I do not claim the design or interfacing with POGO is apart from that expressed in the gameplay.

And I've posted how none of that matters.

It does matter. They are part of the gameplay- it is the only thing that matters independent of our subjective desires.

Hatching eggs is a waste of time

Subjective commentary. Many players get pokemon through eggs that could not find despite plenty of lures or travel.

Incense falls into the same boat, you might as well just use incense and sit in one spot because it will still bring pokemon to you at set intervals.

But incense does bring Pokemon to the player if they are not a lured spot and better still if moving. Incense being not a as good as being at a lured spot with high density does not invalidate incense as a means within the game of attracting pokemon at a guaranteed interval. Which players have as an option of gameplay expressly.

when you're presenting this points of "Well, there's eggs and incense" and I'm telling you straight up those are outstripped by just sitting at a lured pokestop

Being less optimal, harder, more difficulty is simply a argument for equity. This is not an argument I am against, per se. Though it is not an argument I care about either.

I am focused on the design of the game and thereby how it is expressed in gameplay. Namely the claim that by design the game encourages cheating. Arguments have been made that it is less optimal in rural areas than dense urban areas. The gameplay as is current in POGO provides method to obtain Pokemon without having to be at a lured spot for hours- that's just a fact.

It might not be best, optimal or to your liking that eggs and incense are not as effective as a lured pokestop in central. But that is not my concern and I have never addressed such. Bummer, hope it gets better for those players. Nothing more to add.

you're falling back to saying "well all of what you say is opinions, and what I say is factual"

When I say something about the gameplay it is factual to the best of my knowledge. I can't lie about it- because we all have the same game app.

I can not lie and say eggs don't hatch if you walk about.

I can not lie and say incense doesn't bring pokemon at set intervals.

I can not lie and say Pokemon in the wild trigger at certain spots.

You personally thinking it sucks, too expensive, not optimal, harder, ridiculous, etc- is subjective. I am not interested in such.

well I'm sorry but you're wrong. Your point is collapsing upon itself when your point is itself a great example of how the design fails because they aren't enough to get people to walk around.

I am sorry unless you can show me that gameplay exists in this game that encourages violating the terms of use and design Niantic have created you are simply telling me how you feel. Which is nice and all but it is a poor conception and otherwise invalid argument.

It was sarcasm. The point is your argument of "they still had to travel to the pokestops" is silly, since the travel time is so minimal that it isn't even funny.

If I said earlier the degree of difficulty in POGO is neither equal or a point counter to the gameplay with regards to rural players having to travel further than urban player; why would the inverse be untrue?

Some have it harder than others, some may have to travel mere steps or miles; but in such cases the gameplay still uses travel as a point of design. Steps, feet or miles is still travel as a mechanic.

If someone has the good fortune to live atop of 5 pokestops or the misfortune to live ona flat plain of desolation for 90 miles in all directions- the expression of gameplay remains the same. Literally. It doesn't load up different for either player and the method by which one interfaces with the game is constant. Their circumstance is different but that is not accounted for in the design of POGO.

[Deleted]

i noticed just now that if you spin the pokeball on the capture screen, it starts sparkling and glowing, does this do anything? more exp on catch or something?

[Jester Joe]

i noticed just now that if you spin the pokeball on the capture screen, it starts sparkling and glowing, does this do anything? more exp on catch or something?

Yes, it's considered a curveball and gives you like, 10 or 50 more exp I think? Increases the chance too of capture.

Also makes it kinda stupid hard to catch though unless it's a huge pokemon

[Cthulhu 2020]

The Silph Road IV calculator is manually entered and specifically does not violate the TOS that bars access to the game.

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The Silph Road calc. It estimates the IVs based on HP/CP ratio. Which you can do at home with a protractor actually- my coworker did it.

The lines from the TOS that were getting people soft banned according to the sub-Reddit, Twitch's open letter and Nantic twitter/blog were these:



Which is why sites such as Pokeadvisor and Pokevision were shut down so quickly. They access the game. The Silph Road calc is just entering in numbers and guesstimating the curvature of the Pokemon arc.

As far as is posted in the TOS: http://pastebin.com/1tWSVL19, this is not a violation of terms and no reportage of such is thus been deemed cheating by Niantic.

Ah, so Niantic doesn't want you figuring out the IVs of your pokemon, so they put it in the ToS, but the loophole is being able to use a spreadsheet to find it out. Despite the obvious intent of the rules being that you shouldn't be able to find out the IVs.

Seems we all have a justification for our cheating.

[Deleted]

Yes, it's considered a curveball and gives you like, 10 or 50 more exp I think? Increases the chance too of capture.

Also makes it kinda stupid hard to catch though unless it's a huge pokemon

ah i see!

yeah thats why i asked, i threw like 10 balls at a magikarp but couldnt even get the ball near the damn thing when spinning it like that!

[Fencers]

whats the point in having these IVs, if you have to use a 3rd party calc to know what they are?

The Silph Road Reddit has the original spread sheet someone worked out the math with originally. It can be done yourself if you figure out the formula through observation supposedly.

its annoying me because i feel like i should check IVs of all my pokemon, but entering their stats on a calculator all the time is tiring, so far i havent really bothered with it, ive just been evolving my highest CP pokemon :\ im not really sure how much of an effect the IVs have, so not sure how much i am disadvantaging myself.

It's a pretty small different. Like 5-10% from most reports. That is even assuming you scale that 'mon to the high heavens.

So it's just a min/max-ers meta game for the most part. I think most people can ignore IVs and still play the game reasonably. It's not really that big a factor outside of gym battles- which don't do much for you anyway.

The big speculation is that when trainer v. trainer battling is released that IVs will matter more. But it's all just speculation at to how it will work out in the end.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Yes, it's considered a curveball and gives you like, 10 or 50 more exp I think? Increases the chance too of capture.

Also makes it kinda stupid hard to catch though unless it's a huge pokemon

I've actually gotten really good with the curveball and can hit most of the time now. It makes hitting the circle a bit harder, but the bonuses to catch the pokemon with curveball + accuracy bonus are additive.

[Fencers]

I've actually gotten really good with the curveball and can hit most of the time now. It makes hitting the circle a bit harder, but the bonuses to catch the pokemon with curveball + accuracy bonus are additive.

I been practicing curves for a while now. I have a 50/50 chance of landing one. I notice that the pokemon jump more frequently now and dive into the curves more than they used to in the past.

[Jester Joe]

ah i see!

yeah thats why i asked, i threw like 10 balls at a magikarp but couldnt even get the ball near the damn thing when spinning it like that!

I try moving the ball from the center after testing once to see the arch, and it helps honestly.

But most the time I just throw regular balls.

I've actually gotten really good with the curveball and can hit most of the time now. It makes hitting the circle a bit harder, but the bonuses to catch the pokemon with curveball + accuracy bonus are additive.

Did they fix the good/great/excellent throw exp bonus though?

[GoKs]

I been practicing curves for a while now. I have a 50/50 chance of landing one. I notice that the pokemon jump more frequently now and dive into the curves more than they used to in the past.

Well to be fair.... anything has a 50/50 chance.... either you hit or you dont... its 50/50 =P

[Cthulhu 2020]

The language on figuring out IVs is pretty obvious. "We don't want people figuring out the internal workings of the game." Some people used the game files to get the formulas, others gathered data to figure it out. One is considered cheating by the ToS, but due to the language of the ToS, the other isn't.

But here's the thing, you can figure out the % optimal value of your pokemon from the CP, HP, and dust required... but you can't figure out the exact stats for it unless you have looked at the game data. Combat damage values are hidden.

Niantic clearly wanted this to be a "Numberless" game as much as possible, like pokemon would be in real life. But of course they couldn't give you zero numbers or you'd have no idea as to the relative strength of your pokemon.

Stats such as effort values and individual values were introduced so that adults would enjoy playing Pokemon as well as children. Wired asked why they kept those stats hidden instead of letting players see them. Ohmori responded: “Each Pokemon does have a value but I don’t consider those data as parameters. I prefer to think of them as real, living creatures. It’s the same way that if you have a pet and someone else has the same breed of dog, it’s a different dog. That way people can play the game and my Pokemon will be different to your Pokemon even if they’re the same type.”

[Argarock]

Niantic really needs to tell us what stuff means..

What does the "XL" "xs" sizes mean?
What are the odds for catching pokemon?
(Balls, screwball, nice/great/excellent, color of the circle)
I mean, i've got it figured out after checking online, but all this should have been easily accesible in game.

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And.. pokemon has IV in this game?
That would have been nice to know, as theres nothing that would suggest that 2 pokemon with the same cp can have different stats. As we dont really see the stats