Pre-patch cinematics [spoilers] (duh)

[grondik]

I think that's why the loa told him to do it, you can even tell by Sylvanas expression she was shocked.

Exactly! I hope they also tell someone about troll leadership, cause... Cmon, mon, we aint got no semi-impotant troll karakters but Rokhan, mon.

[Raetary]

"They're coming from behind! Let's retreat and lose right now, instead of possibly dying but winning!"

Maybe you're right, but do you really want to be? It's either betrayal, which there is a good case for regardless, or it's spinelessness and cowardice. This has to happen for there to be an expansion, but it's still completely stupid. These are the leaders of the Horde & Alliance, arguably some of the most well-informed people in the world of Warcraft. They know what the world will be facing. If ever there was a time to fight to the end to secure the world, that would've been it.

Betrayer, or coward. Well, it's the Horde. Betrayer AND coward. But Blizzard loves them regardless of all the catastrophic fuckups they or their member races have been the direct cause of.

they are cowards for getting overrun and retreating.
dont know what cinematic you watched, but in the one i watched thrall was crawling to get to his weapon, baine struggling and vol'jin got stabbed by a demon.
it wasnt either stay, die and fail, or retreat, live and fail.

they werent winning, at all.

[Zethras]

Also what is it with the Horde at bad leadership decisions. Truely nothing can go wrong with Sylvanaas as Warchief... really? :P

It's Garrosh all over again

Plus who is the orc and troll leaders now?

Varok Saurfang is the orc racial leader, don’t know for trolls, i’m going to assume it’s going to be one of the shadow hunters that came with us to Draenor.

[Wildberry]

Brother ! Have you come to feast your eyes on lol'jins miserable defeat ?

Oh you know it! ~>2.5 years of MMO-Champion shitposting finally paid off.

Which tavern are we going to to celebrate? I like that one in the Valley of Strength.

Don't think so small, we're hitting all of them. At least the ones in upper-class green neighborhoods. No need to go slumming in Troll ghettoes.

[Ilir]

My gosh those cinematics.

Those events really messed with Sylvanas I would say. Before she was all about the "Forsaken must live on forever" but after what happened, I think she finally realised that not only the forsaken are at the mercy of death. Just seeing her speechless when she has to call the retreat/when she realises Varian just sacrificies himself/aswell as Vol'Jin death shows how much of an impact it had on her.

I just can't wait to see what she will do next.

----

Varian was such a badass like wow. I never really like him all that much but ... wow. His death was really good, at first I feared he was gonna be corrupted by guldan but hopefully not. ALso about his weapons, you clearly see their "life" fades away when he dies so I think that's why players won't get them as artefact skin or whatever because they lost all their power. Their power was tied to Varian and Lo'gosh. THey both died and so did the weapons.

----

Vol'Jin death... kinda sad to be honest, you could see he was in pain. I hope the horde will be able to avenge him and I really hope Sylvanas doesn't screw up.

---

We finally know why Genn hates Sylvanas so much more now and why he wants her dead asap. Can't really blame him.

[NFA]

Amazing cinematics all around, the Alliance one especially hit me in the feels.

Also Horde fucked up big-time by not just going "Hey we're getting flanked up here, we have to pull back." Instead they just fuck off and look like they abandon the Alliance for no reason.

[0bsessions]

What? No they didn't. They retreated clearly. Didn't you see the mass of demons that appeared on the ridge the Horde was at? I'm pretty pissed they never let the Alliance know they were bailing though.

Even still, at what point are they going to let the Alliance know? Sometime between retreating from the oncoming demon horde on their flank, or while trying to get a clearly hurt Thrall and their dying Warchief off of the battle field?

They sounded a retreat, very audibly. It certainly sucks for the Alliance that they got to real warning, but it's not like the Horde had time to send them a messenger and even if they had, said messenger probably wouldn't have been able to get to them and explain the situation before the Alliance called their own retreat.

Basically, the situation developed for no reason other than the inability between the two sides to cooperate. Based on the original Legion cinematic, there was no forethought to the Broken Shore invasion, both sides just kind of showed up and got thrust into a situation where they had to take on a greater enemy. That doesn't allot any time to really collaborate on a shared signal for retreat, leaving the only way of noting to the other side that you're doing so to be the actual act of retreating.

[Twilight Cultist]

"They're coming from behind! Let's retreat and lose right now, instead of possibly dying but winning!"

Maybe you're right, but do you really want to be? It's either betrayal, which there is a good case for regardless, or it's spinelessness and cowardice. This has to happen for there to be an expansion, but it's still completely stupid. These are the leaders of the Horde & Alliance, arguably some of the most well-informed people in the world of Warcraft. They know what the world will be facing. If ever there was a time to fight to the end to secure the world, that would've been it.

Betrayer, or coward. Well, it's the Horde. Betrayer AND coward. But Blizzard loves them regardless of all the catastrophic fuckups they or their member races have been the direct cause of.

You can see that on the Alliance side, they had the upper hand and were winning. The Horde, however, were being pushed back and had many people severely wounded. On top of that, a new wave of demons were coming. There was no possibility of winning. Staying meant death, and nothing more. So what is the better option? Stay and die for nothing, or retreat, regroup and try to figure out a way to fight the legion?

The Alliance did the same thing. Once they Horde retreated, the Alliance no longer had to upper hand. Staying would only result in needless death, so they too retreated. This was an unwinnable battle.

[Al Gorefiend]

Oh you know it! ~>2.5 years of MMO-Champion shitposting finally paid off.



Don't think so small, we're hitting all of them. At least the ones in upper-class green neighborhoods. No need to go slumming in Troll ghettoes.

You should probably go frolick in Silvermoon from now on. Better get used to tribal-themed Horde going away since Sylvanas as leader and Elf-exclusive hero classes are getting us to that point.

[Lupinemancer]

Yup, he had a vision about it.

So what do we learn:
1. Vol'Jin really died.
2. He really made her Warchief.
3. Sylvanas did not betray Varian.

Good, now those three theories can die.


Edit: Found some videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI0ZxY651AY << Horde, quality is fine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CIXrXpdl1k << Alliance-side, with Twitch-chat and meeh quality.

That's up for debate, just because a few were injured the ran like cowards, leaving the Alliance behind. If she had used her Val'kyrs to help, they might have been able to buy the Alliance enough time for their gunship to blow Gul'dan, and hte Demon's up. But because they fled, the Allaicne was forced to retreat.
I call that betrayal.

[Deleted]

I wonder if Varians shoulders are there somewhere in the ocean I would love them for transmog purposes

[Deleted]

Sun Tzu.

"The general who advances without coveting fame and retreats without fearing disgrace, whose only thought is to protect his country and do good service for his sovereign, is the jewel of the kingdom."

[Mehrunes]

"They're coming from behind! Let's retreat and lose right now, instead of possibly dying but winning!"

Maybe you're right, but do you really want to be? It's either betrayal, which there is a good case for regardless, or it's spinelessness and cowardice. This has to happen for there to be an expansion, but it's still completely stupid. These are the leaders of the Horde & Alliance, arguably some of the most well-informed people in the world of Warcraft. They know what the world will be facing. If ever there was a time to fight to the end to secure the world, that would've been it.

Betrayer, or coward. Well, it's the Horde. Betrayer AND coward. But Blizzard loves them regardless of all the catastrophic fuckups they or their member races have been the direct cause of.

The Alliance retreated too. In before "that's only because the Horde did it first", Genn said it himself, they can't win without Horde's support. Meanwhile, due to where they were positioned, the Horde had no Alliance support from the start. So the Horde needed to babysit them and still deal with their own demons and managed for a while before getting overrun. On the other hand Alliance falters the moment they are on their own, i.e. what the Horde was from the get go.

[Deleted]

These cinematics truly bring me joy. To see Varian's pathetic death at the hands of Gul'dan, an Orc. It warms my heart. And that betrayer Vol'jin getting his deserved end as well. Garrosh would be happy with this. And Thrall losing his elemental powers, it's as if all Garrosh' enemies have been punished.

[Raetary]

That's up for debate, just because a few were injured the ran like cowards, leaving the Alliance behind. If she had used her Val'kyrs to help, they might have been able to buy the Alliance enough time for their gunship to blow Gul'dan, and hte Demon's up. But because they fled, the Allaicne was forced to retreat.
I call that betrayal.

please watch the cinematic again and read your ignorant post.
they were clearly struggling.

[Kathranis]

Long live the lich queen.

God, that fan title annoys me so much.

She's already called the Banshee Queen in-game.

[Wildberry]

You should probably go frolick in Silvermoon from now on. Better get used to tribal-themed Horde going away since Sylvanas as leader and Elf-exclusive hero classes are getting us to that point.

In fairness, frolicking around Silvermoon is much better than stumbling around Darkspear Isle.

The "Tribal theme" is gone, but it was never really a unified theme. Orc buildings and Troll buildings never meshed very well together. Really, I enjoyed Garry's industrial revolution, so Silvermoon's a downgrade; however, it is still significantly better than Troll architecture, which could be mistaken for Murloc huts.

[Deleted]

"In the end, death claims us all."

Except that's exactly what she's been trying to avoid like the plague (pun intended) ever since she tried to kill herself after WotLK.

[Ulfric Trumpcloak]

Varian's death cinematic is the coolest thing since the Wrathgate. They did an awesome job with that one.

[Rend Blackhand]

These cinematics truly bring me joy. To see Varian's pathetic death at the hands of Gul'dan, an Orc. It warms my heart. And that betrayer Vol'jin getting his deserved end as well. Garrosh would be happy with this. And Thrall losing his elemental powers, it's as if all Garrosh' enemies have been punished.

It felt even better knowing that Lol'Jin and Varian's deaths were undoubtedly more painful than Garrosh's.