Demon Blades is Incredibly Unfun

[Jakkhel]

My personal problem with havoc is that the movement abilities are part of the rotation. It just annoys me. Its not that i want to just stand still and AA a boss. But i want my movement abilities to be used to dodge stuff or position myself correctly. I dont want them to be part of my dps rotation

I'd be fine if Vengeful Retreat didn't proc Momentum but they retained the same uptime (somehow), or instead gave Momentum's proc chance to something else. I am worried about lacking escapes when I need them, but Fel Rush is a really good damaging tool on its own. So it makes sense to use that in combat.

[wordup]

I actually do want to like it. I played a DH from 100-110 vehemently trying to ignore the momentum build.

My personal problem with havoc is that the movement abilities are part of the rotation. It just annoys me. Its not that i want to just stand still and AA a boss. But i want my movement abilities to be used to dodge stuff or position myself correctly. I dont want them to be part of my dps rotation

I'm referring more to Demon Blades than Momentum. People are welcome to dislike Momentum because I know it's quite polarising, but I think the anti-Demon Blades rhetoric is getting a bit tired now since it actually is a lot more complex than is being given credit for.

[Deleted]

I'm referring more to Demon Blades than Momentum. People are welcome to dislike Momentum because I know it's quite polarising, but I think the anti-Demon Blades rhetoric is getting a bit tired now since it actually is a lot more complex than is being given credit for.

I'm guessing a build without the movement abilities being part of it could look like this:

Chaos Cleave

Demon Blades

Any of them

Any of them

Fel Eruption?

Unleashed power?

Demonic.

That would give more abilities in the rotation and not use the movement abilities.


It still seems just very basic to me. Keep some stuff on cd and use Chaos strike

[wordup]

I'm guessing a build without the movement abilities being part of it could look like this:

Chaos Cleave

Demon Blades

Any of them

Any of them

Fel Eruption?

Unleashed power?

Demonic.

That would give more abilities in the rotation and not use the movement abilities.


It still seems just very basic to me. Keep some stuff on cd and use Chaos strike

If you want to strictly avoid movement, I'd say more likely would be [99 talent, FM is the only really good one]/Demon Blades/Bloodlet/whatever/Nemesis/Master of the Glaive/[FBarr for AoE, Chaos Cleave for ST]

Your goal is to ideally bounce your Fury up high and then drain it, staying on GCD, drain Fury, let the stacked up banked charges of DBlades to bounce you back up and rinse repeat the cycle. Eruption could work to add another CD spell but it is definitely the weakest on the tier.

[Wolfman31]

Demon Blades is a shit talent. There's no defending it. It could be doing a million DPS right now; there's no Recount/Skada meter for fun. Seriously, we're stuck with two buttons before Legion hits and one of them gets replaced by auto-attack with a talent? LOL! The class better have some serious button bloat at 110 to make me ever consider replacing the active builder with passive auto-attack crap. If this game gets any more simple, it could compete in the Special Olympics.

[Kithelle]

Demon Blades is a shit talent. There's no defending it. It could be doing a million DPS right now; there's no Recount/Skada meter for fun. Seriously, we're stuck with two buttons before Legion hits and one of them gets replaced by auto-attack with a talent? LOL! The class better have some serious button bloat at 110 to make me ever consider replacing the active builder with passive auto-attack crap. If this game gets any more simple, it could compete in the Special Olympics.

Yes...lets delete it because of one persons opinion? It doesn't matter that many people find spamming a ability constantly as boring if not more boring than DB...

What I don't get is that they made Bolderfist for Enhancement to avoid the constant spam of Rockbiter...yet made no bother to make anything similar for some of the other spammer specs.

[Schizoide]

Enhance handled this same issue much better. It also has a button that generates resources with no cooldown (Rockbiter), but the talent that changes it doesn't make it passive-- it puts it on a cooldown so the spec isn't GCD-locked and offers a small buff. This actually adds gameplay, and (IMO) plays/feels much better. Havoc should get the same treatment.

[wordup]

Demon Blades is a shit talent. There's no defending it. It could be doing a million DPS right now; there's no Recount/Skada meter for fun. Seriously, we're stuck with two buttons before Legion hits and one of them gets replaced by auto-attack with a talent? LOL! The class better have some serious button bloat at 110 to make me ever consider replacing the active builder with passive auto-attack crap. If this game gets any more simple, it could compete in the Special Olympics.

Honestly it takes a lot to respond to this politely.

The talent has significantly more to it than you state (but that is very clear that you aren't aware of how it works now or, especially at 110). This is, as I said on the first page, a case of "I don't like it, so it must be bad!" which is an extremely poor attitude to have.

- - - Updated - - -

Enhance handled this same issue much better. It also has a button that generates resources with no cooldown (Rockbiter), but the talent that changes it doesn't make it passive-- it puts it on a cooldown so the spec isn't GCD-locked and offers a small buff. This actually adds gameplay, and (IMO) plays/feels much better. Havoc should get the same treatment.

You see, there's an unusual thing here. Being someone who is involved in both specs a lot, I find it extremely unusual that so many automatically hate Rockbiter playstyles for Enhancement, but are staunchly pro-Demon's Bite as a spell given they are effectively the same (and you can find this across the board in places). I am trying very hard to avoid assuming people gravitating to "best DPS talent = best playstyle", but in some cases it kinda feels like that.

[Natrii]

I think demon blades may be more fun if we had a ludicrous amount of haste constantly procing the damage and fury gain. I mean it still would be kinda boring but at lest you would not be without a button to push more more than a second of 2

[MrTastix]

It's hard to truly judge Demon Blades without our full kit, because a lot of talents synergize well with each other and make situational skills more useful.

With talents like Bloodlet, Momentum and Demonic you'll be using a wider variety of skills. These encourage using Throw Glaive, Vengeful Retreat, Fel Rush and Eye Beam as part of your standard rotation.

[wordup]

I think demon blades may be more fun if we had a ludicrous amount of haste constantly procing the damage and fury gain. I mean it still would be kinda boring but at lest you would not be without a button to push more more than a second of 2

Haste works relatively similar between DBlades and DBite. Crit is more important for it because it allows for longer CStrike streaks so you bank up a larger DBlades pool when you come off GCD.

[xezar]

Honestly, when I first picked Demon Blades, I didn't even realize it was passive, so pretty sure I kept hitting 1 (where Demon's Bite was) like an idiot from 99 until I read the ability during an invasion in Azeroth XD

ATM I'll agree it's kinda awkward and odd, that your resource generator is completely dependent on auto attacks, but like the others have said, will wait until we have all our tools at 110 before making a decision.

[Haram]

I just wish Demonic Appetite had some more value. Right now I am not a fan of either talent. Demon Blades, to me, is very boring. And I am not a huge fan of the momentum build so Prepared is not something I would enjoy.

[Sarkol]

I actually do want to like it. I played a DH from 100-110 vehemently trying to ignore the momentum build.

My personal problem with havoc is that the movement abilities are part of the rotation. It just annoys me. Its not that i want to just stand still and AA a boss. But i want my movement abilities to be used to dodge stuff or position myself correctly. I dont want them to be part of my dps rotation

Then you have a choice to make. Play Demon Hunters knowing that the movement build is probably superior in a lot of cases, or play a class that doesn't require that. Demon Hunters without the movement aspect will be pretty bland, and they're designed that way unfortunately.

[Gemini Soul]

For a non-momentum build how does this sound/look @110

99=Blind Fury (Artifact Traits buff Eye Beam)
100=Demon Blades
102=Felblade or First Blood (with Felblade not having a min range it can be used as a proc based builder or First Blood which makes Blade Dance good for ST?) these 2 are the ones im not sure on
104=Any
106=Nemesis
108=Master of the Glaive
110=Chaos ST Fel Barrage Cleave/AoE

Things to do
Eye Beam on CD(with Artifact Traits)
CS to dump
Throw Glaive on CD (don't waste a charge always keep at least one on CD)

[Adoxe]

Wait, people ARE ACTUALY using that? Why? You loose a perfectly good ability and God knows how few abilities we have so far

Because it's better than the other two? Even if a talent is complete dogshit and incredibly boring to play with, if it increases your DPS by even 1% it's going to be used by everyone who actually cares about their performance in the end game raiding content. There is, sadly, no choices in that row unless you're playing solo or in a casual raiding scene.

I'll never understand how anyone over at Blizzard thought this talent was a good idea.

- - - Updated - - -

For a non-momentum build how does this sound/look @110

99=Blind Fury (Artifact Traits buff Eye Beam)
100=Demon Blades
102=Felblade or First Blood (with Felblade not having a min range it can be used as a proc based builder or First Blood which makes Blade Dance good for ST?) these 2 are the ones im not sure on
104=Any
106=Nemesis
108=Master of the Glaive
110=Chaos ST Fel Barrage Cleave/AoE

Things to do
Eye Beam on CD(with Artifact Traits)
CS to dump
Throw Glaive on CD (don't waste a charge always keep at least one on CD)

The only difference between Momentum and non-Momentum spec is that you take Nemesis instead of it. Everything else remains the same, including Fel Mastery and Bloodlet. Using Fel Rush on cooldown is a DPS increase even without Momentum.

[Vanyali]

Because it's better than the other two? Even if a talent is complete dogshit and incredibly boring to play with, if it increases your DPS by even 1% it's going to be used by everyone who actually cares about their performance in the end game raiding content. There is, sadly, no choices in that row unless you're playing solo or in a casual raiding scene.

I'll never understand how anyone over at Blizzard thought this talent was a good idea.

If you want to rant about "best performance" you should keep up to date and realize in 99% of cases Prep is best case, and the best case scenarios don't really apply to HFC at all (save large boss, but your HFC damage is going to be shit anyway).

As has been stated, however, if you think it's a boring talent you're probably doing it completely wrong.

[Deleted]

For a non-momentum build how does this sound/look @110

99=Blind Fury (Artifact Traits buff Eye Beam)
100=Demon Blades
102=Felblade or First Blood (with Felblade not having a min range it can be used as a proc based builder or First Blood which makes Blade Dance good for ST?) these 2 are the ones im not sure on
104=Any
106=Nemesis
108=Master of the Glaive
110=Chaos ST Fel Barrage Cleave/AoE

Things to do
Eye Beam on CD(with Artifact Traits)
CS to dump
Throw Glaive on CD (don't waste a charge always keep at least one on CD)

Sorry to say but it's awful, if you are ANY bit of serious about your dmg output, Fel Mastery and Bloodlet are your only choices right now.

[BobAwesome]

I like Demon Blades. Allows me to use other moves rather than spam the same button over and over and over and over.

[Deleted]

I like Demon Blades. Allows me to use other moves rather than spam the same button over and over and over and over.

Same, I don't see how people find spam abilities fun. Demon blades is fine as it is and should be viable way to play the class. For spammy playstyles you have enha shammies and other melee.