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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    That's usually how it is with the Horde. There's a lot of babbling about "reasons", and "honor", but in the end they're bullies who'll TAKE anything they WANT if they CAN.

    Which makes it very awkward how much crying there is any time they're shoved back.
    That sounds a lot like the Alliance in Battle for the Undercity and throughout Cata.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Yes, she definitely wants what remains of the Kingdom of Lordaeron for herself...

    ...and Gilneas, too...
    Most of it abandoned. What is captured is only the land abandoned by Gilneas when they built the wall and has then been occupied since vanilla by forces hostile to the Forsaken also since vanilla.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    ...and why not Arathi, since it's so conveniently nearby... (no, the undead Galen Trollbane doesn't have a legitimate claim, succession happens at the death of the noble in question and other Trollbanes still live, most notably Danath)
    Considering that undeath is actually a thing on Azeroth, it's hard to say. Galen considered it his just fine and conquered the place for himself somewhere before Legion. And Danath is not only the other sill alive Trollbane that we know of, what we do not know is if Danath even has a claim.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    ...wait did I just see some Forsaken apothecaries in Hinterlands? Must be my imagination.
    Research stating in Troll ruins in a zone that already has Horde presence. And that they already researched in vanilla from what I recall.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  2. #162
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Alliance is better in that regard.
    Not really, Its might equals right on both sides. The most recent obvious thing is the killing of sunreaves in Dalaran, Its brushed over and no one cares because Jaina took control. Or the invasion of the barrens justified through "its the right thing to do "

    But Forsaken method of warfare is exceptionally monstrous (plague bomb everything, rez a bunch of dudes and see what sticks), and it's the norm
    In a world of demon magic and fire mages, steam tanks and magic bludgeons the plague is no more evil than any of these.


    "demons" are a convenient scapegoat, but then in Draenor... they did the same without demons. Might makes right alright.
    in both cases a primitive culture shaped by constant violence from native species of the planet they inhabited were manipulated.

    Horde are, and have always been, a terrible neighbor.
    Doesnt make the Alliance any more tolerable who does what they want, and will slap "for the light" at the end of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  3. #163
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    Not really, Its might equals right on both sides. The most recent obvious thing is the killing of sunreaves in Dalaran, Its brushed over and no one cares because Jaina took control. Or the invasion of the barrens justified through "its the right thing to do ".
    It wasn't just Alliance losses in Theramore, Rhonin died in the blast, Vereesa narrowly avoided death. How could a pro-Horde faction be trusted after that? Of course there will be victims in a fighting, but Jaina actually had good reasons there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    In a world of demon magic and fire mages, steam tanks and magic bludgeons the plague is no more evil than any of these.
    A good difference is that magic has to be truly extreme to make a land uninhabitable. Blasted Lands, Thaurissan's Ragnaros fiasco and Deadwind Pass are good examples of that, but those are truly monumental and largely un-repeatable occurences. Everywhere else, a fireball hits and you can have a picnic there 15 sec later.

    Forsaken use the Plague like it's deodorant, then they have no way to clean it off. Surely you've noticed how pooped over their lands are?

    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    in both cases a primitive culture shaped by constant violence from native species of the planet they inhabited were manipulated.
    Yes. A logical explanation that's little comfort when they use your skull to pave a road.

    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    Doesnt make the Alliance any more tolerable who does what they want, and will slap "for the light" at the end of it.
    And yet the humans, dwarves and elves lived pretty amicably for the longest time, until the Horde came and obliterated half a continent.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Alliance is better in that regard. They start less wars.
    Especially during WoW. But wait, later on you said "and don't get me started with the Old Horde", which would imply you're talking about WoW period. Does not compute.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Bad apples on both sides. But Forsaken method of warfare is exceptionally monstrous (plague bomb everything, rez a bunch of dudes and see what sticks), and it's the norm.
    Oh, no, acid. Worst thing ever. It's totally not like both sides use all kinds of fire bombs that are just as destructive but have the potential to kill you slower, making you enjoy dying some more. Napalm shells? Flamethrowers in every second siege engine or Goblin/Gnome suit? Mages, Warlocks and Shamans? Super pleasant. And the only negative aspect of Forsaken resurrection is abusing the mental state of the people resurrected under specific circumstances. Which we've only seen once, only as a response to the Alliance breaking a truce where they got fucked by karma.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    And don't get me started with the old Horde, which not only slaughtered people, it killed entire kingdoms, for which they were all exe... no wait, merely isolated. Again, "demons" are a convenient scapegoat, but then in Draenor... they did the same without demons. Might makes right alright.
    Playable Horde is hardly responsible for actions of alternate universes' people (that were manipulated with just half of the picture by Garrosh).
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    It wasn't just Alliance losses in Theramore, Rhonin died in the blast, Vereesa narrowly avoided death. How could a pro-Horde faction be trusted after that? Of course there will be victims in a fighting, but Jaina actually had good reasons there.
    People died in war? And people of a neutral faction that broke their neutrality and picked enemy side did not get magical bubbles for protection by the Horde? Unheard of. The question is, how could the Horde trust Dalaran after they broke neutrality. And yet, they did.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    A good difference is that magic has to be truly extreme to make a land uninhabitable. Blasted Lands, Thaurissan's Ragnaros fiasco and Deadwind Pass are good examples of that, but those are truly monumental and largely un-repeatable occurences. Everywhere else, a fireball hits and you can have a picnic there 15 sec later.

    Forsaken use the Plague like it's deodorant, then they have no way to clean it off. Surely you've noticed how pooped over their lands are?
    They can't clean only the Blight in Southshore where they used a batch that was way too strong by accident. And it's really the Forsaken's problem how their lands look like. They are free to turn it into a Blight sea if they so please.


    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    And yet the humans, dwarves and elves lived pretty amicably for the longest time, until the Horde came and obliterated half a continent.
    They lived especially amicable with the Trolls from whom they stole the land. But it's OK when Alliance races do so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  6. #166
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    See that image?
    High Elves and Humans, working together to decimate trolls.
    Surely you realize that non-troll races for the most part have really good reasons to fight the trolls, what with the whole blood rituals and cannibalism thing. Hell, even the lovable dancing trolls of Darkshore turned to murder the moment they have a chance with the night elves shellshocked from the Cataclysm and Garrosh backing them up. Not to mention I still have some Zandalari coins stashed somewhere in the bank, helping them sure worked out great later in MoP. Trolls gonna troll mon.

    The Darkspear and Revantusk are super-cuddly troll kind, by the way. Most forest trolls (so the Amani kind, which the elves and humans fought for so long) are so bad even Thrall - yes, THE Thrall couldn't "believe they were once part of the Horde" in Warcraft 3, if memory serves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Only to the Alliance.
    Because when they met the Trolls and Tauren, they allied with them.
    When nobody wanted the Forsaken, they took them in.
    And when the Alliance betrayed the Blood Elves, who took them in..?
    PS. Did you forget that the Legion is the reason why the Orcs attacked the Draenei?
    If anything, post-Warcraft 3 orcs, and uncorrupted ones like Garrosh, and WoD orcs prove that Legion is not the reason. Orcs will just pillage you the moment they think they can. Orcs are naturally as battle-hungry as goblins are greedy, nothing wrong with such characterization of a fantasy race, but lorewise it makes them a threat to pretty much everyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Godwin
    You didn't.
    Last edited by mmocd2effbd770; 2016-08-13 at 03:40 PM.

  7. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alsonia View Post
    I love people justifying Sylvanas by "Not knowing it was happening" if she can't keep ONE race in line, good fucking luck with the Horde.
    The only time when people say "She did not know about that" was the plan to plague the Horde, the Alliance and the Scourge (Varimithras plan)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Surely you realize that non-troll races for the most part have really good reasons to fight the trolls, what with the whole blood rituals and cannibalism thing.
    I think is mostly that the Trolls are easy to attack anyone, so they easily become enemy of whoever

    If anything, post-Warcraft 3 orcs, and uncorrupted ones like Garrosh, and WoD orcs prove that Legion is not the reason. Orcs will just pillage you the moment they think they can. Orcs are naturally as battle-hungry as goblins are greedy, nothing wrong with such characterization of a fantasy race, but lorewise it makes them a threat to pretty much everyone.
    They are used to battle, that's what they culture was build around (war), it have been changing with the new horde, but Garrosh wanted to bring back the old ways

    - - - Updated - - -

    They can't clean only the Blight in Southshore where they used a batch that was way too strong by accident. And it's really the Forsaken's problem how their lands look like. They are free to turn it into a Blight sea if they so please.
    I'm pretty sure they are working on that (you get a couple of quest to help clean it up, but they say it would take a while)

  8. #168
    Bloodsail Admiral Cien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xorn View Post
    Dead is dead is dead. Why is one way of killing someone inherently worse than another when both have the same end result?
    because even when the crazy bad man of your faction thinks its also a bad idea, you *know* its super bad

  9. #169
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cien View Post
    because even when the crazy bad man of your faction thinks its also a bad idea, you *know* its super bad
    except he actually didnt care. He didnt want them to use it because it meant less Forsaken Casualties. When they use it anyways in southshore and other places he doesnt lift a finger, because he hated the Alliance more than the Forsaken.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  10. #170
    Bloodsail Admiral Cien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendlyimmolation View Post
    except he actually didnt care. He didnt want them to use it because it meant less Forsaken Casualties. When they use it anyways in southshore and other places he doesnt lift a finger, because he hated the Alliance more than the Forsaken.
    thats irrelevant regardless, its still reason as to why people don't like the idea of sylvanas as a warchief anyway :3

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Cien View Post
    thats irrelevant regardless, its still reason as to why people don't like the idea of sylvanas as a warchief anyway :3
    And yet, Forsaken were given the strain of Blight they used in other places in Cata by the rest of the Horde and with their blessing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  12. #172
    Titan Maxilian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    What about the living people being kept as spider chow in the mines, right to the south of Stillwater's fun camp, then? Or the brainwashed human pet walking around undercity? Or a number of deadly "human" experimentation that apothecaries do constantly in quests (crusader and dwarf in Tirisfal Glades, draenei in Hellfire Peninsula)?
    I don't have the wish to look for all those cases, but the human pet walking around undercity its non-canon, its a reference to Fable (to Theressa, the sister of the main character of Fable 1)


  13. #173
    The Lightbringer steelballfc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    The High Elves invaded their holy lands to build a city.
    The humans of Arathor joined the massacre so they could teach magic.

    But I guess when the Alliance massacres it's justified.
    And when the Horde does it they are all pure evil.
    That's the Alliance-bias people on the forum hate so much.


    Except everyone that is allied with them ofcourse.
    I didn't.
    You however totally fail to understand what a 'Godwin' actually is.
    The Horde is what the Alliance hated in Azeorth, everyone they exiled, fought and put in camps, the Horde is based on hatred toward the Alliance - manly humans - even if we exclude the Orc's because for whatever reason the orc's indeed engage first, but all other Horde races didn't - also including the New orc Horde - .

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxilian View Post
    I don't have the wish to look for all those cases, but the human pet walking around undercity its non-canon, its a reference to Fable (to Theressa, the sister of the main character of Fable 1)
    but there is humans under-experiment in under-city.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    I just love the idea of "I want to murder people in moderation".
    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    the only "positive" in your case is that, unlike Blizzard's writers, you aren't paid for that.

  14. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    That's the Alliance-bias people on the forum hate so much.
    Is it better or worse than the Horde-bias people on the forum hate so much?

    Horde expansion - or expansion attempts in Azshara, Ashenvale, Darkshore, Theramore, Gilneas, Ambermill, Southshore, Stonetalon are all very recent history, and if the best example of bad, baaaad conquering Alliance people can find is literally at the dawn of human history, then I'd say it's very far from equal.

    Sure, nations fight and take lands from one another. Alliance nations too, there was the Barrens incursion, the sacking of Stonard, the Dalaran business. But when it comes to both quantity and scale of these power grabs, they're simply incomparable. I play both, did quests on both, and the Horde is and has always been way more aggressive, and way more destructive.
    Last edited by mmocd2effbd770; 2016-08-13 at 04:21 PM.

  15. #175
    The Lightbringer steelballfc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Is it better or worse than the Horde-bias people on the forum hate so much?

    Horde expansion - or expansion attempts in Azshara, Ashenvale, Darkshore, Theramore, Gilneas, Ambermill, Southshore, Stonetalon are all very recent history, and if the best example of bad, baaaad conquering Alliance people can find is literally at the dawn of human history, then I'd say it's very far from equal.

    Sure, nations fight and take lands from one another. Alliance nations too, there was the Barrens incursion, the sacking of Stonard, the Dalaran business. But when it comes to both quantity and scale of these power grabs, they're simply incomparable. I play both, did quests on both, and the Horde is and has always been way more aggressive, and way more destructive.
    the problem is that who ever "fan-something" when ever his char/faction suffer or loses, he/she punish other fans for what happen to his fav char/faction, he punish other fans and curse them for something they had nothing to do about it, they can't write the story they are just fans of other char/faction.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    I just love the idea of "I want to murder people in moderation".
    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    the only "positive" in your case is that, unlike Blizzard's writers, you aren't paid for that.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Is it better or worse than the Horde-bias people on the forum hate so much?

    Horde expansion - or expansion attempts in Azshara, Ashenvale, Darkshore, Theramore, Gilneas, Ambermill, Southshore, Stonetalon are all very recent history, and if the best example of bad, baaaad conquering Alliance people can find is literally at the dawn of human history, then I'd say it's very far from equal.

    Sure, nations fight and take lands from one another. Alliance nations too, there was the Barrens incursion, the sacking of Stonard, the Dalaran business. But when it comes to both quantity and scale of these power grabs, they're simply incomparable. I play both, did quests on both, and the Horde is and has always been way more aggressive, and way more destructive.
    It's incomparable in quantity? Barrens, Durotar, Mulgore, Western Plaguelands, Silverpine, Tarren Mill, Orgrimmar, Undercity, Stonetalon as well (the zone was split before and both sides wanted to drive each other out). And Ambermill is actually an example of Alliance expanding in the first place. It was a former Gilnean town that the Dalaran Mages captured for potentially anti-Forsaken purposes. And considering the Undercity part was after Alliance already learned that the Wrathgate was done by Burning Legion oriented rebels that ousted Horde aligned Forsaken out and this ousting is the very reason why they attacked when they did, they got pretty close to scale since they almost captured a Horde capital. And then declared war. And then attacked Barrens before Garrosh attacked Ashenvale. Always more aggressive indeed. Dawn of human history indeed. Far from equal indeed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  17. #177
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Always more aggressive indeed. Dawn of human history indeed. Far from equal indeed.
    Barrens - fair enough.

    Durotar - they've always been there, in Cata they're finally kicked out. Not an expansion.

    Mulgore - for real? Is there anything in Mulgore wearing shoes? How's that an expansion?

    Silverpine - don't worry, my Forsaken character murdered all those sneaky mages before they could do something awful, like help the Banshee Queen get her revenge on the Lich King ever again, and showed the Gilnean rebels that when the Horde comes to take their entire country they should just sit down and stay down. That'll learn'em.

    WPL - fair enough.

    Ashenvale - it was Grommash who attacked Ashenvale, the hostilities never ceased, and Garrosh merely intensified it due to his delusions of grandeur.

    The Alliance puts a couple towers down and burns down a couple of tents, in the same timeframe the Horde carpet bombs villages and cities, razes huge batches of forests (so much the wood is "left to rot", from an Ashenvale questline), builds strip mines and raises entire spiky fortresses. Yes, far from equal. I don't know how anyone could see it as equal.

    Enough off-topic from me, it seems we won't be seeing eye to eye on that matter, so... nice chatting with you, have a good day!
    Last edited by mmocd2effbd770; 2016-08-13 at 05:12 PM.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by earthwarden View Post
    Yes, she definitely wants what remains of the Kingdom of Lordaeron for herself...

    ...and Gilneas, too...

    ...and why not Arathi, since it's so conveniently nearby... (no, the undead Galen Trollbane doesn't have a legitimate claim, succession happens at the death of the noble in question and other Trollbanes still live, most notably Danath)

    ...wait did I just see some Forsaken apothecaries in Hinterlands? Must be my imagination.

    Yeah, she just wants to be left alone. And maybe conquer juuuuust a little bit. Only the places that she can reach, then her reach increases with each conquest, then... before we know it she owns a third of a continent. How is she different from Garrosh, besides "you couldn't become an orc to gain value for Garrosh, but you can become undead for Sylvanas"?
    You unintentionally proved my point, that is exactly the difference between Garrosh and Sylvanas. The Gilneas invasion was under orders of Garrosh and that is clearly stated multiple times. Sylvanas would not have invaded Gilneas without orders from Garrosh Hellscream. This is something I think a lot of people don't know, but you can look it up on wowpedia, ingame and I also believe it's mentioned in her short story.

    In the others, the Forsaken as far as I know had no intent to invade or take over Hinterlands (although admittedly they were being pretty shady) and even cooperated with the native trolls against the Alliance. Arathi is a no-man's land and would naturally be contested, the Trollbane lineage as well as the entire kingdom of Arathor has been pretty handily torn apart by now. Its kingdom is destroyed, its people are scattered, the entire highlands is almost entirely wilderness with various troll and ogre settlements. Additionally, Danath Trollbane has only just now returned from Outland and I would say that means he hasn't made a particularly strong claim to what may be rightfully his land. As Galen is still technically not dead, he does have some right - at least as far as the Forsaken are concerned - to his claim on his nonexistent kingdom. You kinda can't call claim on a castle you leave for years upon years while the direct heir is still there.

  19. #179
    I don't really get why people absolutely believe the spirits chose Sylvanas. I believe that Vol'Jin chose her according to some information he got from the spirits in addition to what Sylvanas did, which is quite different.

    Let me explain myself:

    Vol'Jin never trusted Sylvanas. Seems legit, who would ? Not much to argue here. She has history, she is know to serve her own interests, sometimes her people interests and she does not take orders easily, if at all. Plus, at the end of SoO she clearly says that she "has no loyalty toward the new Troll Warchief but respects him for what he has accomplished and is eager to see what will come of his leadership". It's fair to assume that anybody would at least watch their back / be careful when dealing with her.

    Sylvanas saved the Horde on the Broken Shores. She did it after Vol'Jin asked her to "not let the Horde die today". It's arguable whether or not she just followed the Warchief orders or if she did it for other purposes. When Vol'Jin says he will die soon, she does reply that death claims everybody in the end, even her. This is a reminder that she's dependent from Val'kyr to bring her back when necessary. As far as we know, she's running low on Val'kyrs (4-5 remaining).

    Still, Sylvanas does call in her Val'kyrs in the middle of the a battlefield, in the enemy territory, while losing. It means that she risks her own survivability to save the Horde, she didn't need them to save herself as we see her just riding back to the ship. Now, that is something that she was NOT known for.

    What did she have to gain from it ? Be my guess ( I don't know much about the reviving of dead people, but wouldn't she gain a lot more to raise all / leaders of the Horde as undead ?). Is it enough to trust her ? Hardly arguable. Does it give her the benefit of the doubt ? Arguable. Also, it seems like she got Varyan to somewhat trust her in the first place. Nonetheless, everyone has to decide for themselves. It sure did an impact on Vol'Jin as he would "never have imagine ... that she would be the one to them [them]". He has been proved wrong about Sylvanas, despite all his insight, I can get behind the idea that Vol'Jin would somewhat trust her now.

    I also ticked when Sylvanas said "but the Horde will live on". We know that Sylvanas and the Forsaken depend on the Horde for their survival as they would be crushed by the Alliance forces otherwise, and that's pretty much the only reason they are in the Horde. But Sylvanas is (was ?) more of a "but the Forsaken will live on" mentality. I would have expected her to say nothing rather than this line. Is it a hint that her mindset shifted to some degree from "the Forsaken" to "the Horde" over the years ?

    Regarding the spirits, "they whisper a name, many will not understand", they "granted him clarity" and a "vision". Vol'Jin does NOT give us that name nor he discusses about the vision. I don't know a lot about Loa, just that they are Wild Gods, but I highly doubt they really care about the leadership of the Horde in itself, but that they care more about Azeroth overall. I believe what Vol'Jin saw was not necessarily Sylvanas as Warchief, but some other events that will require someone with power and capable of understanding what "many will not understand" to overcome those event, and Vol'Jin has now the clarity to see that Sylvanas is the only one among the potential Warchief that will be able to understand and take the decision that others would not.

    I'm still trying to figure out the "depart of the shadows" as "stop being shady, you have proven you can do it the other way" or "come forward, you have the main role now". I feel that it's both at the same time. She was always put aside since the beginning of the Horde, no Warchief ever trusted her, which must be frustrating after some times, even more when you realize she is the last Leader of the base horde factions (Thrall (peaced out), Vol'jin (Dead), Cairne (Dead), Sylvanas).

    She also seemed a bit surprised that Vol'Jin make her Warchief as he was giving her shit until now, at least it feels to me that she was expecting to take some more up until she heard "Warchief". Now that she is in the spotlight she will have some pressure, it will be harder for her to be shady as she will not get off as easily as before and more eyes are focused on her. Her pride will probably deny her the envy to go Garrosh way, as she HATED him and would not see herself compared to him.

    Although, Sylvanas always had great ambitions, she now have the status / power to accomplish then in a non-shady manner. For example, bringing her sister Vareesa to her side, while she was only the regent of the Forsaken, Vareesa must have died and brought back for the Forsaken to accept her, as of now, it would be much easier and no one has to die (not taking into account Vareesa's betrayal). Point is, being appointed Warchief and recognized as by the living and not (only) as "that shady selfish undead bitch" gives space for her evolution and might remind Sylvanas of her former life as a Ranger-General and act as such.

    My thought on the Vol'Jin vision (potential Legion storyline / quests spoilers)


    For those of you who had a Beta access, you certainly have started the quest line involving a bright object falling from the sky.

    Well, this leads to you meeting a Naa'ru telling you that Illidan is a key to defeating the Legion
    I think the name whispered in Vol'Jin's vision is also Illidan Stormrage.

    As you might know, he is also a controversial character for what he did in the past. The quest chain try to explain his actions through his eyes and that ultimately he is doing it for saving Azeroth, defeating the Legion, his people, its survival. He's pictured has having good intentions but he's very disregardant / clumsy in doing so.

    I believe that at some point into Legion, we, people of Azeroth will have to deal with him ( whether he seeks help, get freed, whatever you can think of), on way or the other, we will have to make a decision going Illidan's way or not. This is the vision that Vol'Jin had or some consequences of it.

    Point is, Vol'Jin knows about Illidan's controversial past and that he is NOT welcome on Azeroth. Especially in the Alliance with the Night Elves. Varyan is dead, Andiun is very young and new king. Tyrande will be VERY vocal about how to deal with Illidan if he is to show himself as she and Malfurion banned him, most Alliance leader will probably listen to Tyrande. Looks like a dead end for Illidan.

    Horde wise, orcs have bad history with demons wanting to enslave them, trolls have for a long time been reluctant dealing with demons and fel energies, Taurens and Pandaren still are, Goblins are like "Ya got no m'ney mate". Dead end for Illidan.

    So all is left are Blood elves and Forsaken. He has some blood elf illidari so it's worth a shot but it is arguable since the Sunwell has been purged thanks to Velen and Muru's sacrifice (no need for new magic source) and that that would be better off not dealing with half-demon fel-waving night elf (Night elves banned the Blood elves ancestors, the High Elves, thousands of years ago, and Illidan knows too well what it's like). So all is left are the Forsaken and it will probably won't be enough for Illidan's purpose.

    Basically, it would all fall off to the Forsaken. I think he has a lot in common with Sylvanas, they are despised, unwanted on Azeroth and considered abominations (undead and almost full demon), they don't really care about what they have to and what other people think as long as the result is here. Hence, her ability to understand. But, even if the Forsaken were willing to go Illidan's way, there will be NO WAY to convince the rest of the Horde as the Banshee Queen.

    Finally, I think Vol'Jin takes the leaps of faith with Sylvanas. As the Warchief, she will have the power to take the decision for the Horde it necessary when the time comes. She might also be able to prove herself trustworthy and convince the other leaders.


    TL;DR I believe Vol'Jin was NOT whispered the name of Sylvanas and that he witnessed an event in his vision. That event will lead to a decision making that among the potential Warchiefs, only Sylvanas will be able to do correctly, even though "many will not understand".
    Last edited by Kalywien; 2016-08-13 at 05:12 PM. Reason: wording / typos

  20. #180
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    Silverpine - don't worry, my Forsaken character murdered all those sneaky mages before they could do something awful, like help the Banshee Queen get their revenge on the Lich King ever again, and showed the Gilnean rebels that when the Horde comes to take their entire country they should just sit down and stay down. That'll learn'em.
    you find out they are planning to aid an Alliance invasion into Lordaeron.


    Ashenvale - it was Grommash who attacked Ashenvale, the hostilities never ceased, and Garrosh merely intensified it due to his delusions of grandeur.
    The night elves attacked first.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

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