Vengeance Buffs 16 August.

[shanthi]

Sorry I wasn't arguing when I posted that I was just pointing out that did get slightly buffed also.

Yeah, which is probably fair. Warriors and DKs got a bit nerfed. The surprise to me was that brewmasters didn't get any buffs and guardian druids didn't get any nerfs.

[madmossy]

Yeah, which is probably fair. Warriors and DKs got a bit nerfed. The surprise to me was that brewmasters didn't get any buffs and guardian druids didn't get any nerfs.

Saving the best and worst for last probably.

[Melsiren]

Yeah, which is probably fair. Warriors and DKs got a bit nerfed. The surprise to me was that brewmasters didn't get any buffs and guardian druids didn't get any nerfs.

Saving the best and worst for last probably.

Celesalon in all his paint huffing hubris probably thinks Brewmasters are fine and just need to learn to play.

[JoshuaNLG]

Buff was nice, it remains to be seen if it's enough to compete with the other tanks though, but my Physical damage reduction on Demon spikes is sitting on 49% now, though this may be bugged because my mastery is sitting at -38%.

[kaiz3n]

I like the changes, was definately in the dh paper camp. Hopefully this plays out, would love to see how it handles on beta though...

[Deleted]

Does anyone think that these changes might make DH a little too good which may force a nerf early in Legion? So far the impression I've gotten is that DH are really strong in every aspect of tanking (utility, mobility, damage etc) apart from taking damage where they are quite spikey, these changes will help in that area a lot effectively leaving DH with no weaknesses? Except I guess sustained magical damage?

[JoshuaNLG]

Does anyone think that these changes might make DH a little too good which may force a nerf early in Legion? So far the impression I've gotten is that DH are really strong in every aspect of tanking (utility, mobility, damage etc) apart from taking damage where they are quite spikey, these changes will help in that area a lot effectively leaving DH with no weaknesses? Except I guess sustained magical damage?

Guardian druids are still superior.

[Twistedelmo]

Anyone finding Soul Cleave to either not heal or not heal much against Boss level mobs? In specific Invasion Boss's

[Deleted]

Buff was nice, it remains to be seen if it's enough to compete with the other tanks though, but my Physical damage reduction on Demon spikes is sitting on 49% now, though this may be bugged because my mastery is sitting at -38%.

Its a Bug, since I got it too. -46% =[

[shanthi]

Does anyone think that these changes might make DH a little too good which may force a nerf early in Legion? So far the impression I've gotten is that DH are really strong in every aspect of tanking (utility, mobility, damage etc) apart from taking damage where they are quite spikey, these changes will help in that area a lot effectively leaving DH with no weaknesses? Except I guess sustained magical damage?

They're still prone to being spiked down when Demon Spikes isn't up. Self-healing is great, but you can't heal dead. These changes really don't help with that--more self-healing doesn't make them less spiky and they were already okay when Demon Spikes was up.

[Melsiren]

They're still prone to being spiked down when Demon Spikes isn't up. Self-healing is great, but you can't heal dead. These changes really don't help with that--more self-healing doesn't make them less spiky and they were already okay when Demon Spikes was up.

Pretty much, We need increased base DR, or more HP to fix the spike problem.

Alternatively, I'd be fine with damage buffs as a trade off.

[Krille]

Pretty much, We need increased base DR, or more HP to fix the spike problem.

Alternatively, I'd be fine with damage buffs as a trade off.

This. I don't want Vengeance to be just another tank spec. I'd want it to have some flair. We can heal for shitloads with this new hotfix. I'm running at 45k hps in mythic dungeons on AOE pulls.

[aikanaro]

Pretty much, We need increased base DR, or more HP to fix the spike problem.

Alternatively, I'd be fine with damage buffs as a trade off.

The best thing I can think of to fix the issue without being too op is to make soul cleave overheating either add a bubble for part of the overhealed amount or make it add a hot for some of the overhealed amount if the bubble is op. But this is at 100, 110 who knows.

[Krille]

The best thing I can think of to fix the issue without being too op is to make soul cleave overheating either add a bubble for part of the overheated amount or make it add a hot for some of the overheated amount if the bubble is op. But this is at 100, 110 who knows.

So.. Just another Death Knight tank? Nah man. We will have "hot"-healing in legion with the artifact passive that makes fire damage heal us for 30% of damage done.

[jayinjersey]

They're still prone to being spiked down when Demon Spikes isn't up. Self-healing is great, but you can't heal dead. These changes really don't help with that--more self-healing doesn't make them less spiky and they were already okay when Demon Spikes was up.

That should be easier to manager with Feed the Demon and Soul Barrier I would imagine.

[aikanaro]

So.. Just another Death Knight tank? Nah man. We will have "hot"-healing in legion with the artifact passive that makes fire damage heal us for 30% of damage done.

Never played DK passed 72 lol.. I don't really know their mechanics. I've always been a sword and board tank. Except in Rift, I played a rift stalker in Rift and it was the most fun I have ever had tanking because of all the mobility which is why I decided to reroll demonhunter. Also I thought it was 15% of the amount healed from charred War blades. I do not think the fix will come in the form of more HP. More HP doesn't necessarily fix the spikieness it just give players more reaction time. Well that would work and make it better for players with lower reaction times, it promotes bad gameplay.

- - - Updated - - -

That should be easier to manager with Feed the Demon and Soul Barrier I would imagine.

Soul barrier is not a good Talent choice sadly.

[Krille]

Never played DK passed 72 lol.. I don't really know their mechanics. I've always been a sword and board tank. Except in Rift, I played a rift stalker in Rift and it was the most fun I have ever had tanking because of all the mobility which is why I decided to reroll demonhunter. Also I thought it was 15% of the amount healed from charred War blades. I do not think the fix will come in the form of more HP. More HP doesn't necessarily fix the spikieness it just give players more reaction time. Well that would work and make it better for players with lower reaction times, it promotes bad gameplay.

15% is correct, my bad! It's still kind of a HoT with immolation aura and Sigil of Flame dealing DoT fire damage.

[elfporn]

For those thinking of the spikiness of veng tanking without spikes up, theres a talent that reduces spikes cd by 1sec per soul fragment consumed, and then the 4p bonus from nighthold reduces spikes cd by 3sec per soul cleave.

With the 4p bonus we will have 100% uptime on spikes, with the talent, just a bit under 100%

the health spikes can be smoothed, but don't necessarily have to be with last resort.

[Melsiren]

This. I don't want Vengeance to be just another tank spec. I'd want it to have some flair.

I just feel Vengeance should deal more damage to fit it's class fantasy. It seems blizzard only cares about the concept of class fantasy when used to justify nerfs or complete reworks to a functioning spec.

I'm a VENGEANCE Demon Hunter, you might hit me hard but I give what I take.

When the spec was first announced, my mind first went to MoP era Vengeance. (Yes, I understand why it had to go away.) Some part of me was hoping that the spec would be a more balanced version of that concept, although I know my hopes were in vain.

[Munkky]

Charred Warblades is one of our lower heal mechanics. Lower than souls, soul rending, spirit bomb, the ring, soul cleave.

Soul barrier will be worse than last resort in 95% of all instances.

Even with the buffs, guardian warrior and dk are better surv wise and we are middle ground for dps.

Demon Spikes has a baseline 10% reduction si your mastery will be 10 lower than the actual dr on Demon Spikes

Feed the demon is better and will likely be the best on aoe. For single target I still prefer soul rending. Due to lack of Soul gen for ST.