[7.0 Retribution Paladin] Guide and Discussion

[nyc81991]

JV i don't see ever beeing baseline. It is not a core ability or support ability. I know it is atm, but won't be for long in pve situations where you can't stun.

Word of Glory is utility. Even if it was baseline i wouldn't use it though. They have to remove the HP cost. If it cost HP it has to heal for tons to make it worth it. Thats not gonna happen, so may aswell keep the restrictions of CD and charges and remove the HP cost. Would it be OP to be baseline? Remove one charge and make a talent give it an extra charge.

To be honest... i would still not use it if it cost a global CD, unless it was an especially hairy situation.

As it stands right now our only way to heal is to cast Flash of Light. From the perspective of PvP that is a very bad thing when literally almost every ability Ret has (offensive and defensive) is locked out by a kick.

I guess they could buff the Divine Storm heal from the Ashbringer instead (which they should do anyway) but that doesn't fix the issue of Divine Intervention competing with two movement speed talents.

[gratax]

Anyone else having problems with Blade of Wrath only giving one holy power if you use it on pull?

[Puzzony]

You using it before you get into combat thus all your holy power resets to 1.

[Gracin]

You using it before you get into combat thus all your holy power resets to 1.

Pretty sure that's only meant to be on raid bosses. If that's the case, that's kind of a big bug.

[gratax]

yes it happend inside a raid Thanks for the clear up!

[Flizzle]

Hey

Literally made an account after lurking for the last 5? years maybe more.. just to post this one up.

I cant link yet but if somebody could reply/edit this..

Its a google doc just need to drop that at the end of the url.

/spreadsheets/d/1HZ1Gu2fW2lMzKWxofuIR_N-KrQZxHrv40tfz6MKcLmQ/edit#gid=369462335

That contains every single item a Ret paladin would find relevant from Legion Dungeons. I am currently in the process of adding in the Raid gear (with every other class [requested by guild]).

Hope it helps at least somebody!

[Narruin]

Hello guys,
any thoughts about how to track these 3 stupid buffs on other people?
any addon or custom trackin bar for tmw/wa?

[Flizzle]

I have a TMW tracking it, somebody posted one up in this forum (not this thread)
Its titled Ret Weak Aura's or something similar.

Cant post links yet! Sorry

[Deleted]

Hello guys,
any thoughts about how to track these 3 stupid buffs on other people?
any addon or custom trackin bar for tmw/wa?

Hey I'm using this Weakaura:
http://pastebin.com/Y4KiQ4j4



Someone linked it somewhere in the Paladin forum.

Basically replace the Blessings name with the Player name which you are buffing (It's a dynamic group).

[Grimgrin]

Hey there, just wondering about the priority list. Why is Blade of Justice our #3 and not #2 before CS?. With a longer cooldown shouldn't it be prioritized first? Am I missing something?

My priority list is..
1. Judgement
2. Blade of Justice
3. Crusader Strike
4. Templar's Verdict
5. Justicar's Vengeance on DP procs.

[Kyletheboss]

Im really hoping the final tuning comes out and that good things are in the future

[Morally Grey Storm]

I too do believe in mermaids, hobgoblins, kindness and justice.

[Haram]

Hey there, just wondering about the priority list. Why is Blade of Justice our #3 and not #2 before CS?. With a longer cooldown shouldn't it be prioritized first? Am I missing something?

My priority list is..
1. Judgement
2. Blade of Justice
3. Crusader Strike
4. Templar's Verdict
5. Justicar's Vengeance on DP procs.

Here is where I am having an issue. Some guides say Judgment is our first priority (like the one on Mmo-c). Other guides (like thete, IV etc) suggest that builders are our first priority, then judgment, then spenders in judgment window. But judgment itself does damage, and rarely at low haste levels will you be able to get more than 2 spenders (without ashes to ashes) before judgment debuff wears off. Even if I am at 0 HP, I can still get 2 spenders within a judgment window, so why not cast judgment as often as possible? It's damage after all

[Grimgrin]

Even if I am at 0 HP, I can still get 2 spenders within a judgment window, so why not cast judgment as often as possible? It's damage after all

Yeah, Judgement is such a hard hitting move that I don't see the value in keeping it off CD. Heck, our Mastery even increases it's damage! I felt that while I was using Execution Sentence I was holding back too much to try and line it up properly. After i swapped out of it (still sad about that, such a cool move) the spec just felt SO much better. That said, if you're opening with spenders then switching to the priority window, you'll miss out on one judgement (the opener). Gotta do some testing and weigh building 4HP then judgement -> unleash versus Judgement -> regular window.

That said, are you on the BoJ before CS plan?

[Haram]

I think CS at 2 charges should be our first priority, only because we are wasting recharge time if not. So I think priority wise, CS at 2 charges is first, and then BoJ. The delay of 1 gcd for the dot damage, versus 1 gcd of CS not charging favours CS, I think.

I haven't tested any of this, and have no intention to. I'm assuming there's a reason why CS @ 2 charges is higher on the priority than BoJ, but that's just my assumption based on the above statement.

With Exe, I don't know how Judgment fits priority. I know with our artifact not built up, Exe does better in ST, but it will inevitably (at least in current testing) be replaced by final verdict, as there is quite a bit of damage boosting in our artifact for TV and DS. Not to mention, FV is a much more flexible talent as it is useful in ST and AOE, whereas Exe is good only for a pure ST encounter, and even then, not far into our artifact. Once we get our 2nd golden dragon, Exe falls behind. So I haven't really played with the exe & judgment window.

After a certain amount of haste, Judgment can potentially have 100% uptime.

[Ryuji]

Hello guys,
any thoughts about how to track these 3 stupid buffs on other people?
any addon or custom trackin bar for tmw/wa?

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post40349994

Made a weakaura on Beta you are using? Feel free to share it with us

I made a little weakaura to keep track of my blessings on beta servers.
There is a lot improvement potential to it like tracking if no blessing was given. But I think this will do the job for now for me.

It just displays the icons for the blessings. It just tracks your own blessings.

dmdOgaWsHe7IIOxRu1Sr1nfc(MsyNuu7f2nk7NQ6NcPgMemoLkdviYGPkdxjDmj6CuKwOkAXuewUGFtPNISmk0Zj62sAQeMSQmDsNw00KqxwX1LYgPaESQAZQ02vIYhfk(QqsFwQ(ofOdtLlje1OvbJxjQoPqOBju6AkroVs5zQq)vOABuqJsiajbz0KLMSGjnAySLfJTBIxrJMWWDGQGEGEqaA5rFVYrHbwArHDgAOPlkwO0OXYsJ4gBXJGctpTmX26a6TXC183d22kOTOVx5OWa7mDHXcLMwUyHHLMwCjdXn2IlbAw(QJ9MhobLpqrYXDVK57DYhPmzDjidMp9amGPfkSOCNXclkUBr5Uc7Wn2IlaXAvri79jiH5sqhMSFqHbwYyHfg3TWyHJhnS4odlIBSfpcso8BKSjtbjIosG4w3dcqQJpmfcq1gxtiGcfutoX)CNuctak4(deGQnUMqafkOR7RPLbbOAJRjeqHc6L3B(BCDdcq1gxtiGcfuWYhiavBCnHakuOqb9HaMlHa0lLRC3gPU)EjOiZafMEAzIT1bu(TmqCR7bbOxEV5VX1niavBCnHakuqblFGauTX1ecOqbfC)bcq1gxtiGcfK64dtHauTX1ecOqbDDFnTmiavBCnHakuOG0q27tacqs193hpzxliP6(7b1d226NBzdobznilAgFdNGASub1d22kiMRosiG5sqXegNobFVt(iLjR77zV(ErjzDjuqmxDaftyC6e89o5JuMSUVN967fLK1LGyU6epzxlOvUBBcsq)MuT14hY3asZ68GckFGo5JuMSUVN967fLK1LGyTQiK9(eKWCjuy2ieGEPCL72i193lbfzgOW0tltSToGYVLbIBDpia1KtC2SSjatasD8HPqaQ24AcbuOGE59M)gx3GauTX1ecOqbfC)bcq1gxtiGcf01910YGauTX1ecOqbfS8bcq1gxtiGcfkinK9(eGaKuD)9Xt21csQU)Eq9GTT(5w2GtqwdYIMX3WjOglvq9GTTcI5QdOycJtNGV3jFKYK199SxFViK9dkiMRosiG5sqXegNobFVt(iLjR77zV(Eri7huOGyU6epzxlOvUBBcsq)MuT14hY3asZ68GckFGo5JuMSUVN967fHSFqbXAvri79jiH5sOW8ria9s5k3TrQ7VxckYmqHPNwMyBDaLFlde36Eqa6L3B(BCDdcq1gxtiGcfuWYhiavBCnHakuqb3FGauTX1ecOqbPo(WuiavBCnHakuqx3xtldcq1gxtiGcfkinK9(eGaKuD)9Xt21csQU)EqY1HZJ4dKXchx6OPG6bBB9ZTSbNGSgKfnJVHtqmxDINSRf0k3TnbjOglvq9GTTcQjN4Y1HZJ4dNGKRdNhXNecyUeMnw44shnfkiMRoGIjmoDc(EN8rktw33ZE99IAkF2kiMRosiG5sqXegNobFVt(iLjR77zV(ErnLpBfkOFtQ2A8d5BaPzDEqbLpqN8rktw33ZE99IAkF2kiwRkczVpbjmxcfkOLbZLfnwcfa

No point in seeing who has not-Might since Might's the only one you're gonna care about putting on party/raid members. Dunno about PvP, I don't touch that with a 10 ft. pole.

Hey there, just wondering about the priority list. Why is Blade of Justice our #3 and not #2 before CS?. With a longer cooldown shouldn't it be prioritized first? Am I missing something?

My priority list is..
1. Judgement
2. Blade of Justice
3. Crusader Strike
4. Templar's Verdict
5. Justicar's Vengeance on DP procs.

On a pull I:

1. Pre-pot.
2. Wings-Ring-Judgement.
3. Blade of Justice-Wrath-Hammer(whichever one it is).
4. CS-Zeal
5. Execution Sentence if I have it.
6 and beyond. Go ham with Crusader on if it's a heroism/lust/warp pull.

Only thing it looks like that will change once we have our artifact and everything beefed up is to get 5 HP with Wake of Ashes first, then Judge, then go ham on stuff.

[Haram]

With crusader wouldn't it be better to first build to 5, then pop judgment, then AW?

[Deleted]

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post40349994
3. Blade of Justice-Wrath-Hammer(whichever one it is).
.

if you got hammer use it before the pull it will give the 2 hp the first time it does damage and if timed right can be used instantly after wich lets you build up 5 hp very quickly at the start of a fight

[Ryuji]

With crusader wouldn't it be better to first build to 5, then pop judgment, then AW?

Possibly but with ring and heroism currently where it's popped like right off the bat, can't sit there and lose those seconds on ring to help make the explosion so massive. This won't really apply in Legion though because you can instantly get to 5 HP with your artifact later on so it's a non-issue.

Also sidenote, tried some PvP to get some marks of honor for transmog since I gotta have 'em all and even though it's been a while, Ret feels godawful to PvP with when I can't even catch up to stuff to poke 'em(if divine steed's on CD). Might just get those marks on my Warrior or DH instead. The damage isn't bad(though I did feel like I was just tickling people sometimes), it's just I can't really do much besides "and YOU get a judgement and YOU get a judgement" etc. while trying to keep up. Might also just go Prot paladin for 'em...not sure. I'm also likely just really bad at PvP since I haven't done much since Wrath. Either way, just feels gross what with all the mobile classes running circles around the non-mobile ones.

[Haram]

Wouldn't it be a lot smoother to have Judgment bounce on 2 targets and cause a buff on yourself that increases damage done by holy powers spenders for x seconds?

Reworking the judgment talent, it could just go as follows:

"Judgment hits an additional 2 targets. If judgment hits 4 targets, divine storm damage is increased by 10/20%" And this could last as long as you have the judgment buff.

That way switching to a priority target when you've used judgment on a boss quite recently allows for greater burst potential in killing the priority target, while keeping the mechanic of pooling HP and spending during judgment window to be the same.