Scientists to unveil new Earth-like planet

[May90]

Curious as to what you mean with the bolded part. I assume you are talking about viewing stars in the sky and how they move? Well none of those can be taken as any kind of proof as both the heliocentric and geocentric models have come up with calculations that both make sense. If you mean something else id like to hear about it (as ive yet to find conclusive evidence that the earth is moving).

Earth is a planet rotating around the Sun; there are many planets rotating around the Sun. Sun is a star rotating around the Milky Way; there are over a hundred billion stars rotating around the Milky Way. Milky Way is a galaxy rotating around the Great Attractor; there are countless galaxies rotating around the Great Attractor. The Great Attractor is a galaxy cluster; there are millions-to-billions galaxy clusters in the observable Universe.

The Earth isn't any more the center of the Universe than a baby wasp is the center of our ecosystem. Just read the title of this thread. Earth is just as much a center of the Universe as the planet in question is, or as a random planet in a quasar 10 billion LY away from us is.

[Fascinate]

Earth is a planet rotating around the Sun; there are many planets rotating around the Sun. Sun is a star rotating around the Milky Way; there are over a hundred billion stars rotating around the Milky Way. Milky Way is a galaxy rotating around the Great Attractor; there are countless galaxies rotating around the Great Attractor. The Great Attractor is a galaxy cluster; there are millions-to-billions galaxy clusters in the observable Universe.

The Earth isn't any more the center of the Universe than a baby wasp is the center of our ecosystem. Just read the title of this thread. Earth is just as much a center of the Universe as the planet in question is, or as a random planet in a quasar 10 billion LY away from us is.

A couple things:
1. You do not fully understand how relativity works
2. You are not addressing my question that you quoted.

[May90]

A couple things:
1. You do not fully understand how relativity works
2. You are not addressing my question that you quoted.

You are the one who started talking about whether Earth was the center of the Universe or not.

I addressed your question earlier, when I explained that the Universe doesn't have a center as such, and claiming that Earth is its center makes zero sense from both historical and geometrical perspective. But, since you decided to talk about the center anyway, I once again explained to you that Earth isn't any more the center than any other planet, star or any spot in the Universe.

[Fascinate]

You are the one who started talking about whether Earth was the center of the Universe or not.

I addressed your question earlier, when I explained that the Universe doesn't have a center as such, and claiming that Earth is its center makes zero sense from both historical and geometrical perspective. But, since you decided to talk about the center anyway, I once again explained to you that Earth isn't any more the center than any other planet, star or any spot in the Universe.

I only mentioned the possibility, which has clearly went way over your head.

[May90]

I only mentioned the possibility, which has clearly went way over your head.

There is no such possibility geometrically. If you (falsely) see our Universe as some king of perfect sphere, which has a center, then yes, it is a possibility - but the probability of this possibility is zero, because there is infinity of other possibilities as well in this case.

[Kathandira]

Well, technically, if you take what we can see as all there is, you could think that we are the center of the observable universe. If you look in every direction from earth, you will see the same distance. If the horizon is the same distance from you in 360 degrees then you could think we are the center.

But other observations have shown us that this is not likely to be true as we are moving away from a potential center.

[Fascinate]

Well, technically, if you take what we can see as all there is, you could think that we are the center of the observable universe. If you look in every direction from earth, you will see the same distance. If the horizon is the same distance from you in 360 degrees then you could think we are the center.

But other observations have shown us that this is not likely to be true as we are moving away from a potential center.

A lot of rambling between the first time i quoted this to the second. You guys keep saying the observations prove otherwise, what observations? Both heliocentric and geocentric models have proper explanations of why we see stars as we see them in the night sky. I am going to need more than this guys.

[May90]

A lot of rambling between the first time i quoted this to the second. You guys keep saying the observations prove otherwise, what observations? Both heliocentric and geocentric models have proper explanations of why we see stars as we see them in the night sky. I am going to need more than this guys.

But they don't. They can't explain the proper motion of stars within our galaxy.

[Kathandira]

A lot of rambling between the first time i quoted this to the second. You guys keep saying the observations prove otherwise, what observations? Both heliocentric and geocentric models have proper explanations of why we see stars as we see them in the night sky. I am going to need more than this guys.

I wish I could provide you more detail, but I am not an astrophysicist.

What I can say, is that through our advancement in telescopes (both those on land, and in space) we can watch stars moving away from some area.

[Fascinate]

But they don't. They can't explain the proper motion of stars within our galaxy.

Would love to see you unequivocally prove the heliocentric model just from looking at the night sky. (p.S, it hasnt been done)

[May90]

Would love to see you unequivocally prove the heliocentric model just from looking at the night sky. (p.S, it hasnt been done)

Heliocentric model is false as well: the Sun isn't the center of the Universe. If you mean proving that the model with planets rotating around the Sun, then it has been done like centuries ago, by taking measurements of planet locations in the sky with time and plotting them later. It showed that the observations are consistent with the Sun being roughly the center of our star system, and inconsistent with Earth being that.

[Kathandira]

Would love to see you unequivocally prove the heliocentric model just from looking at the night sky. (p.S, it hasnt been done)

There is debate over whether the universe is flat, or spherical. No one really has the answer right now due to the limitations our how much we can observe.

[Gorgodeus]

Would love to see you unequivocally prove the heliocentric model just from looking at the night sky. (p.S, it hasnt been done)

Do you not realize that the direction and speed at which heavenly bodies are moving is easily done?

[Kathandira]

Heliocentric model is false as well: the Sun isn't the center of the Universe. If you mean proving that the model with planets rotating around the Sun, then it has been done like centuries ago, by taking measurements of planet locations in the sky with time and plotting them later. It showed that the observations are consistent with the Sun being roughly the center of our star system, and inconsistent with Earth being that.

And those calculations have to be correct because we use the other plants in our solar system to sling shot probes and such. If our calculations were wrong, we wouldn't be able to do so.

We can pinpoint when and where a planet in our system will be at any given time. Which basically proves that we know the exact orbit of each planet in our system.

[Fascinate]

I wish I could provide you more detail, but I am not an astrophysicist.

What I can say, is that through our advancement in telescopes (both those on land, and in space) we can watch stars moving away from some area.

What you are attempting to represent actually bolsters my argument, when hubble first looked up at the stars everything was moving away from US. This is called red-shift, and a whole lot of people since have tried to explain this away but to no great effect.

[May90]

And those calculations have to be correct because we use the other plants in our solar system to sling shot probes and such. If our calculations were wrong, we wouldn't be able to do so.

Indeed. And, since we see the same picture in other star systems with exoplanets as well, and we even see similar behavior with galaxies rotating around each other - it is clear that if we are wrong, then we are missing something very strange, something that no one has pointed out for some reason.

What you are attempting to represent actually bolsters my argument, when hubble first looked up at the stars everything was moving away from US. This is called red-shift, and a whole lot of people since have tried to explain this away but to no great effect.

What? Red-shift is just an evidence of the Universe expanding, it has nothing to do with Earth... Everything is moving away from everything.

[Adam Jensen]

A lot of rambling between the first time i quoted this to the second. You guys keep saying the observations prove otherwise, what observations? Both heliocentric and geocentric models have proper explanations of why we see stars as we see them in the night sky. I am going to need more than this guys.

It's basic astronomy that's been observed by our very telescopes, both on the ground and in space. We have measured the speed of the earth. We have measured the speed of it's rotation. We have measured its orbit around the sun, it's distance from the sun. We know the earth is moving and we know it moves around the sun. And we've known this since before Isaac Freaking Newton.

You are the one denying basic astronomy since the days of Copernicus.

Geocentricism is wrong because it requires the planets to make extra loops in their orbits that make absolutely no sense (what would cause the planets to make those extra loops?) and are only thrown in to explain why they move across our sky. These extra loops are not necessary if heliocentrism is true, and heliocentrism, at least in the scope of our solar system, is conclusively proven to be true.

Furthermore, why would earth be at the center when Earth doesn't account for even a percent of the mass of the solar system, when the Sun is something like 99% of the mass? Gravitationally, the sun has the strongest pull, by far. If we were to orbit a planet, it'd make far more sense to orbit Jupiter. The only things that don't orbit the Sun are things that got too close to the planets and got caught in their gravity.

[Gorgodeus]

What you are attempting to represent actually bolsters my argument, when hubble first looked up at the stars everything was moving away from US. This is called red-shift, and a whole lot of people since have tried to explain this away but to no great effect.

100% falsehood, so stop spouting nonsense and expecting people to even think you know what you are talking about on the subject. It is common knowledge in the astronomical community that the neighboring Andromeda Galaxy is currently on a collision course with the Milky Way. So much for your "everything is moving away from us" theory.
http://science.nasa.gov/science-news...may_andromeda/

[Adam Jensen]

What you are attempting to represent actually bolsters my argument, when hubble first looked up at the stars everything was moving away from US. This is called red-shift, and a whole lot of people since have tried to explain this away but to no great effect.

And if we were on a different planet on the opposite side of the universe, they'd still appear redshifted and hurtling away from us. Universal expansion is . . . universal. Everything is hurtling away from everything else, unless they're still gravitationally bound to each other.

[heerobya]

At 4.24 light years away...

If we could construct a probe capable of A) surviving the journey and B) reaching a speed just 1/10th of the speed of light, roughly 30,000 kilometers per second...

That's our goal. About a 40 year journey, 40 years back.