Too few gnomes & goblins: New Class Idea

[Deleted]

Nah, terrible idea. Too close to engineering. Just stop it. When they shaved down class unique buffs and shit, the "bring the player" bullshit, they eliminated the chance of a tinker class.

Uhm, why exactly did they eliminate the chance of a tinker class yet a DH is just fine?

[Soulwind]

Nah, terrible idea. Too close to engineering. Just stop it. When they shaved down class unique buffs and shit, the "bring the player" bullshit, they eliminated the chance of a tinker class.

I've never understood this argument. Is enchanting too close to mages? It requires some sort of arcane knowledge, shouldn't all mages be enchanters?

Engineering is the everyday use of machines for civilians, it's a profession to sell stuff and help others. Knowing how to make a scope doesn't mean you know how to shoot a gun.

Tinkerers are fighters, they don't necessarily know or care about the details, but they know how to use those tools as weapons. Knowing how to shoot a gun doesn't mean you know how to make a scope.

Obviously there's a suspension of disbelief that someone who can pilot a mech doesn't know basic engeneering stuff, but again, same thing for mages and enchanting, or hunters and skinning. The gameplay separates professions from classes, even if they have elements in common.

[Drilnos]

On the subject of gnomes and goblins being the least played races, that might change if they got a class that actually seems to fit them. People tend to gravitate toward obvious combos, and every class has a race with the most lore attached to it. Orc/Tauren shaman, human priest, night elf hunter, and so forth. I've seen threads like that several times in my day, and the thing they all had in common was that nobody ever listed either gnomes or goblins. Ever. Because as far as gnome warrior, or goblin priest, etc, lore is concerned, there's next to nothing, but the one thing they're known for and allegedly do better than everyone else, isn't even a class.

If the option to play as the archetypal gnome or goblin was made available, that would be a tipping factor for a lot of people.

[ItachiZaku]

Uhm, why exactly did they eliminate the chance of a tinker class yet a DH is just fine?

Everyone knows Illidaniel, no one knows Giblets.

[Ciddy]

I actually like the idea of making classes specific to one or two races. Demon hunters only for elves, tinkerer class only for gnomes and goblins, etc.

And them using a mech suit would be awesome. I'd definitely roll a gnome for that.

Same here. I'd even love to go as far as faction-specific classes again (like how paladin/shaman used to be). Unfortunately, I think faction-specific classes would just cause drama these days. There would be so much whining about how the Alliance or Horde is favored by Blizzard because that faction's class is OP after people lose arenas/BGs or get spanked in world PvP.

I do really love the idea of classes that are locked down to a race or two, particularly for races that tend to get neglected in lore.

[Lochton]

"Tinkers are most commonly found among the dwarves, gnomes, and goblins" - Dwarves would also make sense!

Well, yeah. Three races are mechanical tinkers, two races are 'crystal' tinkers.

Though, when I saw the High Tinker in his suit... I have to admit, a little squeel for the Tinkers was let out..

[elcapone]

always liked a mech class if it came to wow, with expansions introducing technology it would be natural to go this route

[Halyon]

I watched the Legion invasion cinematic and Gelbin Mekkatorque's mech suit (pictured here) just really made me want to REVISIT the idea that IF a "new class" was added how much I and other people would love to see a Tinkerer/Engineer class.

Although since there seems to be a lot of hate on Gnomes and Goblins, we could just really dive into making professions FUN and RELEVANT, and somehow turn every profession into a viable sub-class each with its own unique abilities a working Mech being something unique for Engineers.

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Nowhere in the original post did I claim the idea was new, unique, or even original. Yes it has been discussed before. It is the first time I have seen this model and I got excited. Forgive me for bringing my excitement here... I should have known better.

And go back double crafting professions for raid optimization and a must need of mule alts? No thanks. What they do now is fine, if not preferrable because Blizz and balancing is like a hammer to a needle.

And yout topic title does say new class idea...so you kinda did. The reason not many people play gnomes/goblins, is because we don't like them, not what they do... Forcing people into playing something for the class alone is the wrong way to go about it.

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I think your thinking is wrong. People will roll a class regardless of race as the class is 99% of the gameplay. How many people playing DH right now probably hate elves?

Secondly, you should give new things to the unpopular to boost popularity, not make the popular even more popular. In the end, people who obsess with their toons being beautiful and refuse to roll anything other than female blood elf will probably bitch about having to be a Goblin, but they'll roll one anyways.

Thirdly, do it for the lore. Dont screw up the lore of a tinker by deciding everyone gets to be one.

Fourthly, Pandaren are even less played than gnomes and goblins, but they're still the most popular race for monk and monk isn't too far below warlock and shaman as least-played class.

Monk isn't unique to Pandaren only though. Maybe I'm an outlier/minority, but I choose my classes because the race that can be the class appeals to me. And blood elves for one are mighty populat, so that they alone can be DH is just icing on the proverbial cake.

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I've never understood this argument. Is enchanting too close to mages? It requires some sort of arcane knowledge, shouldn't all mages be enchanters?

Engineering is the everyday use of machines for civilians, it's a profession to sell stuff and help others. Knowing how to make a scope doesn't mean you know how to shoot a gun.

Tinkerers are fighters, they don't necessarily know or care about the details, but they know how to use those tools as weapons. Knowing how to shoot a gun doesn't mean you know how to make a scope.

Obviously there's a suspension of disbelief that someone who can pilot a mech doesn't know basic engeneering stuff, but again, same thing for mages and enchanting, or hunters and skinning. The gameplay separates professions from classes, even if they have elements in common.

How about making a bomb. You need to know your shit to make a bomb and make it explode w/o killing someone it shouldn't (i.e. range, timing, etc.), that's pretty damned important... Tinkers def. need to know how to build their weapons AND how to use them...most are most likely custom inventions...

[AmericanCynic]

I disagree. There are too many gnomes already. What we need is ways to kill them off.

Seconded and sending a petition to Blizzard requesting that the Legion eradicates them all.

[Thimagryn]

When he was appointed Warchief, he even tried suggesting that it wasn't the best idea. "I am honored Warchief. But I feel unprepared for the life of a ruler." - Garrosh. In this same little event, he even has the guts to ask why they aren't making his promotion a big deal, and why it was just 4 of them.

You're treating the lore as though it was already set. Let me bring you back to reality - Lore is written by the writers. The writers tune the story to appeal to the audience. Read some of the novels, and you'll see Garrosh's character turn complete 180 from how he was portrayed in the Shattering (rash, yet honorable) to Tides of War (racist, fascist, one-dimensional villain). Being rash and hating the Alliance is one thing, hating his own faction and becoming the overall villain is another.

Need you be reminded that immediately after Pandaria, we were being invaded on a another planet where THERE ARE NO PANDAREN? The ones that did go to Draenor were part of the Horde and Alliance, and did not have time to have awesome stories..

Why do you think we went from Pandaria to Draenor in the first place? To an expansion where there WOULD be no Pandaren present at all? You do understand that there are literally thousands of concepts for expansions which could be used where Pandaren could be present, yet the one chosen was meant to be as far removed from that as possible, returning to the 'roots of Warcraft' because that's what people were craving for (at the time). Keep in mind that we could have faced the 'Mongrel Horde' post Pandaria, there were many options outside of travelling to alternate universe Draenor. It's a choice of the writers to leave the Pandaren to obscurity.

[FelPlague]

Naturally Gnome and Goblin only (for sizing purposes)

But how cool would it be to incorporate mechs/hardsuits into an engineering type class. Not sure how itemization/customization would work, I would imagine it would be no different than the same hum drum models druids are stuck with, but I think a class like this holds a lot of potential.

Engineering as a profession has a lot of source material to pull from for spells.

Both Goblins and Gnomes have rich lore, and the team comes up with some very creative stuff that players rarely have access to.

i think it would be interesting, allthough i think it would be best with only 2 specs aswell.. a dps and a tank.. i think it would be interesting to see them heal... but i think it may be abit too .... uninteresting or too much like other healers... having it be a tank, and a ranged/melee dps hybrid

imagine this, single target dps from ranged (and some aoe for those required fights, like a artillery strike) , aoe in melee (with a few single target attacks of corse for those required fights like a slam)

[Thimagryn]

Seeing a Tauren in some massive mech feels gamebreaking imo. Now I know you aren't saying open it up to every class. But I think it becomes less of what we are all picturing in our minds eye as a "Tinkerer" and devolves that image into nothing more than an Iron Man suit.

I'm just saying don't limit it to just Gnomes and Goblins. As an added note, transformations and collision size are minor points against this, as even Warlocks, Druids and Demon Hunters having larger forms don't necessarily mean they have to be so big they can't fit through doorways.

And the thing with Mech suits is that we already have examples where it can work without having to show your character or end up being form-fitting like Iron Man. Do any quest where you have to pilot a Shredder, or mount up in a Sky Golem. That's effectively what a Mech suit would be, and I see it more as a cooldown ability rather than a form in battle.

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I think at the end of the day, all this maybe/maybe not theorycrafting is inapplicable without a proper test trial. DH would probably be more popular if more races could be it, but at the cost of lore Blizzard decided not to and stuck it to elves. Hell, Shaman would be more popular if all races could be. Any class would be more popular if all races could be it, Tinker isn't the exception. Personally I think its popularity would do just fine if it were only gnomes and goblins.

There are limited spots for new classes, and it's not the best to defer to niche aspects simply to maintain a sense of lore or artificially popularize a race/faction. This isn't to say that we should be opening all options and removing limits. I'm all for having racial exclusion to stick to Lore; personally I'd love it if Druids were exclusive to Male Night Elves as they were in Warcraft 3. But it's clear that opening up the gender options and allowing Horde faction to play them made the class much more open to being played. And as you even pointed out, the Shaman and Paladins already DID go through this to become more popular. Having been opened up to the other faction and to more races helped populate them beyond their numbers prior, and even now Blood Elf Paladins are amongst the top played. Imagine if Paladins remained an Alliance-only race as they were in Vanilla!

- and, I should add. Even if it ends up being as low-played as Monk... Who cares? The people who like it will play it, and Blizzard has nothing to lose from that. Does every new class have to dethrone the Hunter to be a successful class?

Irrelevant to any point I've made. I'm arguing about Gnomes and Goblins being exclusive. Blizzard can choose to add any niche or unknown Class they choose. When you consider how class development actually works and do the research into how these decisions were made in the first place, then you should know that Blizzard's designers opt towards broader concepts that cater to a wide audience rather than choosing the niche or unknown. They literally had concepts for Necromancer and Runemaster class in Wrath, but the Death Knight ended up being the more familiar concept and they used the untapped potential of both niche classes to add to what is already familiar and well-recognized.

For the Tinker, it's fine to have it heavily themed around Gnomish and Goblin technology, as expected. But limiting it to those races will not parallel the Demon Hunter's limit to Night Elves and Blood Elves, for obvious reasons. The Demon Hunter is a siumilar to the Druid in terms of a race-exclusive class that is popular because it's well known, whereas the Tinker is parallel to the Monk due to being relatively niche and archetypically radical. My point is that if the Monk couldn't even be popularized by being open to most races, the Tinker isn't going to go very far by being racially exclusive.

[Wewlad]

This idea, while not new, is definitely something that would actually feel *new*.

Engineering doesn't have to be "gutted". All that the class has to do is pilot mechs.

[MacMathan]

Include Dwarves and I'm interested. We need to get rid of gnomes and goblins though. They're creepy!

The mecha suit is badass though, I'll admit.

[Mic_128]

i think it would be interesting, allthough i think it would be best with only 2 specs aswell.. a dps and a tank.. i think it would be interesting to see them heal...

I think it'd be fun. Syringe guns, healing grenades, hoses that spray healing goop, the return of Potion Injectors, and of course, their rezzes being jumper cables that work, but like the 'effects' of DK rezzes (looking all ghost-like), you come to life on fire.

[FelPlague]

I think it'd be fun. Syringe guns, healing grenades, hoses that spray healing goop, the return of Potion Injectors, and of course, their rezzes being jumper cables that work, but like the 'effects' of DK rezzes (looking all ghost-like), you come to life on fire.

yes but those things dont work for a class in a mech, and we dont want them to be enginners we want them to be mech drivers

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Include Dwarves and I'm interested. We need to get rid of gnomes and goblins though. They're creepy!

The mecha suit is badass though, I'll admit.

no, dwarves are not mechanically adept, they are good with blacksmithing and mining, not making machines

[Kithelle]

I don't like the idea of engineering being gutted to make 'Tinkers' feel unique.

Why would it have to be gutted? Is there really much to Engineering anymore...I have a max level Engineer and pretty much everything I can make doesn't seem like it would be involved in a class...unless you're calling rocket launchers and shields a defining characteristic of Engineer (and before you say anything, lets be honest here! No one really uses that stuff...and back when you had options of tasers, rocket launchers, or stat buffs...everyone went for the stat buff.)

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

This is a terrible idea.

...let's do it.

[lopus]

Naturally Gnome and Goblin only (for sizing purposes)

But how cool would it be to incorporate mechs/hardsuits into an engineering type class. Not sure how itemization/customization would work, I would imagine it would be no different than the same hum drum models druids are stuck with, but I think a class like this holds a lot of potential.

Engineering as a profession has a lot of source material to pull from for spells.

Both Goblins and Gnomes have rich lore, and the team comes up with some very creative stuff that players rarely have access to.

that would be sweet, i would prefer it to be open to more races but even if is those 2 it would be fun to have a mech class

[Kithelle]

i think it would be interesting, allthough i think it would be best with only 2 specs aswell.. a dps and a tank.. i think it would be interesting to see them heal... but i think it may be abit too .... uninteresting or too much like other healers... having it be a tank, and a ranged/melee dps hybrid

imagine this, single target dps from ranged (and some aoe for those required fights, like a artillery strike) , aoe in melee (with a few single target attacks of corse for those required fights like a slam)

Well they could make the healer spec like Lieutenant Morales in HotS...could be interesting and would be different than the other healers. Instead of magical healing like everyone else it could be technological healing.