5 man raiding? Sorta-ish?

[Perkunas]

Personally I think they are testing the waters for 5man raiding...

Lets see how it plays out.

You pretty much call everything raiding at this point...

Yeah, I was out in High Mountain solo raiding.

Uh, don't you mean questing?

Wow, ELITIST SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE! Only people in multiple groups are raiding now?!?

[purebalance]

Apparently Karazhan is gonna be a Mythic only 5 man with a weekly lockout.

How does everyone feel about this?

I wouldn't expect raiding as a whole to switch to this method, but it gives small groups of friends who don't have time to commit to a full on raid a chance to get a raid environment going.

At first I was bothered by Kara switching to a 5man until I read that and now I think its a pretty cool concept.

It is not even remotely raiding.

Unless I missed something with Legion, but Mythic 5 mans already have a weekly lock out.

[ro9ue]

Apparently Karazhan is gonna be a Mythic only 5 man with a weekly lockout.

How does everyone feel about this?

I wouldn't expect raiding as a whole to switch to this method, but it gives small groups of friends who don't have time to commit to a full on raid a chance to get a raid environment going.

At first I was bothered by Kara switching to a 5man until I read that and now I think its a pretty cool concept.

I think so OP. Maybe Blizzard has come to the same conclusion?

[purebalance]

Did you not read my entire post? or read anything about the 5man Karazhan?

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So you're saying Vanilla dungeons had weekly lockouts and were a difficulty where it would require multiple days to finish?

Nothing in your post indicated or made any sense to "5 man raiding". The only thing that separates this from others is it is slightly longer.

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I think so OP. Maybe Blizzard has come to the same conclusion?

And yet your poll has the opposite answer overwhelming voted.

[ro9ue]

And yet your poll has the opposite answer overwhelming voted.

I said Blizzard has come to the same conclusion, not MMO-C posters.

[klogaroth]

Does it matter if we manage to shoehorn it into an existing category?

It's something different; that's what matters, and that's what's good about it.

[purebalance]

I said Blizzard has come to the same conclusion, not MMO-C posters.

And yet they haven't? They added another mythic only dungeon. How is that the same conclusion?

[shaunika123]

Personally I think they are testing the waters for 5man raiding...

Lets see how it plays out.

even if that's ever gonna be a thing, it's never gonna be more than third rate in terms of rewards/difficulty compared to mythic raiding.

but i'd be glad if it became an occasional thing

[zito]

even if that's ever gonna be a thing, it's never gonna be more than third rate in terms of rewards/difficulty compared to mythic raiding.

but i'd be glad if it became an occasional thing

Yes but it's an alternative to people who don't raid. I work 6 days a week, I don't have time for that anymore and the majority of players don't raid hardcore, hardcore are a minority but this also gives those players something to do too (especially if they don't get anything from the raid)

[shaunika123]

Yes but it's an alternative to people who don't raid. I work 6 days a week, I don't have time for that anymore and the majority of players don't raid hardcore, hardcore are a minority but this also gives those players something to do too (especially if they don't get anything from the raid)

i agree with that, i like what kara is looking like atm.

[Alopex]

BRD is an outlier. It's bigger than most raids.

I'm just glad I wasn't doing MC when you had to take your raid through it to get there

[MrLachyG]

Apparently Karazhan is gonna be a Mythic only 5 man with a weekly lockout.

How does everyone feel about this?

I wouldn't expect raiding as a whole to switch to this method, but it gives small groups of friends who don't have time to commit to a full on raid a chance to get a raid environment going.

At first I was bothered by Kara switching to a 5man until I read that and now I think its a pretty cool concept.

5 man raiding? Like dungeons? But longer?

[Wondercrab]

I'm very excited for a more raid-like 5-man, and the potential to see more of them in the future. I always liked raids, but not the logistical challenge and lack of personal impact that resulted from needing 10+ people in the group. One of the things I've always loved most is doing old raids with small groups of friends, especially when there's still a bit of challenge in them. I'd absolutely love to see more dungeons in this format.

[Tharkkun]

BRD sure felt like it took multiple days to finish

BRD was originally designed for 40 people to crawl through to MC. Strath and BRS as well. But that changed before it went live.

@OP This won't be a raid. It will be a dungeon at Mythic difficulty which will be the standard difficulty for all organized 5 man content in Legion. It just can't be queued for. If it were to be raid difficulty they would tune it closer to Mythic + levels.

[callipygoustp]

I can't be the only one that sees "5 man raiding" as a non-sequitur. I expect anything that is considered raiding to require complexity far beyond what is possible for a 5 man group in WoW.

Make 5 mans challenging? Certainly. Expect it to be at the level of 20 man mythic raiding? I don't see it.

With regards to 5 mans being challenging: I'm curious to see how its handled. I still, clearly, remember all the negative feedback dungeons and raids received at the beginning of Cata - they're too hard! If Legion happens to be the same way, I'm interested in seeing how long it lasts.

[Krazzorx]

Equating 5 mans to raiding is just a bad idea. Even if they are harder than some difficulty of raiding. The problem resides in the fact it can never have the balance people demand from raiding.

For instance, only 3 classes bring lust. Big issue if they were ever tuned at the level of mythic raids. Because then 1 of 5 slots would be occupied by 3 classes. A huge %.

Dungeons should be their own thing.

There's already tons of people worried about "will my class make the cut for 20m?" Well, that becomes a much more massive issue with 5 players only. (Mythic+ works because of variable dungeons and affixes and rewards stop at +10. So don't need optimal comps. Looking at true 5 man "raids")

[Perkunas]

I can't be the only one that sees "5 man raiding" as a non-sequitur. I expect anything that is considered raiding to require complexity far beyond what is possible for a 5 man group in WoW.

Make 5 mans challenging? Certainly. Expect it to be at the level of 20 man mythic raiding? I don't see it.

With regards to 5 mans being challenging: I'm curious to see how its handled. I still, clearly, remember all the negative feedback dungeons and raids received at the beginning of Cata - they're too hard! If Legion happens to be the same way, I'm interested in seeing how long it lasts.

Many consider LFR raiding and that has the complexity of a ball on a string.

[Servos]

Even non raiders will out gear Kara relatively quickly and if Kara doesn't have the keystone system as well it will quickly become stale, as most content always becomes.

[purebalance]

Yes but it's an alternative to people who don't raid. I work 6 days a week, I don't have time for that anymore and the majority of players don't raid hardcore, hardcore are a minority but this also gives those players something to do too (especially if they don't get anything from the raid)

You don't even need to "hardcore raid" to clear everything but mythic so I don't know where that mentality is coming from.

The fact of the matter is people who can't clear heroic don't do so because they're purposefully being obtuse to avoid it or they're just plain bad.

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I can't be the only one that sees "5 man raiding" as a non-sequitur. I expect anything that is considered raiding to require complexity far beyond what is possible for a 5 man group in WoW.

Make 5 mans challenging? Certainly. Expect it to be at the level of 20 man mythic raiding? I don't see it.

With regards to 5 mans being challenging: I'm curious to see how its handled. I still, clearly, remember all the negative feedback dungeons and raids received at the beginning of Cata - they're too hard! If Legion happens to be the same way, I'm interested in seeing how long it lasts.

Blizzard has 0 intention of making it raiding anyway. The people in this thread are 100% deluded considering they just flat out said that Mythic+ will never be intended to be a replacement for raiding and shouldn't even be a way to gear up for raiding.

[callipygoustp]

Many consider LFR raiding and that has the complexity of a ball on a string.

Too true

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