[SPOILERS] Another Major Horde Death after Vol'Jin revealed + Major Exodar Event

[RedNight at MMOC]

Well he have son...Actually i`m not really sure

If I remember correctly, Thrall has two young boys. I think they are running around the fountain in Legion's Dalaran near Thrall and Aggra.

[anaxie]

they do tit for tat for deaths for main people, but when theramore gets destroyed theres no tit for tat.

Double standard to the max, and no, raiding orgrimmar and having 0 repercussions from it is not tit for tat.

Horde should have more deaths. Vol'jin was literally thrown into being warchief so they could kill him off and make sylvannas warchief.

All vol'jin ever did was say "you are commander". He might have been warchief, but he was significantly less important than varian ever was.

Yeah but Varian went out on his knees infront of Gul'Dan. just like the Alliance.

[Koreche]

they do tit for tat for deaths for main people, but when theramore gets destroyed theres no tit for tat.

Double standard to the max, and no, raiding orgrimmar and having 0 repercussions from it is not tit for tat.

Horde should have more deaths. Vol'jin was literally thrown into being warchief so they could kill him off and make sylvannas warchief.

All vol'jin ever did was say "you are commander". He might have been warchief, but he was significantly less important than varian ever was.

uhh.. Cairne? Garrosh turned into a raid boss? Horde lost 2 leaders and magni is back so...
Vol'jin is the only important troll character...
and its the alliance doing tit for tat for deaths lol... Just like always

[Deleted]

Maraad was already dead in our timeline anyway

Uhm, no he wasn't? That Maraad was FROM our timeline.

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This nonsense again.

The overwhelming majority of Horde characters end up getting killed/turned into raid bosses.

More Alliance characters get killed than Horde characters. And name one Horde character that got turned into a raidboss except the ones in Siege of Orgrimmar.

What do I expect from someone who says Garrosh literally did nothing wrong.

Horde apologist right there.

[Deleted]

I hope somebody has mentioned this by now: Saurfang does not die. He gets shot down in the Warrior Artifact Scenario, but that's it. He is alive and well, when you see him the next time during the Questline for the Hidden Arms Artifact Skin - The Arcanite Reaper - His signature weapon.

[FertsBlert]

Tell you what. When we get to RAID stormwind and kill your king, we'll be even then.

Good luck with that if the comic is canon.

we lost nazgrim you fucking loony

Don't worry Nazgrim is back and kicking much arse as a Horseman.

He is also able to follow his code of honor without having to follow a megalomaniacal loon. Well sort of..... depends if your character is a megalomaniacal loon if you are a DK.

[Lochton]

Maraad was already dead in our timeline anyway and Taylor was really unimportant character

Not sure if I read wrong but, we lost our Maraad in the AU timeline. He died in WoD like he said. Our Yrel though, was most likely some skull on the road in Hellfire and their Maraad might have been still born, or some schmuck.

And Taylor actually had a Nazgrim size of being used, but Nazgrim was a workaholic and died to it and Taylor was killed because he listened to a dragon.

[Deleted]

I warned about spoilers. So i am not really sure what Blizzard is doing but as you see now that Vol'Jin died they replaced him with Saurfang in Orgrimmar..... well however it looks like Saurfang dies aswell while fighting a lot of demons with you (the player) in the Warrior Order Hall campaign and before his death he tells you ''i wish i could kill a few more demons with you etc''. The only thing that comes to my mind now is that they'll bring Thrall in Orgrimmar throne again, otherwise i can't think of anything else.

Now for Exodar, no matter what class you are at the end of the artifact questline everyone ends up in a final scenario where Velen's son who is an Eredar attacks Exodar, while you are fighting Velen's son, Velen turns against you and you fight both of them, when Velen's son dies Velen gives you the light's heart and you get it to Khadgar, then Velen says that he is no longer a Prophet and he orders the draenei to prepare the Exodar and launch it to Argus to get revenge against Sargeras for turning his son into a demon.

This is all, although the second event i understand it but the first not really because Saurfang's death was really random and hidden only for Warrior class...

......rip Velen second time. That ability is a major loss, as his entire character and lore is built upon that.
Feels like Blizzard is trying to move away from mary sue overpowered characters.

Going with loses, be aware that the Broken Shore was a bigger loss for alliance. Varian was just a bigger deal and Tirion with the argent crusade is more alliance tied

Also note their might be a major alliance character dying in another class questline. Perhaps the rogue one it's about SI:7.

About loses:
When talking about the most key characters (faction leader or second in command). It's fairly close with alliance having slightly higher output.
Aside from that, the alliance also lost several key character to neutrality and than insult alliance by claiming their the same as horde or something in that sense. Dalaran does this again and we get forsaken of all factions being gaurds......really they slaughtered everyone in Hillsbrad, that town just south must have been part of Dalaran with lots of familymembers present.

The death that I really found pathetic was Admiral Taylor, he was a mirror to Nazgrim and thats why he had to die......it was really shallow since they don't mirror any other losses from alliance like Theramore. Aside from that WoD also had more major character loses in WoD even if they mirrored development time in WoD with a horde newly made character.

Alliance has lost many villages and fortresses. Not only at the start of vanilla which is ignorable but after. Many of those are at the horde hands even. And this is where we go to each factions current issue.

Horde major issue:
- The loss of Vol'jin (and saurfang?) was minor loss as warchief, but still major as a nation character. The issue is that they were irrelevant as warchief.
- No build-up for replacement character. Horde always had a one dimensional side and felt lacking in background development outside of the game. While saurfang did have a good background to be a replacement for Garrosh it missed just some pressence where you see him replacing Garrosh. Trolls are even worse I don't now of any.

Alliance:
- It's always about losses never about gains. It does allow for big background story but this element gets demotivating, they do get some gains but that is just mirrored by horde while the Horde gets unmirrored gains. WoD is a excelent example of each factions identity and resulting to this. Draenei are a large 'kingdom'being attacked on all sides loosing stuff but in the end able to defend. Horde is the underdog starting out small and making strides forward (a 2e clan became allies)
The alliance did gain a Naaru at a great cost but it's immidiatly used and than never used again making it an irrelevant gain.
Another example is from throne of thunder. Blood Elves get blood golems and Jaina gets pantheon imbued staff. In WoD we see the blood golems being used and fighting several demons alone. I was very excited for the Blood Elves, but we never see jaina's gain and going by Velens ability loss we might not see it at all.
- The largest amount of losses are at the hands of the Horde. This is a huge issue that is hurting alliance story. We always have to work with the horde and characters who object are put as the bad guys. Neutral organisations with alliance affiliation just say both factions are the same and ignore any agression horde has done to them. This ignoring has happened too often: Jaina did it, Argent Crusade did it, Cenarion Circle, Anduin, Dalaran now twice. I do like having a morality and doubt in alliance but not with this in such a stupid way. Legion is handling it better, i liked the the method used in preevent Daaran, just oppose they did it.
- Horde got away with their succesfull agressions against alliance. Often hordes agressions are ignored as if they didn't do it. But when the alliance does respond it results in nothing because their being blocked or we did it to help horde. Only thing was camp taurajo and purge of Dalaran that the developers did in a very pyrithic way.
- High king excisting and Anduin being it We shouldnt'have a high king, a supreme commander of army. Alliance is more about politics where each faction has a say. Anduin is also too young to be the leader of the main alliance army. Muradin would make the most sense, he seems the most consistant character being involved in warfare and right now the Dwarves are one of the strongest nations.

(sorry for bad grammar, if i get replies i might go back and improve it)

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If it was 2 expansions mostly about alliance where they defeat Horde everyone then sure.

Cata and MoP was pro horde to the point alliance was just specter most of them.
They even give us shitty quest will giving Horde a lot of great quest.

They even have best past Patch quest which they remove later.

At-least they give us good patch title in MoP

Even than it would be the horde helping the alliance regain their city and than leave with a fancy title that the other faction will be buthurt about eventhough the title doesnt make any sense and meanwhile Azshara goblin assets are still destroyed and undercity is abandoned.

[Rafalga]

There is a quest involving Saurfang for the hidden artifact for Arms later on. i'm pretty sure he isn't dead

[Strawberry]

wow. so next expansion is argus?

I think it would be more likely the end raid, considering it's dealing with Legion.

[greeeed]

Even than it would be the horde helping the alliance regain their city and than leave with a fancy title that the other faction will be buthurt about eventhough the title doesnt make any sense and meanwhile Azshara goblin assets are still destroyed and undercity is abandoned.

We are more like guest characters in MoP.

Like the characters that defeat Ash in most Pokemon League.
You don't know who the hell they are, but they defeated him in the league.
But the story is about Ash (Horde)

[Deleted]

bolvar is about around as nazgrim

I'm not sure if you know what's up with these two in Legion, but if you don't it's pretty funny.

Bolvar allies with the Ebon Blade in Legion, the DK player is sent on a quest to reanimate 4 champions to be the new horsemen, the first of them being Nazgrim. So both Bolvar and Nazgrim feature pretty heavily in the DK Class story

[Deleted]

And name one Horde character that got turned into a raidboss except the ones in Siege of Orgrimmar.

While certainly open to debate, one could argue that Kael'thas was among those. While he was never actually a Horde character, he was briefly loosely allied with the horde at the beginning of BC (I think I recall reading that he corresponded with Rommath and as such was informed about the blood elves' allegiance to the Horde, at a time when they were still affiliated with him)

And he would probably have become the Blood Elf leader if Blizzard didn't screw up their lore by having him join the legion just to make him a loot pinata with a face.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

putting the safety of the world over petty faction fighting is too selfish for khagdar according to you alliance buffs it seems.

who says i'm an alliance buff? i don't like that the alliance loses heroes over and over every expan but i play horde just as much. and thrall has been putting the safety of the world over his faction but thrall didn't show up in my alliance garrison and work with the humans all the way though wod.

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Bolvar is around more than saurfang though who becomes a shitty deathknight while bolvar gets to become the next lich king. nobody complained alliance favoritism about that tho.
Taylor being dead is the equality for nazgrim and even though i hate that blizzard has to try to kill 1:1 its because of people like you they do it who cry if horde doesnt lose something but alliance do and vice versa.
khadgar no longer alliance cause hes neutral? Sounds like thrall in cataclysm when he did nothing for the horde but everyone kept saying Horde favoritism why are we helping the horde leader do things? Never mind BC was also led by khadgar, Lich king was led by tirion and morgraine. Even now he stands in horde areas more often but thrall doesnt do shit for the horde he doesnt give a damn about faction war anymore and he might as well be dead because he no longer has doomhammer or shamanism. Meanwhile back in the strongest city on azeroth, its leader the strongest mage on azeroth... khadgar -- might as well be dead because he is neutral and has nothing to do with the alliance except for all his lore pre-BC.

bolvar is only more around then nazgrim cause hes in the firemage class quest but thats only by a bit
taylor dieing cause nzgrim did is stupid and unnecessary and nazgrim comes back as a dk while taylor is stuck on dranor as a ghost
khadgar is far more neutral then thrall ever was he shows up in the horde garrison lets the horde into the kirin'tor after they were locked our helped the horde with there shipyard helped the horde make there legendary ring, what did thrall do in cata? shoot a dragon? let you come to his wedding?

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we lost nazgrim you fucking loony

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pretty sure you're mistaken, saurfang accompanies you on the quest to discover your class hall, but i dont think he dies. i think he just gets shot down and returns to orgrimmar...

but the return to argus is going to be incredible, can't wait for it

yet nazgrim is one of the four horsemen and taylor is a useless ghost on dranor.

[Alvito]

They wouldn't make an achievement for his Orgrimmar defeat and script the fight at Orgrimmar if they were gonna kill him off in the same patch. He doesn't die.

That pretty much nails down any doubt if him living or not.

[lightofdawn]

who says i'm an alliance buff? i don't like that the alliance loses heroes over and over every expan but i play horde just as much. and thrall has been putting the safety of the world over his faction but thrall didn't show up in my alliance garrison and work with the humans all the way though wod.

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bolvar is only more around then nazgrim cause hes in the firemage class quest but thats only by a bit
taylor dieing cause nzgrim did is stupid and unnecessary and nazgrim comes back as a dk while taylor is stuck on dranor as a ghost
khadgar is far more neutral then thrall ever was he shows up in the horde garrison lets the horde into the kirin'tor after they were locked our helped the horde with there shipyard helped the horde make there legendary ring, what did thrall do in cata? shoot a dragon? let you come to his wedding?

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yet nazgrim is one of the four horsemen and taylor is a useless ghost on dranor.

took nazgrim an expansion to come back, maybe you'll get taylor back eventually as a toy or something

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Good luck with that if the comic is canon.



Don't worry Nazgrim is back and kicking much arse as a Horseman.

He is also able to follow his code of honor without having to follow a megalomaniacal loon. Well sort of..... depends if your character is a megalomaniacal loon if you are a DK.

yeah, i know. im glad he's coming back and taylor's still in the ground... gives me a sick sense of satisfaction

[nnelson54]

Neutral tiron Neutral.

Tirion was always neutral. The entire basis of his character was the fact that he sees the good and honor in people on both factions. He was created as a neutral character.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

took nazgrim an expansion to come back, maybe you'll get taylor back eventually as a toy or something

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yeah, i know. im glad he's coming back and taylor's still in the ground... gives me a sick sense of satisfaction

yes cause coming back as a toy is the same as being one of the four horsemen.

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Tirion was always neutral. The entire basis of his character was the fact that he sees the good and honor in people on both factions. He was created as a neutral character.

ya theirs so much good and honor when the forsaken are wiping out whole zones and raising them as undead not to mention they kill a ton of kirin'tor mages in silverpine.

[Ealyssa]

Maraad was already dead in our timeline anyway and Taylor was really unimportant character

It's our Maraad who died in Draenor. Alt Maraad is unknown.

[Nefarious Tea]

To be fair Saurfang the Elder is really old at this point, and he's probably thinking it's better to die in battle than bed.