The imbalance of this legendary item

[Arthael]

Its actually the other way around, like Azlarn said.

Scenario 1: You are using Lust/Warp on Pull.

A: You pop TW to give everyone the buff, including yourself - the raid gets TD, and you don't (5 min CD)
B: Shaman pops lust, 40s later, for you - you get Sated; raid doesn't get affected.
C: 5 Mins later, pop TW again.

If you let lust go off first, then you have to pop TW 40s in, which means the CD is @ 5:40, rather than 5.
3 TWs in 5 mins > 3 TWs in 5:40.
[And this is also why this ring will be insane in keystones; per fight basis, ya it might not be much - but considering the whole instance?]

Scenario 2: You are using Lust/Warp at a specific time.
A: Get out of the instance (stay in party)
B: Warlock Summon (don't take it)
C: Drop group, TW, Swap to the other legendary ring/armor.
D: Take the summon & invite - pull (sure you'll lose 10s of it but... its better than not using it? lol)

---
Finally about lining up CDs, with Kindling and enough crit rate, you will get your CB off well before the 80s window (TW + Lust) goes out; so in effect your first two CBs will be buffed by the haste giving you more pyroblasts inside the window.

[stomination]

Pretty much this right here, it takes a special brand of stupid to have a mage use Timewarp if you have a Shaman in the raid (which you probably will).

Let's then take into consideration Mythic raid comps, and factor in having 4 mages; if only 1 had the legendary that'd be one thing, but later in progression if all 4 had it- boy oh boy. Another tier where mages will be the most damaging class, again.

It doesnt work that way.

[Woobels]

Pretty much this right here, it takes a special brand of stupid to have a mage use Timewarp if you have a Shaman in the raid (which you probably will).

Let's then take into consideration Mythic raid comps, and factor in having 4 mages; if only 1 had the legendary that'd be one thing, but later in progression if all 4 had it- boy oh boy. Another tier where mages will be the most damaging class, again.

Have you actually done any raiding on the beta?

Mages aren't the strongest class right now, even with said legendary, stop it with the hyperbole.

[Deleted]

http://www.wowhead.com/item=132410/shard-of-the-exodar

I've skimmed over all other dps legendaries and I didn't notice anything remotely as powerful. Healers get several strong ones, but not dps. This one was the best, not even close.

So, why exactly hasn't this been nerfed yet? I guess mage is going to yet again molest the meter.

I don't want to burst your bubble, but if you're fire, which you probably will be, that legendary is near useless. As you have one cast which is fireball, and you'll be stacking quite a bit haste if you want to minmax, if you just trust icey-veins blindly and go mastery I suppose it's alright. But the point is, in optimized gear you will be below gcd cap rendering it useless.

[Mercane]

It doesnt work that way.

Context is important. I meant that if you have a Shaman in the raid, he'd use Lust/Hero on pull, then the mages would all use their timewarp immediately after or in the first burn phase, as a mage using it on pull with a shaman in the raid (with this ring) would be wasteful.

Have you actually done any raiding on the beta?

Yes, yes I have.

[Arthael]

I don't want to burst your bubble, but if you're fire, which you probably will be, that legendary is near useless. As you have one cast which is fireball, and you'll be stacking quite a bit haste if you want to minmax, if you just trust icey-veins blindly and go mastery I suppose it's alright. But the point is, in optimized gear you will be below gcd cap rendering it useless.

ST:


Cleave:


Summary:
Taken together with the single target sims, Crit>Int>Mastery is probably the best way to gear a Fire mage, for keeping respectable damage in single target and AoE scenarios.There is a small haste breakpoint that you want to grab for Fire though - probably has to do with fitting an additional global inside Combustion. It's a very low haste value (1800, ~5%).

^ Analysis by Frosted

[This becomes 10% with raid buff, which lets you use 7 casts in Combustion, giving you an extra pyroblast; then with TW/Lust you get to 40%, which lets you use 9 casts inside the CB window, netting you two additional pyroblasts]

Sometimes, it pays to take your own advice eh?

[Deleted]

ST:


Cleave:


Summary:
Taken together with the single target sims, Crit>Int>Mastery is probably the best way to gear a Fire mage, for keeping respectable damage in single target and AoE scenarios.There is a small haste breakpoint that you want to grab for Fire though - probably has to do with fitting an additional global inside Combustion. It's a very low haste value (1800, ~5%). [This becomes 10% with raid buff, which lets you use 7 casts in Combustion, giving you an extra pyroblast; then with TW/Lust you get to 40%, which lets you use 9 casts inside the CB window, netting you two additional pyroblasts]

Sometimes, it pays to take your own advice eh?

I don't play a mage, but there is definitely a reasoning behind going for a more haste focused build. From what I've gathered your amount of fireball casts at certain haste breakpoints will offset the gain of mastery on a single target. At least untill the sets come into play.

[Arthael]

I don't play a mage, but there is definitely a reasoning behind going for a more haste focused build. From what I've gathered your amount of fireball casts at certain haste breakpoints will offset the gain of mastery on a single target. At least untill the sets come into play.

Could be, just at the moment that scaling is netting the highest DPS at 280k and change with the pre-raid max gear setup.
Might change, who knows.

But back on topic, still doesn't change that this legendary isn't all that OP. Its strong depending on circumstances, but its the same with all legendaries (though some are absolute trash lol).

[Ammanas]

Yes.

Pull: other mage/shaman/corehound pops Lust
1st Lust ends (40 sec): you pop TW
5 min later: you pop TW again

So basically any fight that's 6:20 or longer will have you benefit from 2:00 of pure TW time.

Yes but your forgetting the most important part which is you must lust on pull. Look at the EN bosses.

Nythendra: Can lust on pull.
Ursoc: Almost certainly not, has essentially Butcher enrage at sub 30% so you will lust there.
Spider boss: Possible, but it is probably best used on the second platform as she doesn't jump in the air wasting DPS time.
Iylganoth: Lusting on pull is useless, everyone will lust for the inside phase burn.
Dragons: Maybe. It will probably be best used later in the fight for whichever up/down combo is hardest though.
Cenarius: No. Everyone will lust in P3.
Xavius: No. Everyone will lust in P3 (unless its a 11 minute fight on Mythic prog which could be possible)

When you don't lust on pull the value of the legendary suffers drastically. Even with Kindling you need at the fight to last at least 90s after lusting to get a second use with Combustion.

[woopytywoop]

You think an unbuffed Frost Shock every ~30 (?) seconds costs more than 2% overall damage? I somehow doubt that.

Except it doesn't work that way.

The buff lasts 8s and an unbuffed frost shock isn't worth 2% overall damage boost for 8sec. That's why you'd spec EB/IF because then the frost element gets part of the rotation. Anyway a bit too off topic for mage thread. shortly, yes the ring can add +5% damage boost on some talent build, but will definitely add 4% to the most common talent builds.

[Syphax127]

Maybe I am missing something, but if the shaman lusts on the pull, dont the mages get the debuff as well? That 10 min debuff that makes it so they cant benefit from Timewarp/Lust/Ancient Hysteria(Is this even a thing anymore?). In no way am I saying I know what Im talking about, Im just curious. >.>

[Deleted]

Could be, just at the moment that scaling is netting the highest DPS at 280k and change with the pre-raid max gear setup.
Might change, who knows.

But back on topic, still doesn't change that this legendary isn't all that OP. Its strong depending on circumstances, but its the same with all legendaries (though some are absolute trash lol).

Well basically it's about guaranteeing pyro is always available after each Fire Blast. But when you have the set you effectively only need 11% haste as in you get 20% from the set and 9% from the artifact and have 11% from gears as raid buffs no longer exist. I guess it's a bit off the actual topic but it seems to be a common missconception.

Edit: I forgot to mention that it's basically a fire blast on CD kinda thing, you can obviously run mastery and hold it now and again for a small net DPS loss.

[Arthael]

Maybe I am missing something, but if the shaman lusts on the pull, dont the mages get the debuff as well? That 10 min debuff that makes it so they cant benefit from Timewarp/Lust/Ancient Hysteria(Is this even a thing anymore?). In no way am I saying I know what Im talking about, Im just curious. >.>

http://beta.wowdb.com/items/132410-shard-of-the-exodar

Well basically it's about guaranteeing pyro is always available after each Fire Blast. But when you have the set you effectively only need 11% haste as in you get 20% from the set and 9% from the artifact and have 11% from gears as raid buffs no longer exist. I guess it's a bit off the actual topic but it seems to be a common missconception.

Edit: I forgot to mention that it's basically a fire blast on CD kinda thing, you can obviously run mastery and hold it now and again for a small net DPS loss.

I see your point.

[DarkSoul]

Maybe I am missing something, but if the shaman lusts on the pull, dont the mages get the debuff as well? That 10 min debuff that makes it so they cant benefit from Timewarp/Lust/Ancient Hysteria(Is this even a thing anymore?). In no way am I saying I know what Im talking about, Im just curious. >.>

The legendary allows you to ignore the debuffs for the purposes of your own time warp, and your own time warp doesn't give you TD. Essentially, you can cast time warp every 5 minutes all day long.

Any raider that blindly does this without respect for the necessities of the fight needs to be slapped, though. Mages using this legendary need to think of it as doubling the duration of the heroism for the raid and then becoming a 5 minute CD after that.

[Meagree]

Except it doesn't work that way.

The buff lasts 8s and an unbuffed frost shock isn't worth 2% overall damage boost for 8sec. That's why you'd spec EB/IF because then the frost element gets part of the rotation. Anyway a bit too off topic for mage thread. shortly, yes the ring can add +5% damage boost on some talent build, but will definitely add 4% to the most common talent builds.

That's what I was talking about, whether or not it'd be worth it to keep it at max stack with the unbuffed Frost Shock. But that was assuming the full stack would otherwise drop off (as is how it works in Diablo 3, where the inspiration comes from). Unbuffed Frost Shock just for a 2% damage buff is probably not worth it.

[Deleted]

as if mages were not broken on meters per standard

[stomination]

ST:


Cleave:


Summary:
Taken together with the single target sims, Crit>Int>Mastery is probably the best way to gear a Fire mage, for keeping respectable damage in single target and AoE scenarios.There is a small haste breakpoint that you want to grab for Fire though - probably has to do with fitting an additional global inside Combustion. It's a very low haste value (1800, ~5%).

^ Analysis by Frosted

[This becomes 10% with raid buff, which lets you use 7 casts in Combustion, giving you an extra pyroblast; then with TW/Lust you get to 40%, which lets you use 9 casts inside the CB window, netting you two additional pyroblasts]

Sometimes, it pays to take your own advice eh?

If you are fire you would prefer a different legendary.....

Also it seems at the start we are shooting for around 1800 haste.

[LordAmbrosia]

http://www.wowhead.com/item=132410/shard-of-the-exodarI've skimmed over all other dps legendaries and I didn't notice anything remotely as powerful.

Shit guys, everyone put away your sims and exhaustive analysis, this guy skimmed things over and found out how the game is broken beyond repair.

[Deleted]

the BL ring is hardly the most powerful legendary, the dh get a legendary that literally get artifact AND talent support on top of its effects, potentially greatly increasing the uptime of both eye beam and meta if the boss somwhat regularly spawns adds altho it can be bypassed by taking something like demonic appetite for ST as well.

[Deleted]

The item is highly dependant on the fight. If you lust at execute you better hope the phase lasts more than 40 seconds otherwise it's a nice stat stick.

But yeah any fight you lust on the pull oh baby. It depends how many mages you have. With 1 ring in the raid having the Mage lust on fights shorter than 5.40 will be better since 3 lusts in 5 mins. When you have 2 in raid then 1 Mage will always get shafted.