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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinos View Post
    The melee healer thing didnt even made it past the alpha and blizz themselves said that in the end they couldn't make it work so they had to scrap it. Its already been said numerous times in this thread,no idea why ppl still ask if battle healer is a thing.
    I'm guessing because there is a lot of outdated information out there in news posts and alpha video's.

  2. #102
    Warchief Supliftz's Avatar
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    Holy Paladin is still a melee healer because it gets to ignore ranged mechanics.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Rothg View Post
    Blessing of the Lightbringer gives you some flexibility. Stand in melee and enjoy the new play style, while still getting mastery buffed heals on a group of ranged, or alternatively, stand in ranged and cast it on the tank to keep the old play style.
    So I'm not just picking on wording choice here, but I wonder, does our mastery buff our heals for people close to us, or nerf our heals for people far from us? It may sound like a distinction without a difference, but I think it's important to know.

    Another way to ask that question, are we balanced relative to other healers based on our non-mastery buffed heals, or are we balanced based on our heals being buffed by mastery?

    Should we be sad when people are out of range because our heals are nerfed, or is that just our normal healing strength and instead we should be happy when people are close because we are getting a bonus to our heals, or is that just our normal healing strength?

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Narsilon View Post
    I'm guessing because there is a lot of outdated information out there in news posts and alpha video's.
    Yes, at least that's true for me. There's lots of "new" content out there (from this month) with lots of conflicting information about this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hawg View Post
    Another way to ask that question, are we balanced relative to other healers based on our non-mastery buffed heals, or are we balanced based on our heals being buffed by mastery?
    Very interesting question, I'd like to know this as well.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawg View Post
    So I'm not just picking on wording choice here, but I wonder, does our mastery buff our heals for people close to us, or nerf our heals for people far from us? It may sound like a distinction without a difference, but I think it's important to know.

    Another way to ask that question, are we balanced relative to other healers based on our non-mastery buffed heals, or are we balanced based on our heals being buffed by mastery?

    Should we be sad when people are out of range because our heals are nerfed, or is that just our normal healing strength and instead we should be happy when people are close because we are getting a bonus to our heals, or is that just our normal healing strength?
    if they say you are then you are, if they you are not you are anyway, like how holy was always balanced with chakra. blizzard.jpg

  6. #106
    I received a possible clue to answer my own question from a separate discussion with Keiyra:

    Quote Originally Posted by Keiyra
    Is the reduction on efficiency for Mastery done progressively beyond 10y or is it in steps (I.e. It gradually decreases the further you get, or its 100% w/in 10yrds, 75% w/in 15yrds, 50% at 20, etc.)?
    Its linear decline from 11 to 40 yards

    So 1-10 yards= 100%
    Approximately
    11 = 96.66%
    12 = 93.33%
    13 = 90.00%
    26 = 50%
    33 = 25%
    etc etc down to 1% at 40 yards (or possibly 0% give or take based on how blizzard rounds)
    Now consider the tool-tip for Mastery:

    Mastery: Lightbringer

    "Proximity to your target causes your spells to heal for up to 12% more."

    So I assume from Keiyra's response that the decrease from 100% to 0% is referring to the "12% more" you get when people are close. This would mean that someone at 39 yards gets 100% of the strength of a given heal. Someone at 33 yards would get 103% (100+(25% x 12)). Someone at 26 yards would get 106% (100+(50% x 12)). Someone at 13 yards would get 110.8% (100+(90% x 12)).

    So if my understanding is correct (extremely questionable), and this is true, then Mastery would indeed be a buff the closer they get rather than a debuff the further they get.

    Potato Potattooh?

  7. #107
    You are correct but Potato Potahtoe is more like it.

    You can view it either way:
    either 112% at 0-10 yards and 100% at 40
    or 100% full mastery heal at 0-10 yards and 89.3% of a full mastery heal at 40 yards

    glass half full or glass half empty approach, the numbers are the same either way.

    Easier to see with real numbers, if you flash heal for 15000, and have 12% mastery.
    0-10 yards you flash heal for 16,800, (100% of your 12% mastery = 12% bonus)
    26 yards you flash heal for 15,900, (50% of your 12% mastery = 6% bonus)
    40 yards you flash heal for 15000 (maybe slightly more if its more like 0.1% instead of actually 0 - but you get the idea)
    Last edited by Keiyra; 2016-08-23 at 03:48 PM.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinos View Post
    The melee healer thing didnt even made it past the alpha and blizz themselves said that in the end they couldn't make it work so they had to scrap it. Its already been said numerous times in this thread,no idea why ppl still ask if battle healer is a thing.
    Couldn't make it work lol...

    Just they don't want to put the effort into making it work...It's obvious they can make a battle healer work if they want to...but probably the only reason they tried to make Disc work is to make it unique from Holy.

  9. #109
    Have you played it? The only way to deal damage is to be in melee range.
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  10. #110
    you have a lv 100 talente that your beacon becomes your lightbringer as same as you, so now melees hill be healed with lightbringer and if you are with rangeds they will be too. . they both groups beign affected.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    The thing with Priests is that they can always switch to another spec if they don't like this way of healing.
    And when I look at healer-rankings I am glad they didn't try this on us.


    I think the problem is that people might have a difficult time separating two things.

    So just so everyone knows:
    Yes, we are a healer that can dish out some pretty nice numbers with melee attacks.
    No, we do not heal by doing damage. That is the Discipline Priest's area.
    Actually, in pvp one of our best builds is healing through dealing damage. We do an insane amount of damage with the Avenging Crusader talent and we also do an insane amount of healing with that talent through dealing damage. Its actually really really good and its one of our best builds atm in pvp.

    In pve though, you can choose to stand at range with BotL or stay in melee and take BoV instead (both have been proven good for raids}. Ive tried both and I prefer healing in melee with BoV, if I set things up right I can get more throughput with BoV and standing in melee. Not only that but I contribute a decent amount of dps as well. I do stand in range though sometimes and when I do I take BotL, I only do this for really spread out fights though.

    Either way, you can really do whatever you choose here. I mainly prefer standing in melee and healing with BoV rather than standing at range with BotL. Some fights might work better with BotL and some work better with BoV.

  12. #112
    Over 9000! Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    The thing with Priests is that they can always switch to another spec if they don't like this way of healing.
    And when I look at healer-rankings I am glad they didn't try this on us.


    I think the problem is that people might have a difficult time separating two things.

    So just so everyone knows:
    Yes, we are a healer that can dish out some pretty nice numbers with melee attacks.
    No, we do not heal by doing damage. That is the Discipline Priest's area.
    So basically every healing spec has to be basically the same? Every spec is the same besides their own mechanics...can't have any spec break the mold because it may upset a few people? Didn't seem to bother them when they took this approach with other specs...

    They didn't have a problem axing Fistweaving even though it upset people...didn't have a problem turning survival melee even though it upset people...didn't have a problem turning frost pure dw even though it upset people...

    I just think they don't want to put the effort into making a melee healer work...they could of done it with Mistweaver but didn't...they shaped Holy like they were going to and even gave a 2H artifact...yet went back on that. I just think they don't want to bother...another corner they cut, which grows ever more common with them.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Every spec should do the 'same' amount of things in a different way.
    Why would you take a healer that has 100k hps when you can also pick the healer that has 100k hps ánd 50k dps?

    The fuck are you talking about?
    Nothing about that has anything to do with this discussion.

    The point is that if you want to do DPS, you have to give up healing.
    For priests that is fine since they have a pure healing spec to fall back to if it fails (and it did fail).

    It CANNOT work.
    How is that cutting into corners?
    When and where did they promise we'd get this?

    In the preview we only had this: "Talents will also provide players with options to incorporate offensive capabilities while healing."
    Nothing in there says we heal BY doing damage.
    It cannot work? You believe everything you're told then? We were told that there wouldn't be huge droughts but do we still get them? Yes...

    Fine if you want to be a sheep then be a sheep...isn't much more point in continuing this talk with you.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Tell me.
    How would it work?
    How would we still be able to do JUST as much healing as any other healer while also doing relevant damage?
    It's not that it doesn't work because they haven't tried.
    It doesn't work because 100% healing and 50% DPS means you're playing 1.5 characters while everyone is playing 1 character.
    Healers in legion do damage while not healing. Some healers do damage while healing. It's not that hard to grasp honestly. They won't do much damage compared to DPS classes, but all healing specs should do some damage, because of downtime between healing (when you used to spam glyphed lightning bolt in firelands, or alt+tabbed on any other class).

    So... it's not about playing 1,5 classes, it's about "if this encounter and this situation allows me to do damage?". If the encounter doesn't allow you to be in melee when healing downtime happens - well, holy paladin and mistmonk are "screwed" DPS wise. If the downtime is short but huge damage spike is expected and your AoE miracle is on cooldown - spam the fuck out of renew while you can. AFAIK holy paladins do not suffer from this problem they just press buttons for strong heals, instead of having "oh, i have to put plea buff up on everyone", or "i need to roll hots on everyone", etc. Group taken damage, you press buttons, group gets to full health, engaging mace-smacking sequence.

    But to answer your question:
    Every spec should do the 'same' amount of things in a different way.
    Why would you take a healer that has 100k hps when you can also pick the healer that has 100k hps ánd 50k dps?
    Not every encounter will allow said healer to do 100k hps and 50k dps. In one encounter it may be priest who can do this. In next encounter priest can't do it, but paladin can.
    It's not uncommon for top guilds to swap players characters depending on what class compositions do perform the best on encounter basis, so... nothing really changes for them.
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2016-08-24 at 03:31 AM.
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