Germany bans muslim teen from wearing niqab

[Aeula]

Good. Hopefully the ban ends up being enforced all over Europe one day.

[minteK917]

Would you complain if you had to circumcise your daughters, let your beard grow, get up at 5 to pray to a god you don't believe in etc? I'm not saying you would chose death instead, but would you just say "well, it's their country, better shut up and do exactly what they do without question"?

I would............ NOT GO THERE?

[Deleted]

If a person is white. Born and raised in a European country. But is Muslim and wears a burqa are they now not assimilated to their own country because of their choice in religion?

Well, what you are trying to say is that this person is not acting in accordance with their own culture, then yes.

[minteK917]

Denying people the right to wear what they want is oppressive.

You cant wear hats in class. Checkmate.

[tankbug]

I would............ NOT GO THERE?

So starve, suffer and die instead?
Do you think these people are tourists?

[Deleted]

Would you complain if you had to circumcise your daughters, let your beard grow, get up at 5 to pray to a god you don't believe in etc? I'm not saying you would chose death instead, but would you just say "well, it's their country, better shut up and do exactly what they do without question"?

This has absolutely nothing to do with what i have said. You are trying to make a straw man, but you seem to be failing really hard with it. Take a deep breath and try it again.
The only thing you are doing here is defending the right of refugees to practise FGM in the west because "they where allowed to do it at home".

[Deleted]

it is very easy to sit in your comfortable chair and say how liberal you are and the hijab should not be banned because its religion.


now ask the thousands of victims of terror attacks that came about from CCTV/officers cameras not being able to identify the assailant before they acted.

just because you pretend there is not a problem. does not mean there is not one.

[minteK917]

So starve, suffer and die instead?
Do you think these people are tourists?

How about do exactly like i would do, go to a country that shares values and thats not at War? You know Egypt, Turkey, Iran.

[Asrialol]

Good. I'm all for certain types of religious expression.

However, those that can be used by a prospective terrorist to mask their appearance have no place in society.

Don't like it, go to another country.

Funny how everyone seems to be so afraid of terrorists these days. Must be a hard life.

[Kaesebrezen]

Denying people the right to wear what they want is oppressive.

I can't run around naked, i'm also oppressed...

[Xarkan]

How about do exactly like i would do, go to a country that shares values and thats not at War? You know Egypt, Turkey, Iran.

Turkey seems to be under something like martial law
Egypt is in a state of dictatorship
Iran favors only half of Islam

[Machismo]

I can't run around naked, i'm also oppressed...

Technically, that is a restriction of a victimless action, and can be construed as an undue burden. It just happens to be a form of oppression you find to be acceptable.

[minteK917]

Turkey seems to be under something like martial law
Egypt is in a state of dictatorship
Iran favors only half of Islam

Then you do like everyone else. You fucking adapt to the situation of the country you decided to join. If Full face mask is not legal in a public estbalishment, you just have to do just that. Just like smokers cant smoke inside, just like nudist cant run around naked.

[Deleted]

I can't run around naked, i'm also oppressed...

Yes it is. It is a denial of individual liberty.

You can argue whether it is a good or bad thing, but it is still oppressive, a denial of individual liberty.

It is nonsenical bullshit to pretend a restriction on individual liberty is somehow acts in opposition to oppression.

[tankbug]

This has absolutely nothing to do with what i have said. You are trying to make a straw man, but you seem to be failing really hard with it. Take a deep breath and try it again.
The only thing you are doing here is defending the right of refugees to practise FGM in the west because "they where allowed to do it at home".

"What are you talking about??"
You said you should conform to the country's laws and culture because you should gtfo otherwise. I say that you might find that difficult in certain situations, even when the alternative is no future at all. Don't treat it like it's a simple and easy matter.
Btw, I'm not defending FGM at all, since I use it as an extreme example it should be obvious that my opinion is quite the opposite.

[Themius]

Denying people the right to wear what they want is oppressive.

This is true.

When afghanistan banned the burqa (and yes they did at one point) many women felt uncomfortable and wanted to wear them and felt as if it was their right.

[Algoma0]

That doesn't mean that they do not have to assimilate, because they do. The point of contention is how much do they need to assimilate, do they need to speak the language? Or is just having papers enough and assimilated? Or are there other/more things we expect from people who come to live here?
I think everyone will answer these things differently, and although there is sort of a common census about it, there are still points of contention.

Yes, I'd love to hear a reasonable discussion on this topic. But it surely can't go as far as saying "You shouldn't wear this outfit because we don't like it".

Assimilating and adjusting to a certain culture shouldn't be a talking point when talking about banning specific clothes. The only valid argument is, and should be, that you are not allowed to conceil your face or, as others have pointed out, wear a hat etc. to specific gatherings - school in this case.

Saying that "muslims shouldnt be allowed to wear burqas because they need to adjust to our culture" is stupid and not a valid argument. Am I not allowed to wear a shirt with asian dancers on it because that doesn't specifically reflect our culture? What a ridiculous and seriously scary idea.

[Themius]

Well, what you are trying to say is that this person is not acting in accordance with their own culture, then yes.

Oh but if they're Christian then they're acting in accordance with their culture?

[Logwyn]

I'm Dutch.


It's more the fact that women are treated as slaves and things instead of human beings.

Isn't this reason enough to ban or disallow said niqab? Would we allow someone to run around with a KKK outfit in the same situation? After all it brings the symbolism of slavery/slaves not of gender but race.

[Machismo]

Then you do like everyone else. You fucking adapt to the situation of the country you decided to join. If Full face mask is not legal in a public estbalishment, you just have to do just that. Just like smokers cant smoke inside, just like nudist cant run around naked.

The existence of a law is never a justification for it.