Havoc in Legion: 7.2.5 Guide

[jayinjersey]

Aside from trinkets, item level > everything else.

Trinkets are just different because they work different in terms of stat budget and buffs and other stuff.

Except for those Kara reward gloves...use those Kara reward gloves if you are doing Invasions/HFC (possibly even into real leveling...but I don't know how/if they will scale)

[Vanyali]

What is the mod being used in the gif that shows abilities and pain generation?

Weakauras

Is there any specific class hall leveling atm for Havoc? any specific talents to pick ?

Doesn't matter; pick for endgame. You won't be at level 109-110 long enough for it to matter.

[High Marshal Sigismund]

Demon Blades nerfed again.

Good.

[Vanyali]

At what point is Demon Blades going to be situational and Preparation the better DPS talent? Or are they both viable now after this nerf?

Updated the front with it; as before, Prep is better in most caes. The three conditions that you COULD use Dblades are now ALL required;

- target is large
- you have legendary ring
- you have an extremely crit-skewed gear set

So.. it's still BiT under some situations, and we'll likely be using it at some point. Especially considering the ring is our *best* legendary by far for single target.

[Vanyali]

Good to know, I was hoping to switch out of DB, this broke the camel's back... thankfully...

Prep beats it in just about all aoe situations anyway (even with one add), so we're talking maybe one fight in the expansion unless you get put on bitch duty somewhere that you'd use it. Even before the nerf.

People have been taking Pawkets sims (which are extremely crit skewed) as representing Dblades was / is best in all situations.. it's not, and it's ONLY because of that crit-skew which he noted when he posted 'em.

[Vanyali]

Yeah, Icy-Veins and Noxxic still have DBlades as the "goto". But I found the rotation boring, and just standing there waiting for rage, etc, a bit odd. Now with this nerf, and with the situationals you brought up, I switched to Prep.

Don't use Noxxic.

Their guide isn't only wrong it's not even paying attention to it's OWN talent choices (doesn't pick prep - notes VR as your "primary fury generator". Not true even *with* prep). So just... don't use it.

Also, for Dblades you really shouldn't be standing; you should be Rushing / TG'ing to get yourself on GCD, which provides you with fury to use CS that gets you on GCD, which sets you up to really only have to wait one, MAYBE two, GCDs for fury at any point (which you'd be using for with Dbite anyway)

[Brakandaren]

Congrats to all the people crying about DBlades being a usable talent. Now those of us who enjoy it have to chose between gimping ourselves or hating our lives.

[Halyon]

Am I the only one who's really annoyed that a class with this much mobility HAS to use all of it for optimal dps instead of gtfo'ing out stuff, were mobility would benefit more?

Unless I get really unlucky, I will use DBlades. It's a shame too that the talents are either so useless or pigeonholed to a specific playstyle. Maybe I'll just resign myself to tanking and not be picked over the other, better, tanks.../sigh

[Feawen]

Especially considering the ring is our *best* legendary by far.

What about the bracers?

Yeah, usually all the talents/spells were already used, I was either waiting for CD to refresh, or needed Fury.

Noted on Noxxic. I've been using Icy-Veins more.

Or you could just use @Vanyali since he keeps his sticky up to date more.

[Vanyali]

What about the bracers?



Or you could just use @Vanyali since he keeps his sticky up to date more.

Meant for ST.

AoE, bracers / boots are the best ofc. Sorry, super unclear :B

[Slirith]

Am I the only one who's really annoyed that a class with this much mobility HAS to use all of it for optimal dps instead of gtfo'ing out stuff, were mobility would benefit more?

Unless I get really unlucky, I will use DBlades. It's a shame too that the talents are either so useless or pigeonholed to a specific playstyle. Maybe I'll just resign myself to tanking and not be picked over the other, better, tanks.../sigh

Agreed...minus the tanking part as I loathe tanking lol

[Feawen]

Am I the only one who's really annoyed that a class with this much mobility HAS to use all of it for optimal dps instead of gtfo'ing out stuff, were mobility would benefit more? /sigh

I am not annoyed by it and actually enjoy the playstyle. The biggest enjoyment for me is learning the encounters so I know when to use my mobility for dmg. That will be our "Optimal dps" Bad DHs will think they need to use all of it for optimal dps instead of gtfo'ing out stuff. Unless your in LFR and that is your cup of tea...

This understanding of DHs and also the Momentum playstyle will actually create imo a large delta between TOP DHs and those that made them to play the new class.

Meant for ST.

AoE, bracers / boots are the best ofc. Sorry, super unclear :B

Thanks @Vanyali just wanted clarity. How many targets to you see the boots really making it big. Thought the helm would be close for AOE.

[Halyon]

Meant for ST.

AoE, bracers / boots are the best ofc. Sorry, super unclear :B

Question, if I may, how's survivability for Havoc at endgame currently? Mostly related to the whole momentum/Prepared setup.

[Vanyali]

Question, if I may, how's survivability for Havoc at endgame currently? Mostly related to the whole momentum/Prepared setup.

It's fine, soul leech is generally enough to sustain you where killing smaller things for orbs can't be done.

If you mean raiding specifically, there's not many fights that actively punish moving with momo (save star augar) so unless you actively point yourself at fire and go you're gonna do fine with the movement factor

[Halyon]

I am not annoyed by it and actually enjoy the playstyle. The biggest enjoyment for me is learning the encounters so I know when to use my mobility for dmg. That will be our "Optimal dps" Bad DHs will think they need to use all of it for optimal dps instead of gtfo'ing out stuff. Unless your in LFR and that is your cup of tea...

This understanding of DHs and also the Momentum playstyle will actually create imo a large delta between TOP DHs and those that made them to play the new class.

No, I've played hunter and tanking for a big part of the years since BC were I started. I'm not dumb, and I know what to save my cd's for etc. I just don't at all like that all the wonderful mobility options that DH gives me, wants me to use all of them for optimal dps. Ofc you can time your CD's to use them to escape, I do that as well.

I do LFR when I want to afk my brain for the time it takes.

I like utility though. But there's a reason why I don't play ret. DH blows a lot of that utility, and are pigeonholed into it, to do their best dps, and I don't like that, otherwise I love DH. I would way rather use the hunger talent if it was remotely viable in raiding, but it isn't. Barely useful in leveling over the others too...

[Vanyali]

Thanks @Vanyali just wanted clarity. How many targets to you see the boots really making it big. Thought the helm would be close for AOE.

It's actually not set in stone like that; the boots get better with more adds, but so does the helm. But the helm favors situations where adds come in waves more than the boots, since the CD is longer. So someting like.. mm... HFC, boots > helm. Something like Iskar helm > boots.

[Halyon]

It's fine, soul leech is generally enough to sustain you where killing smaller things for orbs can't be done.

If you mean raiding specifically, there's not many fights that actively punish moving with momo (save star augar) so unless you actively point yourself at fire and go you're gonna do fine with the movement factor

Aight, cheers for the response! Still, kinda hope there's other viable builds by the time endgame becomes relevant on live...

[Vanyali]

Aight, cheers for the response! Still, kinda hope there's other viable builds by the time endgame becomes relevant on live...

Doubtful; FM is just too high synergy with the style vs. the other two talents. BF just.. nngh. #Eyebeamproblems

[Halyon]

Doubtful; FM is just too high synergy with the style vs. the other two talents. BF just.. nngh. #Eyebeamproblems

Sorry, I meant Demonic Appetite from second tier. FM is fine with me tbh, it's more the whole vault thing. I can live fine with using a forward charge for attacking, but vault is literally just a disengage, and I want to use it as such /cough. It's Prepared I have the biggest problem with.

I feel naked otherwise. Sure, some of it is a me problem...

[Vanyali]

Sorry, I meant Demonic Appetite from second tier. FM is fine with me tbh, it's more the whole vault thing. I can live fine with using a forward charge for attacking, but vault is literally just a disengage, and I want to use it as such /cough. It's Prepared I have the biggest problem with.

I feel naked otherwise. Sure, some of it is a me problem...

Oh.

Well, the major problem with DA is the fury is rng AND flung to africa sometimes.. together makes for a poor combo :\ not sure what they could do to fix it