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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by pingasman82 View Post
    I guess there really aren't that many strong night elves anymore... I think Malfurion would be a match for her, but pretty no other night elf, unless I'm forgetting someone. I wouldn't mess with Azshara if I was a night elf :P

    Well it isn't spelled out like ''Azshara got weaker when the Well was gone'', but it is safe to assume that with that enormous power source gone, her might did take a hit. That assumption is supported by the fact that her recent efforts did not go very swimmingly (heh).
    Which things exactly?
    What a terrible argument. Her plans failed, so she's not very powerful? we have failed every villain in this games plans, so i guess every villain is weak huh?

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Role Unknown View Post
    Blizzard is already on record as saying that they want to add more content to Legion than past expansions.

    Your right, Blizzard doesn't have to "release" Nighthold with a new patch, but they will.....Blizzard already considers Nighthold as the next tier, and releasing it with a new patch is a cheap way to make that patch look bigger than it is. Don't be fooled into thinking otherwise....Blizzard(of late) has been notorious for doing what they can to extend content without putting much work into it(hence Karazhan). I wouldn't be surprised to see Ulduar become a 5 man later this expansion.

    So basically Blizzard is going to "smear" their release content over as much time as possible. That gives them a good amount of time to work on future raids/patches we wont start seeing til March - July.
    Its always interesting to see the narrative that "Blizzard(of late)" is lazy and stretching content, when the 2 laziest raid tiers we ever got were both in WOTLK where they just recycled and dumbed down vanilla naxx and then two patches later gave us a 2 room raid with 5 bosses and stretched it out by releasing one per week and limiting attempts.

    I cant imagine there is less effort going into this new Karazhan than what went into either of those.
    Last edited by nazrakin; 2016-08-24 at 08:52 PM.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Redroniksre View Post
    Her power rivaled Mannoroth and was maybe on par of Archimonde, BUT that was from the perspective of Mannoroth, who isn't a very reliable source given how frequently we fuck his day up. Problem is Azshara is not a leader, people love to have headcannon that she is some big powerful leader, but she has, and always will be, a pawn. First used by Sargeras, now by N'zoth, if anything she would just be a first/mid tier boss of an Old God expansion. N'zoth's power doesn't lie in his army strength but rather his ability to corrupt, it wouldn't be him in particular i would be worried about, but rather what he can do.
    Her power (most likely) rivaled Archimonde and Kil'jaeden, not Mannoroth. She could have obliterated Mannoroth with snapping her fingers - that's at least what the novel tells us. Anything besides that is a big vague.

    Azshara a pawn? lol

    Sure she was the one helping the Legion to bring Sargeras to Azeroth but she's so much more than a pawn - she's Queen of the Highborne and she is Queen of the Naga. And most likely she's now the right hand of N'zoth and that should be quite a high position, shouldn't it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pingasman82 View Post
    I guess there really aren't that many strong night elves anymore... I think Malfurion would be a match for her, but pretty no other night elf, unless I'm forgetting someone. I wouldn't mess with Azshara if I was a night elf :P
    Malfurion is a whiny, weak baby - that's at least what the novels are telling us. Excuse me, he could not even stand Maiev's betrayal. Sure Malfurion should be super powerful but his lore is quite pathetic (although I really liked his novel).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Role Unknown View Post
    Your right, Blizzard doesn't have to "release" Nighthold with a new patch, but they will.....Blizzard already considers Nighthold as the next tier, and releasing it with a new patch is a cheap way to make that patch look bigger than it is.
    Nighthold is Tier 19. It can't be Tier 20 because if so we would not have a Tier 19. It's simple as that. Blizzard f*cked up many things in the last years but I doubt they'll ruin Legion. It's their last chance to "safe" WoW as it is now.

  4. #64
    Narru are involved in legion but i would hazard a guess 7.2 might not be azeroth it might be a demon planet.

    I hope to god its not two raid tiers again that was just fail this expansion. and it will fail horribly if they try that again.

    3-4 raids at least per expansion


    The best thing would be for us to finally start getting off world and going offence spelljammer style.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Azshara a pawn? lol

    Sure she was the one helping the Legion to bring Sargeras to Azeroth but she's so much more than a pawn - she's Queen of the Highborne and she is Queen of the Naga. And most likely she's now the right hand of N'zoth and that should be quite a high position, shouldn't it?
    Being the queen of something excludes you from being a pawn of someone/something else?

  6. #66
    Important fact check time:

    Watcher told one of the streamers at Gamescom that

    * 7.1 ("mini raid" plus Karazhan) will be on the PTR shortly after Legion launches and in release at some point before the end of the year
    * The Nighthold is being released "early in 2017"

    It stands to reason that they have made some internal changes and, now, The Nighthold will be in patch 7.2. They were originally releasing The Nighthold close to Legion release, but obviously that's now changed, and for good reason (releasing raids together too quickly.)

    We should stop assuming that they are playing with the same paradigms as Warlords of Draenor. Patches in WoD were extremely minimal: one was a systems patch, the other had Tanaan and HFC. There's every reason in the world to think that they are changing the way they release things, including patches more incrementally, starting with a 7.1 that includes a "mini raid" in Stormheim (probably something akin to Obsidian and Ruby Sanctums), and the new Karazhan, and a 7.2 featuring The Nighthold. There's no reason to think that there won't be a 7.3 and a 7.4, and maybe even more thereafter.

    (And whatever people think about the final raid, I think it's pretty obviously The Tomb of Sargeras. The zone already exists with a massive building in it. We're obviously going to be going there in the future.)

  7. #67
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    I think people are getting to hung up on the 7.2/T20 stuff... it's all just arbitrary numbers. The main point of this thread (IMO) is the speculate on what raid is coming after Nighthold, numbering be damned.

    To that end, I would say probably Tomb of Sarg and closing the portal/taking over the portal, with an assault on Argus/other demon world where KJ/Ressed Sarg/whomever the big baddy is, is located

  8. #68
    Sorry, no. Malfurion hardly fought of Xavius (twice) and now he should stand against Azshara? Malfurion is not even the strongest "racial" leader out there.
    Pretty sure Malfurion defeated Xavius 3 times. He also was a match for Azshara in WC3's WotA. Which faction leader is stronger than Malfurion anyway? I hope you don't mean Velen lol.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Hey there,

    we already know most parts of the first (small) content patch of Legion, 7.1. I'm more interested in the huge content and raid tier patch 7.2 that will introduce T20. That's why I'm starting this thread - we literally don't have any information on what the next Tiers in Legion will look like.

    What do you think will happen? What raid will be there? Which encounters? Which source of evil are we going to face in 7.2?

    Will we see Tal'dranath like the Isle of Thunder back in 5.2? Will we see a raid themed around Nagas with Queen Azshara as the final boss?

    I would like to discuss this - please share your thoughts with me / us.

    Let the guesstimates begin!
    A guesstimate is a guess and an estimate. What you're doing is guessing and speculating. Estimates usually require numbers or ranges of numbers.

    Also: WTB troll raid

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by nazrakin View Post
    Its always interesting to see the narrative that "Blizzard(of late)" is lazy and stretching content, when the 2 laziest raid tiers we ever got were both in WOTLK where they just recycled and dumbed down vanilla naxx and then two patches later gave us a 2 room raid with 5 bosses and stretched it out by releasing one per week and limiting attempts.

    I cant imagine there is less effort going into this new Karazhan than what went into either of those.
    So, what you are saying is that Blizzard has been lazy and stretching content from the start?? Im neither shocked nor surprised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Nighthold is Tier 19. It can't be Tier 20 because if so we would not have a Tier 19. It's simple as that. Blizzard f*cked up many things in the last years but I doubt they'll ruin Legion. It's their last chance to "safe" WoW as it is now.
    I never said Nighthold would be Tier 20, but it will be "included" with the patch in early 2017.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    but you have that information - 7.2 & T20 will be Nighthold - you just choose not to accept the truth thats right in front of your eyes

    [
    Troll somewhere else, ty.

  12. #72
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    I'm thinking either 7.2 or 7.4 will be Argus, Kil'Jaedins palace, but i'm not sure we'll be going through the tomb of sargeras, as the point is to close the portal lol.

    Could be the dh thing they have that lets them take a portal to any world.

    Or draeneii spaceship.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Role Unknown View Post
    So, what you are saying is that Blizzard has been lazy and stretching content from the start?? Im neither shocked nor surprised.
    Well personally, I dont mind it. I think its a smart move and Im looking forward to that new Kara. However, if I were making the shitty petulant argument about how lazy Blizzard is then I would be remiss to ignore the history.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by pingasman82 View Post
    Um no, it was only stated that out of Hakkar, Mannoroth and Archimonde, only the eredar could defeat her. Sargeras could squash Archimonde like a bug, Azshara stands no chance... Jesus
    She was an exceptionally talented mage before the WotA, calling her the ''most powerful night elf in existence'' is probably a bit much, seeing as she got defeated.
    You're just making that stuff about her absorbing the magic of the Well up... she was drowning in its waters and let the old gods change her so she could survive the ordeal, the well was gone.
    She did not get empowered, that is not stated anywhere.
    She also did not capture Neptulon, as shamans have him and his pet kraken as allies in their order hall campaign in Legion.

    The source of a large amount of her power was the Well which is gone and held enough magical energy to SUMMON SARGERAS, how on earth did her power level go up after that? The fact that shes been failing everything, couldn't kill Malfurion in Darkshore and couldn't even fight off a frigging ghost in Azuna tells me her powers have vastly diminished.

    Waging wars in the ocean against what? Murlocs? Crabs? While she could obviously be doing things, the things which we know of haven't gone well for her... which means she isn't nearly as powerful as you make her out to be. Sorry
    umm lol are you trolling? she doesnt get rekt by a random nightelf ghost... she taunts him and then laughs in his face while taking hits from him and leaves without even casting anything. Your obviously just biased because you dislike her so you try exaggerating shit to look like you have more reasons to think shes too weak.

    Yes she got defeated in wota by everybody in the world fighting against her. How weak of her.

    failing everything? Even though blizzard was dumb and made neptulon pop up out of nowhere after 6 years she still won in vashj'ir.

    and once again you making snarky remarks isnt anything but cute since it makes you look desperate... Like its above blizzard to actually make us fight murlocs and crabs i mean MoP had people like you saying "lol what are we going to fight lolpandas derpadoo!" Never mind the makrura, sea giants and things like lurker living down there.

    Guess deathwing was too weak to have his own expansion since he got rekt by a random tauren too

    nobody really knows how strong she is but she isnt weak just because you dont like her. Get over yourself dude.
    Last edited by Koreche; 2016-08-25 at 03:32 AM.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildmoon View Post
    Pretty sure Malfurion defeated Xavius 3 times. He also was a match for Azshara in WC3's WotA. Which faction leader is stronger than Malfurion anyway? I hope you don't mean Velen lol.
    He did but how did he accomplish that? And yes, I'm talking about Velen. Malfurion from a lore standpoint seems to be a bad joke. I know that he should be incredibly powerful but it doesn't seem so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    A guesstimate is a guess and an estimate. What you're doing is guessing and speculating. Estimates usually require numbers or ranges of numbers.
    Tier 19 - Tier 20 - Patch 7.2, 7.3 - there you have your numbers.

  16. #76
    Another thing that comes to me mind... we know something will happen to Jaina.

    To be honest I can see Jaina turn into some kind of Staghelm 2.0 but definitely not in favor of the Legion but of N'zoth. Could fit quite well into the next expansion (that most likely will deal with N'zoth and the Naga). Or maybe she'll be the endboss of T20? I doubt she's "big" enough to be the endboss of Legion. But I can see her in a spot where Gul'dan is now.

  17. #77
    I think Jaina will be the Alliance Sylvanas. Blizzard will continue to tease but she'll never be an actual raid boss.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by nazrakin View Post
    I think Jaina will be the Alliance Sylvanas. Blizzard will continue to tease but she'll never be an actual raid boss.
    What exactly is "wrong" with Sylvanas?

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    What exactly is "wrong" with Sylvanas?
    Im not saying there is anything wrong with her. I'm saying that Blizzard likes teasing Sylvanas as a potential antagonist but they'll never go all the way.

  20. #80
    Pandaren Monk Redroniksre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    Her power (most likely) rivaled Archimonde and Kil'jaeden, not Mannoroth. She could have obliterated Mannoroth with snapping her fingers - that's at least what the novel tells us. Anything besides that is a big vague.

    Azshara a pawn? lol

    Sure she was the one helping the Legion to bring Sargeras to Azeroth but she's so much more than a pawn - she's Queen of the Highborne and she is Queen of the Naga. And most likely she's now the right hand of N'zoth and that should be quite a high position, shouldn't it?

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    Malfurion is a whiny, weak baby - that's at least what the novels are telling us. Excuse me, he could not even stand Maiev's betrayal. Sure Malfurion should be super powerful but his lore is quite pathetic (although I really liked his novel).

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    Nighthold is Tier 19. It can't be Tier 20 because if so we would not have a Tier 19. It's simple as that. Blizzard f*cked up many things in the last years but I doubt they'll ruin Legion. It's their last chance to "safe" WoW as it is now.
    Shes a queen but she always serves higher powers. Sargeras had her bending over backwards for him because she knew how powerful he was, how he could obliterate her if he so chose. Right hand of N'zoth? Not even, she will be one of his most valuable assets, but she is nowhere near powerful enough to be a right hand, especially given her precious pet that tried to control Neptulon was then controlled by him. She has had no victories, none since the well collapsed.

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