Stop making Horde and Orcs the bad guys

[Saracens]

Stop making the invaders from another world the bad guys? -pokes fire-

[Lady Dragonheart]

You admitting the alliance ran because the horde ran, is admitting incompetence that the alliance can actually you accomplish anything without the horde there holding their hands.

I said the Alliance is incompetent, though, not being able to win because they relied on the Horde to do it's own namesake battle-cry, expect failing at it, miserably. So, where exactly are you trying to make your point? My issue is with the Horde being all "Lok'tar Ogar!" Except when you're losing, then it's "Victory or death... except when we're losing, then we run like cowards."

[Lady Dragonheart]

@Derah went into great detail about this in previous threads. Here's a few of his/her quotes:


And a page with multiple quotes so you can get the gist of the convo: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...nematics/page9

What about it? Running away is still dishonorable, regardless of your reasons. So, I'm still waiting for you to point it out without making excuses as to why you;d run from a fight.

[Kallisto]

They only left because the Horde chickened out first. There is no honor or glory in fleeing.

OMG you are on Moonguard you should know the god damn lore.

It has been clearly stated in game that victory was not achievable. No matter how much Varian yells "Victory is ours!". Neither side had the pillars of creation which was necessary to close the portals (Magni states the pillars are the necessity to win in the second part of the pre patch story arc). If the horde stayed then they would have had more demons, more airships pounding them and more losses. All for what, a guaranteed loss that was set up as a trap by the legion. That anyone with half a mind would have realised it was a trap the moment the demons suddenly vanished with little attacks from both alliance and horde. (And both sides saying so that this is a trap itself)

[Lady Dragonheart]

Again, from Derah:

Again, running is dishonorable. Just because the Alliance does it, should the Horde do it too? Or does "Lok'tar Ogar" not mean anything to a Horde character?

[beanman12345]

I said the Alliance is incompetent, though, not being able to win because they relied on the Horde to do it's own namesake battle-cry, expect failing at it, miserably. So, where exactly are you trying to make your point? My issue is with the Horde being all "Lok'tar Ogar!" Except when you're losing, then it's "Victory or death... except when we're losing, then we run like cowards."

oh apologies i missed you saying that.

As far as lok'tar ogar that's not a horde saying. that's in orcish cause it's an orc saying. the only orcs at the BS were thrall and his baby thrall earthen ring guys(i call them that to my gf cause thrall being so tall and them being tiny, wearing the same clothes and just surrounding him the whole time) that i can't really say the phrase applies, when it was an troll who gave the order to the undead to retreat.

[Lady Dragonheart]

OMG you are on Moonguard you should know the god damn lore.

It has been clearly stated in game that victory was not achievable. No matter how much Varian yells "Victory is ours!". Neither side had the pillars of creation which was necessary to close the portals (Magni states the pillars are the necessity to win in the second part of the pre patch story arc). If the horde stayed then they would have had more demons, more airships pounding them and more losses. All for what, a guaranteed loss that was set up as a trap by the legion. That anyone with half a mind would have realised it was a trap the moment the demons suddenly vanished with little attacks from both alliance and horde. (And both sides saying so that this is a trap itself)

So what? You stand and fight when you're at war. That's what being Horde is, Lok'tar Ogar! Victory or Death!

[Jotaux]

So what? You stand and fight when you're at war. That's what being Horde is, Lok'tar Ogar! Victory or Death!

And. We. Chose. Victory.

[Lady Dragonheart]

oh apologies i missed you saying that.

As far as lok'tar ogar that's not a horde saying. that's in orcish cause it's an orc saying. the only orcs at the BS were thrall and his baby thrall earthen ring guys(i call them that to my gf cause thrall being so tall and them being tiny, wearing the same clothes and just surrounding him the whole time) that i can't really say the phrase applies, when it was an troll who gave the order to the undead to retreat.

Earthen Ring is not Horde.

- - - Updated - - -

And. We. Chose. Victory.

Well, victory looks a lot like Alliance to me.

[beanman12345]

Earthen Ring is not Horde.

- - - Updated - - -



Well, victory looks a lot like Alliance to me.

yes but they are orcs, lok'tar ogar is orc, not horde.

[Jotaux]

Well, victory looks a lot like Alliance to me.

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean, but yes the alliance and the horde will have victory over the legion instead of death.

[Lady Dragonheart]

yes but they are orcs, lok'tar ogar is orc, not horde.

So, the Horde has turned into pansies that run from their fights, then? Like I said, that sounds like Alliance to me.

[beanman12345]

So, the Horde has turned into pansies that run from their fights, then? Like I said, that sounds like Alliance to me.

horde was never victory or death. orc was this isn't hard to understand. Retreating isn't being a pansy. it's living to be victorious later. And anyone with a 30 brain cells would agree that beating the legion as a whole, is real victory and better then dying on a rock in the middle of an ocean.

[Lady Dragonheart]

I have no idea what this is supposed to mean, but yes the alliance and the horde will have victory over the legion instead of death.

So, for you it's "I'm the main character, this story has a narrative that ultimately end in me winning no matter what; therefore, I don't care if my faction looks like pansies, betraying all that they stand for, running away from their fights, because it will all work out in the end."

[Jotaux]

So, for you it's "I'm the main character, this story has a narrative that ultimately end in me winning no matter what; therefore, I don't care if my faction looks like pansies, betraying all that they stand for, running away from their fights, because it will all work out in the end."

No, the difference is I am not Rping. I am looking at the story, the choices of the characters in the story and both the consequences and logic of those choices. If they did not retreat the Horde would have lost their entire leadership structure and the Alliance would have lost both Greymane and the gnome leader in addition to Varian. The horde made the choice to pursue victory instead of death.

[beanman12345]

So, for you it's "I'm the main character, this story has a narrative that ultimately end in me winning no matter what; therefore, I don't care if my faction looks like pansies, betraying all that they stand for, running away from their fights, because it will all work out in the end."

I suppose for you, the game shoulda ended during tanaan invasion, we ran then to shoulda just let them kill us. Or should have ended when we ran from the lich king in the dungeon sequence.

[Sanguinerd]

Orcs are proven to be pretty thick headed and easily manipulated, they're a race of war afterall.

As a long time Alliance player I have enough reasons to make the Orcs the badguys if I want to.

[Lady Dragonheart]

horde was never victory or death. orc was this isn't hard to understand. Retreating isn't being a pansy. it's living to be victorious later. And anyone with a 30 brain cells would agree that beating the legion as a whole, is real victory and better then dying on a rock in the middle of an ocean.

Vol'jin definitely looks like a pansy in Broken Shore when compared to Varian rushing a mountain-size Fel Reaver. On the level of badass deaths, Varian's charging into battle and being overwhelmed after slaughtering several demons and a Fel Reaver tops Vol'jin's getting carried off and dying from his wounds from a few minions.

Both died, one gloriously, in battle. The other, not so much.

[Aquinan]

I said the Alliance is incompetent, though, not being able to win because they relied on the Horde to do it's own namesake battle-cry, expect failing at it, miserably. So, where exactly are you trying to make your point? My issue is with the Horde being all "Lok'tar Ogar!" Except when you're losing, then it's "Victory or death... except when we're losing, then we run like cowards."

Whats your actual point though? We could have stayed yes, we would have died, then it would have played out the same? So stop being a passive aggressive little cunt about it.

[beanman12345]

Vol'jin definitely looks like a pansy in Broken Shore when compared to Varian rushing a mountain-size Fel Reaver. On the level of badass deaths, Varian's charging into battle and being overwhelmed after slaughtering several demons and a Fel Reaver tops Vol'jin's getting carried off and dying from his wounds from a few minions.

Both died, one gloriously, in battle. The other, not so much.

Both died, one looking like a retard cause he coulda lived, the other not so much cause he couldn't have, and he saved his entire faction and the entirety of azeroth for having the horde retreat to win the war.