1. #1

    Artifact for secondary spec

    Hello,

    Question to those with beta access. Can I safely level my secondary spec, vengeance to a decent enough level to run mythic dungeons?

    Is any and all artifact spent on vengeance going to be wasted potential for my havoc artifact?!

  2. #2
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by phuzy View Post
    Hello,

    Question to those with beta access. Can I safely level my secondary spec, vengeance to a decent enough level to run mythic dungeons?

    Is any and all artifact spent on vengeance going to be wasted potential for my havoc artifact?!
    You can do whatever you want, but the more AP you put into vengeance to less you have for Havoc.
    So the more powerful 1 is the shittier the other is.
    That being said the AP price goes up after the first 12 so you should be fine spending 12 points on both.

  3. #3
    It's really not a big deal to maintain 2, 3, or even 4 artifacts in the case of druids. AP required to level is exponential, so in total AP having two artifacts at 34 traits is about the same as having one at 37. That's just raw AP though, which isn't a complete picture. Because artifact knowledge is NOT spec specific, it becomes even easier to keep artifacts at roughly the same level from an AP per time standpoint.

    I main ret for raids and plan to be prot for basically everything else. I'm not even going to worry about my ret artifact for the first week, and once I get my three majors for both I'm going to do a 50/50 split between prot and ret, and that won't put me significantly behind. Artifact weapons are actually very off spec friendly in practice.

  4. #4
    The first 13 traits combined cost roughly the same as the 14th alone. So knock yourself out.

  5. #5
    You can see the relative artifact levelling speed in this chart

  6. #6
    One thing that's important to realize, that that chart doesn't really show, is that if you grind AP a lot, you eventually hit this point of equilibrium where it takes so astronomically long to get another trait that you aren't realistically losing anything by putting points into off spec weapons. Like, until you sit down and do the math on AP, you won't really understand why it's so fucking insane. Reminds me of this book I was reading where two woodcutters living in a virtual world were tasked with cutting down a tree. It had a max durability of ~360k. After 6 generations of woodcutters, the tree was down to ~240k durability. In two months of thwacking away at the tree, they took its durability down by about 50. That's what artifact power is like. There comes a point where there's very little point in continuing to hit the tree. And that's where artifact knowledge comes in.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Laurcus View Post
    One thing that's important to realize, that that chart doesn't really show, is that if you grind AP a lot, you eventually hit this point of equilibrium where it takes so astronomically long to get another trait that you aren't realistically losing anything by putting points into off spec weapons. Like, until you sit down and do the math on AP, you won't really understand why it's so fucking insane. Reminds me of this book I was reading where two woodcutters living in a virtual world were tasked with cutting down a tree. It had a max durability of ~360k. After 6 generations of woodcutters, the tree was down to ~240k durability. In two months of thwacking away at the tree, they took its durability down by about 50. That's what artifact power is like. There comes a point where there's very little point in continuing to hit the tree. And that's where artifact knowledge comes in.
    Dat Sword art online reference!

    But then we're gonna get knowledge and it's gonna be like using the sword to cut it down in a few days.

  8. #8
    Thanks for the info guys.

    If I start off with more in my secondary spec, i.e, level with it will there be a turning point like 10days into expansion where I can swap the ratio and give more to havoc and get back to the equilibrium in the diagram but with new mainspec?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by phuzy View Post
    Thanks for the info guys.

    If I start off with more in my secondary spec, i.e, level with it will there be a turning point like 10days into expansion where I can swap the ratio and give more to havoc and get back to the equilibrium in the diagram but with new mainspec?
    Artifact knowledge comes in every 5 days assuming you keep up on your work orders. When you hit that point of equilibrium depends greatly on how much you grind. That chart is actually super casual. Personally, I plan to have ~22-24 traits for my prot weapon and 29 traits for ret by day 21.


    Honestly, it's fairly intuitive and doesn't require a whole lot of planning once you actually sink your teeth into it. A good signal to switch is when using a bag full of AP items fills up a depressingly small amount of the bar.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mercarcher View Post
    Dat Sword art online reference!

    But then we're gonna get knowledge and it's gonna be like using the sword to cut it down in a few days.
    I didn't think anyone would get the reference. ^_^ And yeah, artifact knowledge is big dick.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by szandos View Post
    You can see the relative artifact levelling speed in this chart

    How do you get all gold traits with just 25 points?
    Using the calculator here on this site, I need 27 because you can only skip two 3-point traits and one 1-point trait.

    ?-)

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by coprax View Post
    How do you get all gold traits with just 25 points?
    Using the calculator here on this site, I need 27 because you can only skip two 3-point traits and one 1-point trait.

    ?-)
    It's different for each spec.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by coprax View Post
    How do you get all gold traits with just 25 points?
    Using the calculator here on this site, I need 27 because you can only skip two 3-point traits and one 1-point trait.

    ?-)
    Depends on the artifact and the route. On Balance I can get it with 24 points for example (albeit following an "inefficient" route). What is your spec?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Laurcus View Post
    It's different for each spec.

    It is?
    Now that's stupid.^^

    I tried it on resto shaman btw.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Laurcus View Post
    It's really not a big deal to maintain 2, 3, or even 4 artifacts in the case of druids. AP required to level is exponential, so in total AP having two artifacts at 34 traits is about the same as having one at 37. That's just raw AP though, which isn't a complete picture. Because artifact knowledge is NOT spec specific, it becomes even easier to keep artifacts at roughly the same level from an AP per time standpoint.

    I main ret for raids and plan to be prot for basically everything else. I'm not even going to worry about my ret artifact for the first week, and once I get my three majors for both I'm going to do a 50/50 split between prot and ret, and that won't put me significantly behind. Artifact weapons are actually very off spec friendly in practice.
    This. Early on you can pretty much shove a little bit of AP into your other specs' artifacts since the early talents are cheap.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Laurcus View Post
    It's different for each spec.
    They probably took the median.

    It's not really the point of the graphic anyway. The important part is that feeding AP into your offspec has very little impact on your main spec.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by coprax View Post
    It is?
    Now that's stupid.^^

    I tried it on resto shaman btw.
    Basically since they tried to make it shaped like the artifact.

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