1 Legion in all realities? CONFUSING!

[Immitis]

Er, and how is "what they get" determined?

If they attack us NOW, and later decide to attack us "back then", what then?
Bronze Dragonflight brigade attacks?

Plus, if the BL can only be "invited" to Azeroth, then they would be invited in a chronological order.
Does that mean the Legion was invited to Draenor after we went there?
If that's the case, it would make more sense.

anyone can time travel, any old mage can bend time. the bronze and now the time keepers maintain order of the timeline.

the answer to "why hasnt the legion just attacked us in ancient times"

is the exact same answer to "why doesnt sargeras just cut azeroth in half"

they DONT KNOW WHERE AZEROTH IS and even if they did it would still take a very very very long time for them to get to us through outer space.

just like in real life outer space is huge and it takes a long time to go anywhere.

which is why had we simply shut down gul'dans portal in broken shore the legion wouldve been stopped

if azeroth knew where we were/was on his way no amount of anything would save us. he'd simply pick his sword up and cut us in half the end.

[Qualia]

While they CAN time travel and CAN'T navigate properly, my point still stands that the legion can time travel. Garrosh and Wrathion could have stolen the Vision of Time and used it.

Furthermore the fact is even more shown that those other than the bronze can time travel since Garrosh/Grommash opened the red dark portal which was a time/reality portal.

Also, the bronze cannot "travel through time just fine" as the npc on TI tells you it's extremely difficult after Cata.

Nice strawman though, got me to waste a few lines on it.

Obviously the Legion can time travel, I never said that was wrong - I even pointed out that "Managarde could have been wrong with "The only way they could pull time travelling off would be to corrupt members of the bronze dragonflight"". In fact, even mortal mages can - Medivh did that, and Custodian of Time mentioned about mages tampering with time as well. However, that doesn't change the fact that your statement of "bronze can't time travel" was wrong - which was what I had to point out since that was what Managarde & Huth was talking about (the Bronze Dragonflight / Nozdormu ability to travel through time).

Also, Weaver Belmarin said "The Weavers are acanists who specialize in chronomancy; the art of weaving time. Amongst the Timewalkers, we alone can repair damage to the timeways, open temporal portals, and other such tasks. These things once came easily to the bronze dragonflight, but alas, no longer.". So yes, they can still travel through time just fine. Not as easy as before, but they do it just fine - I'm not sure what's wrong here? Or are you not getting the meaning of "just fine" (neither too good, nor too bad, still acceptable)?

[purebalance]

Obviously the Legion can time travel, I never said that was wrong - I even pointed out that "Managarde could have been wrong with "The only way they could pull time travelling off would be to corrupt members of the bronze dragonflight"". In fact, even mortal mages can - Medivh did that, and Custodian of Time mentioned about mages tampering with time as well. However, that doesn't change the fact that your statement of "bronze can't time travel" was wrong - which was what I had to point out since that was what Managarde & Huth was talking about (the Bronze Dragonflight / Nozdormu ability to travel through time).

Also, Weaver Belmarin said "The Weavers are acanists who specialize in chronomancy; the art of weaving time. Amongst the Timewalkers, we alone can repair damage to the timeways, open temporal portals, and other such tasks. These things once came easily to the bronze dragonflight, but alas, no longer.". So yes, they can still travel through time just fine. Not as easy as before, but they do it just fine - I'm not sure what's wrong here? Or are you not getting the meaning of "just fine" (neither too good, nor too bad, still acceptable)?

Lol no they can't "just fine" by what he said. He directly is implying it's difficult. It's you who doesn't seem to understand just fine. Your reading comprehension or vocabulary is awful. Or both.

[Qualia]

Lol no they can't "just fine" by what he said. He directly is implying it's difficult. It's you who doesn't seem to understand just fine. Your reading comprehension or vocabulary is awful. Or both.

It's not an English discussion thread, so I will just refer you to this. Takes 2s of Googling. In short, "just fine" means neither good, nor bad, and can be used with both negative & positive meaning, depends on the context (i.e: "Is it good? Is it bad? Well, it's just fine").

Additionally, just to give this post something related to lore - let me point out another thing that he was that saying it's no longer "came easily". Unable to do something easily doesn't necessarily means it's difficult. Not to mention that he was talking about various time-related activities ("repair damage to the timeways, open temporal portals, and other such tasks"), not just time travelling.
Well, what can I expect, you couldn't comprehend the difference between the Void and the Void Lords, after all.

[yoma]

what's the problem? legion can do whatever they want with other universes, we still have a thing that BL really want, so they are forced to invade us.
and the point on bronze dragons? their work is to mantain unchanged our timeline and infinites want fuck up our timeline, changing our history.
meanwhile AU is another universe, indipendent from our. changing its timeline changes its history, not our.

and i never will understand the complains about archies and kil'jaedens, until they aren't demons they are separate, when accept the gift, PLOP! merged together.
isnt so difficult to imagine...

Except when an Infinite dragon goes back in the WoD timeline during our presence there and offs Khadgar right from the get-go. Blamo, Iron Horde invades, Garrosh lives and all realities bow to his rugged orchishness for all time.

[Aphrel]

Someone please help me clear this mess up!

So, according to WoD there's only 1 Burning Legion. They are one and the same in all realities, yes? Doesn't that mean that they can freely manipulate all timelines and outcomes in their own favor?

I thought the Bronze Dragons were all about keeping things happening properly. But if the BL is just one in all realities, the Bronze dragons can't really do shit about it. Which really, really trivializes what the Infinite dragons are trying to do. What's the point of manipulating 1 timeline and 1 alone, if the entirety of existance and all realities are still getting fucked up by ONE SINGLE BURNING LEGION?

Is our timeline, our reality, the only one that matters? Did nobody else do better than us?

This is indeed confusing. Why isnt sargeras just going back to argus over and over again to recruit more and more arhcimonde's and kiljaeden's?
and with multiple universes whouldnt that meen an infinite number of sleeping azeroth-babytitans aswell?

[Qualia]

This is indeed confusing. Why isnt sargeras just going back to argus over and over again to recruit more and more arhcimonde's and kiljaeden's?
and with multiple universes whouldnt that meen an infinite number of sleeping azeroth-babytitans aswell?

Recruiting Archimonde & Kil'Jaeden over and over wouldn't boost the strength of the Burning Legion. Blizzard stated that there is only one Legion, one version for each demon - we don't have an AU1 demon Archimonde, AU2 demon Archimonde, etc. for example., we just have a demon Archimonde. I've seen quite a number of feasible explanations from others, but we don't know exactly how it works (Blizzard said they'd address the issue of single Legion vs multiple Legion in "Legion", so I guess we can only wait and speculate).

And yes, that could mean infinite number of sleeping baby Azeroth, especially given that Blizzard once said there are multiple Titans (when asked if Titans also transcend reality like demons) - unless they've changed their mind since then.

[Nurvus]

The more I think about it the more the Burning Legion seems like they "log in" to reality from the Twisting Nether.
When we kill them in "reality" it's just their Avatar.
We kill them in the Twisting Nether and they're really gone.

[Immitis]

The more I think about it the more the Burning Legion seems like they "log in" to reality from the Twisting Nether.
When we kill them in "reality" it's just their Avatar.
We kill them in the Twisting Nether and they're really gone.

thats pretty much exactly how it works except they also die in places significantly tainted by fel magic

[Nurvus]

thats pretty much exactly how it works except they also die in places significantly tainted by fel magic

Essentially, Burning Legion is a bunch of trolls who fight behind their screen, and can't take a punch to their real faces :P

[mistahwilshire]

Injecting time travel and parallel universes into this already fucked up setting turned it into a big, steamy pile of shit.

Those things were injected before WoW even came out if you knew the lore.

[Deleted]

I think it works like this: (That said I think this is more than Blizzard has thought about it)

All these alternate dimensions exist, but they can't be accessed until someone "creates" them (Or drags them into existence)
Kairoz did this with Alternate Draenor using the Hourglass, or whatever was left of it at the time (Which is also why that alternate dimension is limited to Draenor, the rest of that universe didn't exist)

Now I hear you say: What about those previous alternate realities?
To that I say: Cataclysm is what happened. the Dragonflights lost their powers. As such time magic (For as far we know) became almost non-existent (INB4: Mage Timewarp)

The Bronze dragonflight was charged with preserving the timeline and their biggest enemy was the Infinite Dragonflight. Which are Bronze dragons that went mad. With the Bronze flight losing it's power, the infinite flight no-longer/never existed. With no-one around to create/drag into reality/acces alternate universes the Legion is limited to fulfilling their plans in this one, they might be able to look at other possibilities, but can't acces them.

[Qualia]

Now I hear you say: What about those previous alternate realities?
To that I say: Cataclysm is what happened. the Dragonflights lost their powers. As such time magic (For as far we know) became almost non-existent (INB4: Mage Timewarp)

The Bronze dragonflight was charged with preserving the timeline and their biggest enemy was the Infinite Dragonflight. Which are Bronze dragons that went mad. With the Bronze flight losing it's power, the infinite flight no-longer/never existed. With no-one around to create/drag into reality/acces alternate universes the Legion is limited to fulfilling their plans in this one, they might be able to look at other possibilities, but can't acces them.

The Infinite Dragonflight still exist, though. They just helped Kairoz during War Crimes. Nozdormu also admitted in Cataclysm that in due time, he'll turn into Murozond and the Bronze Dragonflight will become the Infinite Dragonflight. Additionally, the Bronze dragonflight didn't lose their power completely, they are just weakened. To elaborate - all of them can still travel through time just fine, they just lost their perfect vision of past and future, and can't do time-related activities (repairing timeways, opening portals, etc.) as easily as before.

I think it works like this: (That said I think this is more than Blizzard has thought about it)

All these alternate dimensions exist, but they can't be accessed until someone "creates" them (Or drags them into existence)
Kairoz did this with Alternate Draenor using the Hourglass, or whatever was left of it at the time (Which is also why that alternate dimension is limited to Draenor, the rest of that universe didn't exist)

AU wasn't limited to Draenor. At very least, Afrasiabi confirmed that there IS an alternate Azeroth to go with AU Draenor, Blizzard just doesn't have any plan for it right now. Also, "alternate universe", "alternate dimension", "alternate timeline" and "alternate timeways" may not mean exactly the same thing.
Just curious, I want to see it from other point of view too - why do people want to make AU "non-existent" (or not physically exist) with the exception of AU Draenor, and turn AU Draenor into a pocket dimension in our universe, even when both "Illidan" and Afrasiabi confirmed the existence of other universes already? Is there any particular reason or any issue that can only be solved if AUs don't exist (or don't exist physically)? I just don't see the need of that, tbh.

[Deleted]

One example,
imagine having infinite number of stages at a rock concert, but only one demon is to set to walk up on stage and entertain.

Infinite parallel worlds will never see Archimonde, Infinite universes of Kel'thuzad will summon nothing but air at Dalaran, because Archimonde permanently died in AU Draenor

[Maximus Testiculos]

They have immensely nerfed the legion with this nonsense.

[LanceOmikron]

I remember a tweet to that effect or something (I'm not even sure how canon it was), but I've elected to completely ignore it. It makes so little sense and opens up so many plot holes that it's the very first bit of lore in Warcraft that made me say "...okay guys, you've lost me". As far as I'm concerned, there's one Burning Legion per timeline, just like everything else. The BL we fought in WoD was the Alt!Legion, and this expansion features the real one.

so how does your head canon wrap its head around gul'dan? considering hes the same one from wod

So? Alt!Gul'dan is obviously the same character from WoD, he's just working for the main-universe Legion now.

Though really, once both Cordana Felsong and Alt!Gul'dan are dead and gone, I'm just gonna pretend that Warlords of Draenor's story was a weird Emerald Nightmare-induced hallucination.

[bloodmoth13]

One example,
imagine having infinite number of stages at a rock concert, but only one demon is to set to walk up on stage and entertain.

Infinite parallel worlds will never see Archimonde, Infinite universes of Kel'thuzad will summon nothing but air at Dalaran, because Archimonde permanently died in AU Draenor

Yeah this sort of shit is really weird, also if there are infinite azeroths, then there must be infinite titans correct? what about the void? is there infinite worlds and only a finite void? does it only affect our universe?

Also there should be infinite watchers and infinite of the most powerful heroes (and i suppose villains), so as strong as the legion is, we MUST have the upper hand! unless of course there are multiple archimondes from multiple instances of corruption...

Ugh i hate time travel, you cant have a time travel story without time travel taking over the entire story, it either ends up with a destiny style situation where everything is predetermined and nothing really matters (because nobody can change their destiny in order for the future to maintain integrity) or there is a multiverse that feels forced, since time travelers do nothing to utilize the infinite resources of the multiverses.

Dunno, just dont feel like time travel ever really deals with time travel properly,its usually just an excuse for a fish out of water story or to bring someone back

[FuxieDK]

Actually, if there is only one Legion, and infinite realities, then the Legion cannot possibly win.

But the Legion is also infinite in a sense, as they take their battles outside Twisting Nether...

It's a paraphrase of "What happens when an unstopable force crash into an immovable object?"....

[Deleted]

If we take into account that killing Archimonde in the future should also erase him from the past, but it's more than that. Killing him in the future will erase him from existence. So why did we fight him so many times if he don't exist anymore? Because there are more than 1 legion, but they can not comprehend it themselves.

This could also explain why we don't see Sargeras, because we killed him in the future, hence erasing him from the past and present. Just like the Titan creations they are a legacy of the past, while their creators are supposedly dead.
The burning legion is just the legacy of a dead Sargeras in a alternative universe future past, but they just don't know it. Because they are stuck in a loop.

[Factoral]

Isn't this sort of like a Doctor Who type thing?

There is only 1 Doctor. He travels through time and space, you can kill him but then he can re-appear as another version of himself as younger. Once his oldest self dies, the only other iterations of this Doctor are younger because his oldest iteration is dead.

There is 1 infinite Burning legion throughout all universes. Except instead of there being a time where the Legion will die (i.e. their oldest iterations) they cannot die, as so they can turn up until the end of time itself.

They have probably taken over some of these Universes, but we do not need to know that they have, because it isn't really relevant to the story of Azeroth. There is only 1 KJ, and we killed him in WoD. that entity of KJ, can only be in one place at a time. The is no other KJ at that age/other factor of his being at that specific moment. BUT there are other KJ where he is a different age in a different place.

This does not mean, that there are multiple KJ's, just that KJ has been to all of these universes/realities at some point in his life, and we see them at that specific point in his life.

This is how I understand it anyway, not sure if this makes sense to anyone else though. To quote Doctor Who, this is a whole load of wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff going on.