Colin Kaepernick: I won't stand 'to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses

[7-4]

Nor does your response in any way rebut the data given.

You posted graphs showing drug use data and arrest rates. I completely debunked the 'racist drug laws' bullshit. You lose.

[Wells]

You go to black communities that are low income or just read about shit?

Maybe instead of using racial caricatures "backed up" by anecdotes to defend your claim that the arrest rate disparity is just, you could use data.

- - - Updated - - -

You posted graphs showing drug use data and arrest rates. I completely debunked the 'racist drug laws' bullshit. You lose.

No, you dismissed the data by attacking an organization that didn't even come up with the data and then went on an irrelevant tangent about prisoner populations.

[Deleted]

These aren't variables. They're stereotypes. Fairly racist ones.

You're so disingenuous lol. You know exactly what he's talking about, but you gotta have a dig, right?

More black people tend to be living in poverty and poor communities

In 2014, 26.2 percent of blacks and 23.6 percent of Hispanics were poor, compared to 10.1 percent of non-Hispanic whites and 12 percent of Asians.

Higher rates of criminality tend to be linked to poverty. With criminality comes increased police scrutiny. An environment where crime is common or normalised tends to create individuals who are more brazen about committing crimes. US gangs are made up predominantly of black and Latino members. The two demographics which, coincidentally I'm sure, also happen to suffer the highest poverty rates.

Nothing I've said here is unknown. It is a phenomenon that can be seen the world 'round.

Your graphs don't account for increased scrutiny or increased criminality in poor neighborhoods, as far as I could see.

[lockedout]

Maybe instead of using racial caricatures "backed up" by anecdotes to defend your claim that the arrest rate disparity is just, you could use data.

You already said data other then absolutes is bunk so nothing I can do but use anecdotal data.

[Dextroden]

They're arrest rates for drug usage. You're just throwing up every random thing you can think of to explain this pretty clear disparity in enforcement.

Maybe white people are better at hiding it. Or not starting a fight with cops. /shrug

[Torgent]

Solid point actually, hadn't thought of it that way. I know I'd be pissed if my hearthstone cards started spouting pro-Trump or pro-Hillary talking points... we need our escapes.

...Kap didn't start shouting anything. He stayed sitting. He was asked why. He answered the question. But of course, why the fuck would you pay attention to reality when you can overreact and minimize an issue?

[lockedout]

You're so disingenuous lol. You know exactly what he's talking about, but you gotta have a dig, right?

More blacks tend to be living in poverty and poor communities


Higher rates of criminality tend to be linked to poverty. With criminality comes increased police scrutiny. An environment where crime is common or normalised tends to create individuals who are more brazen about committing crimes.

Nothing I've said here is unknown. It is a phenomenon that can be seen the world 'round.

Your graphs don't account for increased scrutiny or increased criminality in poor neighborhoods, as far as I could see.

So wait you're saying that poor areas with a majority of minorities living there (black hispanic) have a higher crime rate due to socioeconomic reasons therefore police patrol there more and have a higher arrest rate of the people residing there?

[PC2]

In New York City, the largest city in the United States (so any claims of cherry-picking are immediately debunked) blacks are 23% of the population, 24% of those living in or near poverty, yet 57% of all violent crime offenders.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/ceo/download..._2005_2012.pdf
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...r_end_2014.pdf
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa..._2000_2014.pdf

Okay, but what was your argument? I'm not saying culture or attitude doesn't have an important impact in the present, but that attitude is still heavily influenced by economic history.

[7-4]

Higher rates of criminality tend to be linked to poverty.

The poverty rate of hispanics and blacks is nearly identical. Explain the following;

[Ret4resto]

In New York City, the largest city in the United States (so any claims of cherry-picking are immediately debunked) blacks are 23% of the population, 24% of those living in or near poverty, yet 57% of all violent crime offenders.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/ceo/download..._2005_2012.pdf
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa...r_end_2014.pdf
http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloa..._2000_2014.pdf

Hey dumb dumb, if we placed you in a ghetto and subjected you to poverty, poor education, and lack of other resources you'll probably resort to crime as well. Lack of opportunity will give rise to crime. The greatest psychologists/sociologists in the world understand this concept, so I guess I shouldn't expect your sophomoric mind to grasp it.

[Wells]

You're so disingenuous lol. You know exactly what he's talking about, but you gotta have a dig, right?

More black people tend to be living in poverty and poor communities


Higher rates of criminality tend to be linked to poverty. With criminality comes increased police scrutiny. An environment where crime is common or normalised tends to create individuals who are more brazen about committing crimes.

Nothing I've said here is unknown. It is a phenomenon that can be seen the world 'round.

Your graphs don't account for increased scrutiny or increased criminality in poor neighborhoods, as far as I could see.

Even assuming you can justify arresting one population far more for a crime they commit at the same rate as everyone else, you haven't presented any data to suggest that "criminality" makes up the gap. You've only gotten so far as the hypothesis.

You already said data other then absolutes is bunk so nothing I can do but use anecdotal data.

I'm sure that's all you can use.

Maybe white people are better at hiding it. Or not starting a fight with cops. /shrug

Maybe! Anything other than "maybe" to back that up?

[lockedout]

The poverty rate of hispanics and blacks is nearly identical. Explain the following;

You forgot to include the % of each (black/hispanic) population.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm sure that's all you can use.

What else I am left with?

[Runenwächter]

What a champ, that Kaepernick. Not choosing to honor achievements and the freedoms aforded, but displaying an attitude of entitlement.

[Wells]

The poverty rate of hispanics and blacks is nearly identical. Explain the following;

I'm curious why you think it is. Especially as you registered just to post in this thread.

[Ret4resto]

The poverty rate of hispanics and blacks is nearly identical. Explain the following;

You're comparing two entirely different groups, with different experiences and expecting them to share the same outcome because they share one variable? LMFAO! please log your idiotic ass off of mmo please.

[7-4]

Hey dumb dumb, if we placed you in a ghetto and subjected you to poverty, poor education, and lack of other resources you'll probably resort to crime as well. Lack of opportunity will give rise to crime. The greatest psychologists/sociologists in the world understand this concept, so I guess I shouldn't expect your sophomoric mind to grasp it.

Blacks aren't 'forced' into ghettos. They move into areas and turn them to shit. Blacks aren't 'subjected' to poverty. They choose it by having children out of wedlock and not raising them. Blacks aren't 'subjected' to poor education. They choose not getting one (that's 'acting white.') Blacks aren't 'subjected' to a lack 'of other resources.' They're given the same opportunity as everybody else (actually, they're given a leg up through affirmative action.)

You better be trolling me or you have brain damage. And sociology is marxist bullshit.

[Wells]

Blacks aren't 'forced' into ghettos. They move into areas and turn them to shit. Blacks aren't 'subjected' to poverty. They choose it by having children out of wedlock and not raising them. Blacks aren't 'subjected' to poor education. They choose not getting one (that's 'acting white.') Blacks aren't 'subjected' to a lack 'of other resources.' They're given the same opportunity as everybody else (actually, they're given a leg up through affirmative action.)

You better be trolling me or you have brain damage. And sociology is marxist bullshit.

I rescind my prior question.

[Deleted]

Even assuming you can justify arresting one population far more for a crime they commit at the same rate as everyone else, you haven't presented any data to suggest that "criminality" makes up the gap. You've only gotten so far as the hypothesis.

Was I trying to justify it? Or, in your mind, is it that if I attempt to introduce mitigating factors you would prefer to ignore entirely into the conversation, that might explain some of the disparity, then I must think it's right to crack down on blacks more than whites?

FWIW I'm pro legalisation anyway because I think it's a waste of time and money putting anyone in jail for recreational use of a plant they can grow at home and because it would reduce the power and prevalence of the criminal element in the supply chain.

[7-4]

You forgot to include the % of each (black/hispanic) population.

No I didn't. It's at the top. But that chart is more about rate per 100,000 (since comparing overall numbers would be meaningless as populations of each group aren't equal.)

I'm curious why you think it is.

Because that's what it is.

23.5% hispanic
27.2% black

https://www.census.gov/content/dam/C...mo/p60-249.pdf

Especially as you registered just to post in this thread.

No I didn't.

[anyaka21]

It's only disrespectful to the country itself, and the reason he clearly described; that country's failures to address issues with systemic racism. Which is certainly reason to choose to not show respect to that country, in protest.



The only people such a peaceful protest could "push away" are blind nationalists who would never be convinced by any argument or evidence against their nation in the first place.

It most definitely can "push away" people. Athletes are babied and pandered to insane amounts, and having someone like him protest over it when people of color have bled and died for his freedom to play a game which he gets paid millions is stupid.

Sure, he has that right, it's what freedom is. However, choosing not to stand to honor those that gave you that freedom is disingenuous. You want to make a difference, put your salary on the line, put your millions at stake, quit football, make a difference because sitting down is disrespectful

You want to make a differnce, there are many better ways. Stand because you want ot make that national anthem mean something. Sitting does the opposite.