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  1. #321
    Warchief Torched's Avatar
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    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=06d_1472345583 Might be NSFW? you see nothing that would make it a NSFW video

    Video of SDF blowing up what appears to be a M60? Turkish tank, and no Snackbar in this one either, that's a nice change of pace from all the other videos from Syria.

    Ignore the comment section on LiveLeak, you will be braindead after reading them.
    “A man will contend for a false faith stronger than he will a true one,” he observes. “The truth defends itself, but a falsehood must be defended by its adherents: first to prove it to themselves and secondly, that they may appear right in the estimation of their friends.”
    -The Acts of Pilate.

  2. #322
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    That's normal, you are a European. We have no problem people of different skin color and culture calling themselves Turk.
    I think the issue is, Turk is a specific ethnic group, a language and culture associated with a people.

    Your example would be as if England ruled the whole British Isles and Ireland and said "We don't mind if you Welsh, Irish, and Scots call yourselves English too!"

    To some extent that was somewhat of the brilliance of inventing the idea of "British," so people could also still be say Manx, Irish, Scottish, English, Welsh, Cornish or whatever. Though it remains imperfect it is admirable that the people of the UK have a neutral identity to also have that isn't specific to a ethno-linguistic group.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  3. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macaquerie View Post
    You also happen to be a resident in a country in that gives citizenship to pretty much anyone that has a valid reason to stay here for a sufficiently long period of time, so one would think that this would give you a more enlightened attitude toward nationality and identity compared to the backwards European view.
    Ha - ha.
    God that was hilarious.

  4. #324
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macaquerie View Post
    You also happen to be a resident in a country in that gives citizenship to pretty much anyone that has a valid reason to stay here for a sufficiently long period of time, so one would think that this would give you a more enlightened attitude toward nationality and identity compared to the backwards European view.
    I haven't seen fit to dye my hair some technicolor red or blue, put on cat glasses and screech problematic, so I don't worry about "Backwards," or "Progressive," issues.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  5. #325
    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinP View Post
    What if they call themselves, Kurds?
    They are beheaded immediately.

  6. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    I think the issue is, Turk is a specific ethnic group, a language and culture associated with a people.

    Your example would be as if England ruled the whole British Isles and Ireland and said "We don't mind if you Welsh, Irish, and Scots call yourselves English too!"

    To some extent that was somewhat of the brilliance of inventing the idea of "British," so people could also still be say Manx, Irish, Scottish, English, Welsh, Cornish or whatever. Though it remains imperfect it is admirable that the people of the UK have a neutral identity to also have that isn't specific to a ethno-linguistic group.
    What is the Qualitative difference in 'British' and English?
    In what way do they differ as a 'culture'?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    They are beheaded immediately.
    My point is that when the majoritarian culture 'accepts' the minorities being included in the majority, its assimilation, not 'benevolence'.

  7. #327
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinP View Post
    What is the Qualitative difference in 'British' and English?
    In what way do they differ as a 'culture'?
    Right now, not much, but since people often assert, British is not English, I could safely be both Welsh and British, though I rarely ever call myself a Brit or British though I could I suppose.

    The difference isn't great, mostly because of the numerical superiority of English people to Not English people. Scotland's native Gaelic culture is extremely marginal and is that way due to historical injustices and ethnic cleansing and just the earlier negative relationship England had towards the Celtic Language regions and various education policies that were centralized on an English speaking political body.

    Much as American isn't really an ethnic group but overwhelmingly speaks the language of the 13 colonies even though the overwhelming majority of people in America have no English ancestry, English was the dominate culture and was able to assimilate early on lots of incoming people.

    I would obviously prefer to see a British that is not English, but I am skeptical of it going that way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  8. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Your example would be as if England ruled the whole British Isles and Ireland and said "We don't mind if you Welsh, Irish, and Scots call yourselves English too!"
    That's how things are in Turkey. If you prefer to call yourself both, for example Bosniak and Turk, it's okay. Turkish national identity, however, is often put forward over Bosniak identity. In fact, we call them "Bosniak", not Turk. That, however, is not perceived as "you are not a Turk" on their end. Both parties know very well that they are Turks. It's just referring to where they migrated from. Anatolia is a giant migration camp. Best to my knowledge, Bosniaks are one the most nationalist groups, they enroll to police special ops, which is a very dangerous unit since Turkey is targeted by terrorists heavily.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2016-08-28 at 11:58 PM.

  9. #329
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinP View Post
    My point is that when the majoritarian culture 'accepts' the minorities being included in the majority, its assimilation, not 'benevolence'.
    This is very true,

    Typically societies will go for the "Melting Pot," approach to acceptance, but of course if a pot is already 90% something the other 10% are likely to be diluted away.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    That's how things are in Turkey. If you prefer to call yourself both, for example Bosniak and Turk, it's okay. Turkish national identity, however, is often put forward over Bosniak identity. In fact, we call them "Bosniak", not Turk. That, however, doesn't perceived as "you are not a Turk". It's just referring to where they migrated from. Anatolia is a giant migration camp. Best to my knowledge, Bosniaks are one the most nationalist groups, they are enroll to police special ops.
    The difference is British has no language, there is no British language, well I guess there are Brittonic Languages or Britons, but the idea of Britishness has no language and those no specific culture to an extent.

    Turkish does have a culture, it has a language, thus is something with which a Kurd, an Armenian, a Greek, or a Cypriot is not. Had there been say an Anatolian, that might have worked because there is no Anatolian language or ethnic group.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  10. #330
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Right now, not much, but since people often assert, British is not English, I could safely be both Welsh and British, though I rarely ever call myself a Brit or British though I could I suppose.

    The difference isn't great, mostly because of the numerical superiority of English people to Not English people. Scotland's native Gaelic culture is extremely marginal and is that way due to historical injustices and ethnic cleansing and just the earlier negative relationship England had towards the Celtic Language regions and various education policies that were centralized on an English speaking political body.

    Much as American isn't really an ethnic group but overwhelmingly speaks the language of the 13 colonies even though the overwhelming majority of people in America have no English ancestry, English was the dominate culture and was able to assimilate early on lots of incoming people.

    I would obviously prefer to see a British that is not English, but I am skeptical of it going that way.
    See, the problem is that you're still living in 450 AD and your world view is one of Hengis and Horst and their band of rapacious Saxons menacing villages full of nubile Celtic women. Thing is, there's a bigger world out there that doesn't draw a distinction between Celts and Anglo-Saxons and pretty much sees all British people as arrogant, imperious douchebags, and 1500+ years worth of history where other shit happened.

  11. #331
    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinP View Post
    My point is that when the majoritarian culture 'accepts' the minorities being included in the majority, its assimilation, not 'benevolence'.
    We call it "incorporation", not assimilation. Nothing, except the language is assimilated and that's only in army.In fact, it is Turks who are assimilated. Turks used Farsi, and not Turkish as their official state language in Seljuk Empire. Turkish is the language of the army, and if you want to enroll into army, you need to speak Turkish. It has been suggested from a 11th century Turkish scholar that Turks like to incorporate other cultures a lot. Can't remember the name of the scholar, could be Mahmud Kashgari. That's how Turkish states functioned since Central Asia.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2016-08-29 at 12:04 AM.

  12. #332
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macaquerie View Post
    See, the problem is that you're still living in 450 AD and your world view is one of Hengis and Horst and their band of rapacious Saxons menacing villages full of nubile Celtic women. Thing is, there's a bigger world out there that doesn't draw a distinction between Celts and Anglo-Saxons and pretty much sees all British people as arrogant, imperious douchebags, and 1500+ years worth of history where other shit happened.
    I was speaking of Scotland, mostly my references speak to the Highland Clearences act, or the Education policy of the Welsh Knot in Wales, not old Gwrtheyrn or his little mistake. XD
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  13. #333
    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinP View Post
    What is the Qualitative difference in 'British' and English?
    In what way do they differ as a 'culture'?
    Well the Scotts occassionally wear skirts and eat sheep offal cooked in sheep offal. The Welsh like to pretend they are different to the English and invented a make believe language which no one understands but people like Theo pretend they can......oh unnatural relations with sheep too but if you'd been anywhere near a Welsh girl you would get it. Then obviously us English are conceited twats who think we are better than our vassals. Oh shit the Norn Iron.....well they speak kinda funny and hold grudges with their brothers down south about like....religion or somet?

    British though? Tea? We all drink tea? That or we have such similar cultures you can't actually tell the difference beyond the superficial.

  14. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Turkish does have a culture, it has a language, thus is something with which a Kurd, an Armenian, a Greek, or a Cypriot is not. Had there been say an Anatolian, that might have worked because there is no Anatolian language or ethnic group.
    The "Turkish culture" is text-book multiculturalism. There isn't one culture, there are many and it's summation is called Turkish culture. For example, Eastern Turkey has distinct Caucasus culture, where as Western Turkey has distinct Balkan culture. This is due to migration from the outliers of the Empire to the Anatolian heartland because of the dissolution.

  15. #335
    Quote Originally Posted by Kronik85 View Post
    Well the Scotts occassionally wear skirts and eat sheep offal cooked in sheep offal. The Welsh like to pretend they are different to the English and invented a make believe language which no one understands but people like Theo pretend they can......oh unnatural relations with sheep too but if you'd been anywhere near a Welsh girl you would get it. Then obviously us English are conceited twats who think we are better than our vassals. Oh shit the Norn Iron.....well they speak kinda funny and hold grudges with their brothers down south about like....religion or somet?

    British though? Tea? We all drink tea? That or we have such similar cultures you can't actually tell the difference beyond the superficial.
    You know, I was once at a cafe in China that was advertising "authentic British tea." If that isn't cultural imperialism, I don't know what is.

  16. #336
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    The "Turkish culture" is text-book multiculturalism. There isn't one culture, there are many and it's summation is called Turkish culture. For example, Eastern Turkey has distinct Caucasus culture, where as Western Turkey has distinct Balkan culture. This is due to migration from the outliers of the Empire to the Anatolian heartland because of the dissolution.
    I would call that more assimilation, as Turkish is no Esperanto, it is a language with a specific history tied to a specific people with specific cultural outlooks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  17. #337
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    I would call that more assimilation, as Turkish is no Esperanto, it is a language with a specific history tied to a specific people with specific cultural outlooks.
    It's Esperanto + incorporation of other cultures, not assimilation. This is evident in my East/West cultural distinctions example.

  18. #338
    The Unstoppable Force Theodarzna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    It's Esperanto + incorporation of other cultures, not assimilation.
    Was Turkish a language invented by some person? Were does the Turkish Language come from?

    Incorporation seems like a semantics argument. What is the substantive difference between incorporation and assimilation other than assimilation sounds bad?
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    i think I have my posse filled out now. Mars is Theo, Jupiter is Vanyali, Linadra is Venus, and Heather is Mercury. Dragon can be Pluto.
    On MMO-C we learn that Anti-Fascism is locking arms with corporations, the State Department and agreeing with the CIA, But opposing the CIA and corporate America, and thinking Jews have a right to buy land and can expect tenants to pay rent THAT is ultra-Fash Nazism. Bellingcat is an MI6/CIA cut out. Clyburn Truther.

  19. #339
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Was Turkish a language invented by some person? Were does the Turkish Language come from?
    That's relevant in what way? But to answer your question, Oghuz branch of Turkic language family, from Altai.

  20. #340
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodarzna View Post
    Was Turkish a language invented by some person? Were does the Turkish Language come from?

    Incorporation seems like a semantics argument. What is the substantive difference between incorporation and assimilation other than assimilation sounds bad?
    That's not really a great argument though. All languages ultimately are invented, especially modern languages that all went through a pretty rigorous process of standardization to foster national unity and all that noise. Turkish was no exception, and went through a pretty substantial reform under Ataturk, including a wholesale replacement of the old Arabic derived script with the Latin alphabet.

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