Thread: Simulation Data

  1. #1
    Banned A dot Ham's Avatar
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    Simulation Data

    So...

    For weeks now people have regurgitating the same phrase they heard the previous idiot say, "They are still making balance changes."

    Well here we are launch night... aaaaaaaaand I'm still not seeing any valid 110 dps simulation results.

  2. #2
    Too early

    /10cucks
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    Honorary PvM "Mod" Darsithis's Avatar
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    They will still be making balance changes, no doubt, while the first tier is consumed by player base.

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    Too early for what?

    They are sims.

    Meaning all of the resources are already in game anyone with access to beta (or even live at this point) should have been able to get out something resembling truth and accuracy.

    Are artifacts making it too difficult to do sims?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    They will still be making balance changes, no doubt, while the first tier is consumed by player base.
    Point is in the past we have had reliable simulation data prior to the actual content being released. Changes are always made. Even after simulation data is run... yet those original sims will continue to stand as a benchmark long after abilities and set bonuses have been tuned up or down.

    I am just curious as to why the radio silence.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by GrinnersGrin View Post
    Too early

    /10cucks
    It's more like...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Partysaurus Rex View Post
    Point is in the past we have had reliable simulation data prior to the actual content being released. Changes are always made. Even after simulation data is run... yet those original sims will continue to stand as a benchmark long after abilities and set bonuses have been tuned up or down.

    I am just curious as to why the radio silence.
    *shrug* I've never run them myself but I suspect that the wider variety of talents and artifact power makes it a lot more difficult to be accurate. It is, after all, a simulation of what is possible, not what will happen.

  7. #7
    What do you mean by valid? There are lots of sims available and have been for some time. There are a boatload of mage sims for talents/artifact path/relic choices/stats/legendary choice/spec comparision on Altered-Time for example. If you mean the totally useless sim that usually sits on the front page of Simulationcraft.org, well, your first problem is that you want to see that sim.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Partysaurus Rex View Post
    So...

    For weeks now people have regurgitating the same phrase they heard the previous idiot say, "They are still making balance changes."

    Well here we are launch night... aaaaaaaaand I'm still not seeing any valid 110 dps simulation results.
    the excuse of "changes will be made" is going to be used throughout the expansion. it's an easy cop out response to those classes who are severely lacking or those classes that are much farther ahead
    No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training…what a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. – Socrates

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Partysaurus Rex View Post
    So...

    For weeks now people have regurgitating the same phrase they heard the previous idiot say, "They are still making balance changes."

    Well here we are launch night... aaaaaaaaand I'm still not seeing any valid 110 dps simulation results.
    Its because half the classes dont have a valid simcraft contributer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatinebrah View Post
    the excuse of "changes will be made" is going to be used throughout the expansion. it's an easy cop out response to those classes who are severely lacking or those classes that are much farther ahead
    Ya well I am really tired of making the decision to level a class that is "severely lacking" and not have it fixed until the end of the xpac.

    For once i'd like to level something that performs at least better than average from the get go.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    *shrug* I've never run them myself but I suspect that the wider variety of talents and artifact power makes it a lot more difficult to be accurate. It is, after all, a simulation of what is possible, not what will happen.
    Yes, the complexity of level 110 simulations has dramatically increased with artifacts. The traits themselves add in tons more math that must be done, but then you have abilities that are unlocked from them as well. Add in that they aren't a strict progression and it really messes stuff up.

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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sturmcantor View Post
    What do you mean by valid? There are lots of sims available and have been for some time. There are a boatload of mage sims for talents/artifact path/relic choices/stats/legendary choice/spec comparision on Altered-Time for example. If you mean the totally useless sim that usually sits on the front page of Simulationcraft.org, well, your first problem is that you want to see that sim.
    Hey if you are sitting on a wealth of data please share it.

  14. #14
    I should add here that on WoD release, the DPS wasn't even remotely ready. Ele shamans for example did like, 1/5th of other classes, and some classes were chunking PvP with one shot hits due to mis-tuning (though you're talking PvE).

    There still is going to be a lot of tuning, because they only know what to fix once they see the applied numbers.

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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Partysaurus Rex View Post
    Ya well I am really tired of making the decision to level a class that is "severely lacking" and not have it fixed until the end of the xpac.

    For once i'd like to level something that performs at least better than average from the get go.
    someone had a quote from blizzard that took place at gamescom. something about nerfs won't be heavy because t hey understand the amount of time people have put into artifact leveling. also they gave an example of fire mages saying how they would not over nerf fire mages but rather bring the other two in line with fire.

    but then again, how many times have we heard t hat in the past? only difference here is stakes are much higher (time invested in artifact leveling).

    found it:

    The team draws the line at changing the relative order of specs in the short term, via hotfix.
    If Fire is way too good, rather than bringing them down to a point where they are tied with or worse than Frost and Arcane, they will take them to slightly too good still.
    You shouldn't regret what you spent your Artifact Power on.
    As the team looks ahead to Patch 7.1 and later in the expansion, there is more flexibility to how Artifact Power can work.
    They won't keep the game imbalanced for a long period of time, but in the short term there is a lot of disruption that comes from players feeling like the time they spent powering up their artifact was a mistake.


    - http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...s-in-Patch-7-1
    Last edited by Creatinebrah; 2016-08-30 at 01:05 AM.
    No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training…what a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. – Socrates

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuneree View Post
    I should add here that on WoD release, the DPS wasn't even remotely ready. Ele shamans for example did like, 1/5th of other classes, and some classes were chunking PvP with one shot hits due to mis-tuning (though you're talking PvE).

    There still is going to be a lot of tuning, because they only know what to fix once they see the applied numbers.
    Aye they were... and I played an ele shaman... which is why i'd like to see some preliminary data.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatinebrah View Post
    someone had a quote from blizzard that took place at gamescom. something about nerfs won't be heavy because t hey understand the amount of time people have put into artifact leveling. also they gave an example of fire mages saying how they would not over nerf fire mages but rather bring the other two in line with fire.

    but then again, how many times have we heard t hat in the past? only difference here is stakes are much higher (time invested in artifact leveling).
    I'm going to look up your sig and see if that is a real quote... cuz you legit made me feel bad about my entire life right now.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Partysaurus Rex View Post
    Aye they were... and I played an ele shaman... which is why i'd like to see some preliminary data.

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    I'm going to look up your sig and see if that is a real quote... cuz you legit made me feel bad about my entire life right now.
    i edited my above post for source. and yes, it's a real quote =P
    No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training…what a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. – Socrates

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