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  1. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spunt View Post
    How is it offensive for citizens for America to fly the American flag?
    That's the point, it can't be offensive if both sides are loyal to the same country.

  2. #262
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    How do you hold someone responsible for it? As I said, the water system is too broad and diverse to say "This lake serves X purpose, and therefore Y harmed Z". This may be a tough pill to swallow, but the real world is a bit more complicated than libertarian thought experiments.

    For example, if I dump toxic chemicals into a river, but the effects don't become noticeable for fifteen years, and I'm long gone, then what? There is nobody to hold accountable. There is no way to even give standing in a court of law. Right now, coal plants result in the deaths of thousands of Americans every year, based on the higher rates of lung related illnesses in proximity to them. No individual can say their lung disease was caused by a specific coal plant. That's impossible to prove.
    If there is a financially vested interest in saving it, then someone will want to save it (or a lot of people). That does not mean government needs to get involved.

  3. #263
    Quote Originally Posted by Snuke View Post
    Why do you need to bring a US flag to a HS football game again? Oh that's right, you don't need to. Nothing lost over making these rednecks leave the flag at home.
    So, it's okay to be offensive to people you consider rednecks? Thanks for showing your bigotry and ignorance.
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  4. #264
    If the sight of a country's flag, or the sound of its anthem, offends you, and you are in that country, well, that's a damn shame. But it's in pretty bad taste to disrespect it anyway, never mind trying to get it banned on its home soil, which really ought to be in the realm of "unthinkable."

    I see people on one side saying to them the flag means freedom and honor, and on another saying it represents slavery and genocide. For me it's always meant that all of us, no matter if we were born in the frozen tundra or plains or swamp, color, gender, creed, whatever, no matter what differences we may have with each other we can at least all share one thing in common. That intangible idea, the glue that binds us, is being willfully, deliberately erased, and that is what really gets me angry.

  5. #265
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    If there is a financially vested interest in saving it, then someone will want to save it (or a lot of people). That does not mean government needs to get involved.
    There is a financially vested interest in saving it, that's why the government created the fucking park that you want to get rid of. The people did exactly what you are saying, but since you are an anti-government extremist, you only believe it should be protected if it can be monetized to generate a profit, which is very different.

    Have you honestly never heard of a crisis of the commons?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spunt View Post
    So, it's okay to be offensive to people you consider rednecks? Thanks for showing your bigotry and ignorance.
    It's OK to be offensive to anyone. it is not okay to disrupt school grounds.

  6. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    Evidence is very useful in court. I don't need to produce evidence to make it ethical for me to ask someone to leave my home.
    You do need evidence if you want to prove punishment was ethical.

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by Drilnos View Post
    If the sight of a country's flag, or the sound of its anthem, offends you, and you are in that country, well, that's a damn shame. But it's in pretty bad taste to disrespect it anyway, never mind trying to get it banned on its home soil, which really ought to be in the realm of "unthinkable."

    I see people on one side saying to them the flag means freedom and honor, and on another saying it represents slavery and genocide. For me it's always meant that all of us, no matter if we were born in the frozen tundra or plains or swamp, color, gender, creed, whatever, no matter what differences we may have with each other we can at least all share one thing in common. That intangible idea, the glue that binds us, is being willfully, deliberately erased, and that is what really gets me angry.
    I agree. Imagine if this country was founded by traitors, who badmouthed and then turned on their nation because they disagreed with the policies their government was enacting, and then started a war that killed thousands of people?

  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    There is a financially vested interest in saving it, that's why the government created the fucking park that you want to get rid of. The people did exactly what you are saying, but since you are an anti-government extremist, you only believe it should be protected if it can be monetized to generate a profit, which is very different.

    Have you honestly never heard of a crisis of the commons?

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    It's OK to be offensive to anyone. it is not okay to disrupt school grounds.
    Flying the flag of the country you live in is disruptive? Lol.
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  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    You do need evidence if you want to prove punishment was ethical.
    It's not punishment to be refused something you were never entitled to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spunt View Post
    Flying the flag of the country you live in is disruptive? Lol.
    The flag wasn't banned. Specific individuals who had used the flag to harass people on school grounds before were refused entry with the flag.

  10. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    It's not punishment to be refused something you were never entitled to.
    Public events must give equal access.

    If they banned the flag, all that means is that the ban is unethical as opposed to the specific decision maker at the event.

  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    Public events must give equal access.

    If they banned the flag, all that means is that the ban is unethical as opposed to a specific decision maker at the event.
    A school football game is not a public forum. You just keep repeating this false shit.

  12. #272
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    This country is turning into a shit day by day with everyone being offended by everything and needing "safe space" bullshit. If you don't like it LEAVE.
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  13. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    A school football game is not a public forum. You just keep repeating this false shit.
    Wrong, the game was open to the public.

  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by Vober View Post
    This country is turning into a shit day by day with everyone being offended by everything and needing "safe space" bullshit. If you don't like it LEAVE.
    I agree, if you don't like the school's rules, don't attend the football game. That's what you meant, right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PrimaryColor View Post
    Wrong, the game was open to the public.
    Open to the public and a public forum are not the same thing, although I'm willing to bet you don't even understand the distinction. Supermarkets are open to the public, but that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want in there. School grounds are very rarely considered legally to be a public forum. They are considered public in the same way that the White House is public.

  15. #275
    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    I say they let all flags in. I just wonder how many people would be outraged at seeing a rainbow flag, or even Mexican flags.
    That's hilarious, we could turn the games into one big flag waving contest. Maybe every contingent could march with their flag during half time or before the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winter Blossom View Post
    I don't support not flying/displaying the American flag because of feels. It should never be banned anywhere in the US. EVER.
    I agree. How crazy is our country that you can't even fly our own flag in our own country? That doesn't even make any sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Machismo View Post
    If your loyalty lies in a flag, then I question your intelligence.
    The flag is just a symbol of the values the country. If you can't understand symbolism (and the power of symbolism), you might want to go back to middle school english class.

  16. #276
    I remember when I played hockey for a Catholic high school. One of our rivals always took the opportunity during our games against one another to display any and all anti-Catholic/pro-Protestant signs and symbols they could manage in an effort to taunt us. So our fans would bring in a bunch of pro-Catholic/anti-Protestant signs. This wound up causing huge conflict among the parents of both schools, but nothing was ever done (partially because of the neutral venue).

    So it all became a big religious shitshow, when absolutely none of the kids involved gave a damn one way or another (only 20% of our school body were practicing Catholics, and the other school was a public school). So I know damn well what these kids were doing. Of course, the little shits did it because to stop them you'd have to "ban the American flag" so their principal could get in deep shit if they actually stood up to them. And of course, stupid people and gullible media outlets were more than happy to oblige.
    Last edited by Nekosom; 2016-08-30 at 12:48 AM.

  17. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by Alydael View Post
    That's hilarious, we could turn the games into one big flag waving contest. Maybe every contingent could march with their flag during half time or before the game.

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    I agree. How crazy is our country that you can't even fly our own flag in our own country? That doesn't even make any sense.

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    The flag is just a symbol of the values the country. If you can't understand symbolism (and the power of symbolism), you might want to go back to middle school english class.
    The flag flew above the entire game. The only thing banned were individuals with flags that had previously been disruptive with their flag.

  18. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    Open to the public and a public forum are not the same thing, although I'm willing to bet you don't even understand the distinction. Supermarkets are open to the public, but that doesn't mean you can do whatever you want in there. School grounds are very rarely considered legally to be a public forum. They are considered public in the same way that the White House is public.
    You're proving my point because "open to the public" is about entry and this person was denied entry. The bolded is based on case-by-case behavior which is how justice works.

  19. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by Nekosom View Post
    I remember when I played hockey for a Catholic high school. One of our rivals always took the opportunity during our games against one another to display any and all anti-Catholic/pro-Protestant signs and symbols they could manage in an effort to taunt us. This wound up causing huge conflict among the parents of both schools, but nothing was ever done (partially because of the neutral venue). So I know damn well what these kids were doing. Of course, the little shits did it because to stop them you'd have to "ban the American flag" so their principal could get in deep shit if they actually stood up to them. And of course, stupid people and gullible media outlets were more than happy to oblige.
    Most on point post in this thread.

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    There is a financially vested interest in saving it, that's why the government created the fucking park that you want to get rid of. The people did exactly what you are saying, but since you are an anti-government extremist, you only believe it should be protected if it can be monetized to generate a profit, which is very different.

    Have you honestly never heard of a crisis of the commons?

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    It's OK to be offensive to anyone. it is not okay to disrupt school grounds.
    I never said I want to get rid of it.

    If there's a demand for the park, then someone will find a way to meet that demand. If the demand is not high enough, then it will fail.

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