Japanese and non-human races

[Skorpionss]

this is mostly true for any MMORPG that isn't wow tbh... Look at SWTOR... laziest race design I have seen in a MMO so far tbh You had humans, humans with cybernetic implants, blue humans, blind humans, green humans, grey humans, red humans, humans with tentacles on their head, humans with spikes on their head, humans with catlike coloring, and humans with bigger tentacles on their head(or is it just a hat?)... And they all have the same 4 body type options AFAIK... Talk about lazy... The only other ones I can think of that have some diversity is GW2(with the charr, asura, and the plant people) and Tera (Popori, Baraka, Elin and Aman)

When it comes to NPC design though, the japanese seem to go way over the top with their designs from really awesome to stuff that have no business existing...

[stellvia]

And? They're not popular so why waste resources on them? How many play male roegaden for example? Poppuri? Tauren? Dwarves? Plenty of prior market data that humanoid are always far more popular.

[Arewn]

That you can't play as...

I didn't see that as strictly necessary, since the main point of the thread seems to be questioning Japan's general capacity to put out non-human races/the presence of non-human races in JRPGs.

Also, Japan doesn't put out many MMOs, so using a Japanese MMO as his sole example isn't a very strong foot to start off on.

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And? They're not popular so why waste resources on them? How many play male roegaden for example? Poppuri? Tauren? Dwarves? Plenty of prior market data that humanoid are always far more popular.

Not to mention the fact that the less humanoid the player races are, the more difficult it is to add things to the game. Every new player-character animation or outfit that comes out has its workload increased per non-humanoid playable race in the game.

[Remilia]

Honestly speaking, Worgen and Taurens aren't really that imaginative, an anthropomorphized wolf and bull isn't any new concept, 'furry' comes into mind and cartoons like Loony Toons also comes into mind when it comes to it.
The issue is people tend to want to play characters they either like how they look or something they can relate, and a lizard doesn't tend to be one (Iksar from EQ2, only saw like 1 or 2 play them). Then comes financial / time point of view, why make this race to play if barely anyone if at all wants to play them and instead focus on the ones people play.

That said, the more interesting races has always been outside of playable characters because the developers aren't bound to "is this what I actually want to play as". Amal'jaa, Ixal, Cabbage Patch kids (Sylph) etc etc from FFXIV are the more amusing races from a design point of view but I would never play one as a character. The Qiraaji's design are also great in WoW as an example.

[Taojnhy]

Is it just me or does it seem Japanese can't comprehend anything that isn't 90% human or super chibi and adorable. I say this after seeing the FF14 race choice and i will say i've been a big JRPG fan and just eastern MMOs in general so dont' get me wrong i love their games but let me pitch you this, in wow we have worgen, if a Japanese game had such a race it would just end up as an uber cute guy/girl with wolf ears and tail and MAYBE fangs. then of course they have their pedo races. occasionally we'll get the big buff race with demon like features like horns and stuff. I don't know they just seem to lack total imagination in their games, in their actual history they have a bunch of unique and cool looking mythical creatures i don't know what stunted their creativity with games.

Spoiler alert: just about every race in a MMO is anthropomorphic; that's not because of a lack of imagination but because generally speaking, humans have a tougher time relating to species that don't have lots of features in common with the human form to the extent necessary for being willing to play them as an avatar in a MMO's respective world. If you can't get your audience invested enough to play in your world, then you have a dead MMO. Of course developers are going to pander to their audiences tastes; that's not a lack of creativity or imagination, it's giving the audience what they want.

Your gripe seems to be that the Japanese audience tends to prefer some aspects to their flavor of humanoid design that you aren't partial to. So what? How is a Worgen substantially different from your "cute guy/girl with wolf ears and tail and MAYBE fangs" aside from the amount of body hair?

[unholytestament]

I didn't see that as strictly necessary, since the main point of the thread seems to be questioning Japan's general capacity to put out non-human races/the presence of non-human races in JRPGs.

So you chose to ignore the fact that all the examples discussed were playable races? That he specifically pointed out his race choice upon logging into FF14? That he questioned how a playable WoW race would be changed were it added to a Japanese game?

Also, Japan doesn't put out many MMOs, so using a Japanese MMO as his sole example isn't a very strong foot to start off on.

That doesn't make him wrong though.

[bloodmoth13]

Alt races are there to fulfil deviant sexual desires like beastiality and worse, animal anthropomorphic races are literally just an excuse to rationalize someone wanting to fuck their pet. Would say otherwise but those sorts of games sexualize the shit outta everything, yeah its a sweeping statement and those rules dont apply always but its pretty damn common and damn uncomfortable.

Would love to say wow is different but to this day i cant understand the need for tits on worgen/tauren/pandas, though i have never liked animal races, those forms are better used as transformations (watching a human transform into a werewolf to cast spells is ridiculous, watching a human transform into a werewolf to rip shit apart with their claws is a different situation all together.)

[Arewn]

So you chose to ignore the fact that all the examples discussed were playable races? That he specifically pointed out his race choice upon logging into FF14? That he questioned how a playable WoW race would be changed were it added to a Japanese game?

That doesn't make him wrong though.

I didn't "ignore them", I trusted the language he used and approached the topic of the thread based on what he said and the title used. The first phrase he wrote was about Japan's capacity to make non-human races.

It doesn't make him right either though. My point is it's a poor example that can't be taken as representative of the whole.

[stellvia]

Because a sample size of one has statistical relevance amirite

[unholytestament]

I didn't "ignore them", I trusted the language he used and approached the topic of the thread based on what he said and the title used. The first phrase he wrote was about Japan's capacity to make non-human races.

And you stopped reading there? Because the next line is literally about the FF14 race selections and he proceeds to describe the playable races.

It doesn't make him right either though. My point is it's a poor example that can't be taken as representative of the whole.

But it is.

I mean, you guys are making arguments that take it both ways. "They don't do it because this way makes more money" "This hugely popular MMORPG made by one of the leading Japense video game developers is not indicative of the whole!"

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Because a sample size of one has statistical relevance amirite

The only really successful Japanese MMORPG in the world is not in any way indicative of the trends that you guys are saying Japanese developers follow because they're more successful.

Riiiiight...

[stellvia]

No, I'm pointing out the Japanese don't make mmos. The only other ones I can think of are phantasystar and shin megami tensei. Pso2 wasnt even released in English and smt was a halfbaked grinder that should have been offline.

[unholytestament]

No, I'm pointing out the Japanese don't make mmos. The only other ones I can think of are phantasystar and shin megami tensei. Pso2 wasnt even released in English and smt was a halfbaked grinder that should have been offline.

So you made an irrelevant statement about relevance?

[Irian]

For playable characters, asian games do seem to lean more towards humanoids. But...to somewhat play devil's advocate here, can you blame them when you look at WoW?

Many races are very low popularity simply because they're bestial or unrelatable to humans. It's been shown time and time again that people lean towards appearances of playable races they can relate to. Despite how iconic they are, look at how low the play rates are for races like tauren, trolls, orcs, goblins, gnomes, pandaren and worgen are compared to humans, night elves, draenei, and blood elves; the latter make up about 70% of the playerbase IIRC from the last census I saw.

I do think having a multitude of options makes for a more diverse playerbase, though. It seems as if there's a pretty big split in fundamental MMORPG players where more outgoing people want to create a unique character whereas introverted people want to play something they feel like is a fantasy reflection of themselves, and a strong aspect of WoW is that you have the option for both. Sure the more bestial/wildly designed races aren't played as much but the option adds an interesting diversity in WoW that many games don't have.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Like 95% of furryshit isn't porn-related...

When I read this I automatically thought you must be the type to pleasure yourself to it. Not say that is the case of course. Just seems like an odd thing to defend a long time after the fact without going after the person which delivered the original thought.

Just sayin

[stellvia]

Nope. Just a lesson learned from hovering title page thumbnails on Sad Panda and being on the internet in general over the years. #1 reason I uncheck the "Western" tag there, honestly. Nothing good ever comes from it.

[Shinzai]

I'll just requote myself:

The Japanese just aren't that into furries.

No, I'm not joking or trolling.

Playing as anthropomorphic characters is a very Western thing. In the East, they prefer humanoid looking characters, whether in games, or any other type of media. 'Beast' races are often, if not always, bad guys, or almost 'alien' feeling creatures in Japanese media. Even Japanese spirit creatures have vastly more humanoid forms in their historical media and mythology. Dragons and other such beasts will either appear in a fully bestial appearance, or a borderline human form, with maybe a tail, or ears/whatever, that define them as being non-human.

It's a cultural difference.

[wowaccounttom]

Is it just me or does it seem Japanese can't comprehend anything that isn't 90% human or super chibi and adorable. I say this after seeing the FF14 race choice and i will say i've been a big JRPG fan and just eastern MMOs in general so dont' get me wrong i love their games but let me pitch you this, in wow we have worgen, if a Japanese game had such a race it would just end up as an uber cute guy/girl with wolf ears and tail and MAYBE fangs. then of course they have their pedo races. occasionally we'll get the big buff race with demon like features like horns and stuff. I don't know they just seem to lack total imagination in their games, in their actual history they have a bunch of unique and cool looking mythical creatures i don't know what stunted their creativity with games.

as much as we enjoy Anime and Hentai... and as much as I do , you need to educate yourself a bit more....

we have much, much, much more than just cute or non human art.

[Gref]

Last Remnant
Check it. Square Enix.

[zealo]

A lot of people tend to gravitate towards something they can identify with even when given diverse choices. It's not without reason male and female humans are always the most popular choice when race picks are available.

[Saintlel]

This thread is low tier bait and everyone is falling for it