Buff tanks/heals when in short supply?

[DJ117]

Terrible idea. We should be rewarded for doing the roles, not lowering the bar to accomendate retards.

[Gsara]

Is it really that hard to queue with a tank or healer?

[Deleted]

Is it really that hard to queue with a tank or healer?

Believe it or not but not everyone has an on demand tank or healer willing to queue with them whenever it pleases

[Deleted]

I just told you i would queue as a tank if my rogue allowed me to tank dungeons.

Also your counting of classes and specs doesnt really matter.
I know that there is a lot of people who will only use one spec of their class for example. There is also however a lot of people who are a lot more min/max oriented who will queue as a tank on their rogue/hunter/whatever if the had the option.

Its a problem that dps currently have long queues in dungeons. Its something blizzard recognizes aswell.

And how exactly would adding 1 tank to the pool change anything? If every class has the option to tank the majority would still prefer to queue as dps. The issue is not solvable by making tanking easier in dungeons at all. Heck, tanking is not hard at all.
If anything these satchels help, because you can get additionally runes and AP.

Like I said before, there is a simple solution: befriend with a few tanks and they’ll ask you to join them or you can ask them to join you.

[Deleted]

And how exactly would adding 1 tank to the pool change anything? If every class has the option to tank the majority would still prefer to queue as dps. The issue is not solvable by making tanking easier in dungeons at all. Heck, tanking is not hard at all.
If anything these satchels help, because you can get additionally runes and AP.

Like I said before, there is a simple solution: befriend with a few tanks and they’ll ask you to join them or you can ask them to join you.

If everyone has the ability to tank a dungeon noone has the right to complain about to few tanks.

If classes without the ability to tank dungeons got that ability, it would add more tanks to random queues from people(like me) who simply wants fast queues for dungeons.

My suggestion would be a tanking robot that every spec/class would be able to jump into. It would give some basic migitation abilities and threat abilities slighly worse then the other tanks.

Could be made by engineering and usable by everyone

[Deleted]

If everyone has the ability to tank a dungeon noone has the right to complain about to few tanks.

If classes without the ability to tank dungeons got that ability, it would add more tanks to random queues from people(like me) who simply wants fast queues for dungeons.

My suggestion would be a tanking robot that every spec/class would be able to jump into. It would give some basic migitation abilities and threat abilities slighly worse then the other tanks.

Could be made by engineering and usable by everyone

According to census 56% of 110 people are playing classes which have a tank spec. Yeah, that’s right, more than half of the playerbase could potentially tank. If everyone would spec tank for queues there wouldn’t be a tanking problem at all.

If you want to play dps with the option to queue as tank sometimes just reroll. If you want to stick on your rogue, make some tank friends and/or ask in guild.

[Deleted]

According to census 56% of 110 people are playing classes which have a tank spec. Yeah, that’s right, more than half of the playerbase could potentially tank. If everyone would spec tank for queues there wouldn’t be a tanking problem at all.

If you want to play dps with the option to queue as tank sometimes just reroll. If you want to stick on your rogue, make some tank friends and/or ask in guild.

I dont see how more then half the playerbase could potentially tank has anything to do with it being a bad thing to give more people the option of tanking a dungeon. There is obviously people who have an offtank spec to be able to tank stuff like dungeons. Those people woudl increase in number by letting more people tank dungeons with something like a robot that wouldnt need gearing(but would scale with ilvl)

the 2nd part of your post is just a shitpost basicly. You dont get to decide that

[Deleted]

It's already easy enough to tank or heal as it is, and the dungeon difficulty is a joke.. Heroics should be ordinary normals and mythic should be ordinary heroics. This is just Blizzard's way of making bads feel good about themselves for clearing an heroic when in reality it's just a normal..

[Wild]

For me its the opposite of what the OP writes. I love doing new or harder dungeons as HEALER, cos u play a main role at correcting and helping out other players mistakes. Most DDs realize when they stand im shit as their HP drops, a good healer can make it up and keep them alive until he moves (not talking mythic!)
Apart from having some patience and a lot of fun, every challange is great to undergo as healer, IMO.
If someone dies cos he stood in shit, those ppl must realize and learn, getting mad a the healer who cant outheal that even if hes putting all heals and CDs on u is not really what ever happened to me.
Buffing Healing would be wrong cos I dont need no faceroll shit like last expansion!

[Neudgae]

i only queue up for heroics cause atm i want the satchel and AP, no matter what you do the queue time dont go down unless less people dps and more tank/heal, theres how many dps specs? and only what 6? tanks 5 heals?, and considering you only need 2 tanks for a raid that even further reduces the need for tank players, hell i only role one for the solo capabilities, if unholy dk could heal as well as a tank spec i wouldnt tank at all

[Deleted]

AKA "Why didn't you heal me? Kick the healer." after they stood in fire and you were healing them.

Had EXACTLY this on my 1st heroic yesterday. DK dps, stood in the swirly "you die" crap .... "Kick the healz, is crap"

[Cyrops]

The queues are fine for me as DPS, last night had tank+call to arms and the queue as DPS was around 10mins, pretty good while you are still doing quests, when you are only AFK in town then the long queues get to you.

Had one run in random heroic, healer ignored me for the first part of the dungeon, druid and not a single Rej for me, good thing self healing is <3

[Simulacrum]

If everyone has the ability to tank a dungeon noone has the right to complain about to few tanks...

lol. as if anything would change. we'd just have morons like you in here saying exactly the same thing you're saying right now, but phrased slightly differently: "Why am I being punished for not wanting to spec tank?", etc.

Nothing anyone does will ever increase the amount of tanks in dungeons. It's too much responsibility. You're expected to know the instance; all the bosses, all the tactics for everything, what trash to pull, what trash to skip, what trash you can pull multiple packs of safely, where the secret paths are, what optional content to do, etc., and if you don't then people will get pissy with you. Doesn't help that 99% of the mechanical complexity in every instance comes down to the tank having ot solve it. Something needs to be interrupted? Either you (the tank) do it, or you get fucked, because you sure know the worthless dpsers aren't going to do it. Boss has some mechanic that needs them to be positioned in a certain way? Or an add to be positioned in a certain way? Or a missile to be blocked? Almost always the tank that has to do it. Then there's the part where if you fuck up, you die, then everyone else dies (in an average group), where if a DPS fucks up then who cares? It's expected of them anyway. These last few days I've ended so many bosses with 1-2 DPS dead to avoidable shit. And several, though not as many, bosses with me the last-man-standing.

It's for these reasons and more that people don't play tanks. Not because they don't have tank specs. Not, like the OP thinks, because people are mean to them. It's because all the responsibility is always on them, and most people just don't wanna deal with that shit.

Though personally I don't mind deal with that shit, since tanks are so insanely powerful right now that you can carry heroics by yourself really easily. Only thing really keeping you back is those annoying mobs that spam aoe damage on your group, keeping you from pulling entire rooms at once since doing so would kill everyone (else).

[Foj]

Terrible idea. We should be rewarded for doing the roles, not lowering the bar to accomendate retards.

Hey that's an enlightened approach. Why doesn't Blizzard come right out and say the same thing? Calling newbies "retards" is a fantastic idea.

For me its the opposite of what the OP writes. I love doing new or harder dungeons as HEALER, cos u play a main role at correcting and helping out other players mistakes.

You also don't understand that the post is about recruiting new tanks and healers, not about what people who've been healing and tanking for 5-10+ years think about the role.

The game needs new tanks and healers. It has as many old-timers as it's ever going to have, and fewer every day.

[Skozen]

How many pure dps classes are there? 4.
How many classes can tank? 5.
How many classes can heal? 5.

Does throwing more tank specs help? No. Because even the classes with tank/healing spec available will queue for dps if that’s the role they want to play. Giving some dps specs survivability on par with actual tank specs will not increase the available tanks because those hybrids could easily just respec to whatever role currently lacks.

If I could heal or tank on my mage, I absolutely would as an off-spec. However, it's the DPS spec that's important to me for raiding, and I wasn't as interested in any of the hybrid DPS specs this xpac. If every class could either heal or tank, queues would be a lot better because players who like a class and are flexible would be able to do so.

[Mifuyne]

They should throw toys/pets/mounts back into the satchel

[Gsara]

Believe it or not but not everyone has an on demand tank or healer willing to queue with them whenever it pleases

Then set up some times to run dungeons with your friends that are tanks? Or are we talking about people wanting to play an mmo like a single player game. If so then deal with queues or roll a tank.

[Daffan]

Is this even real life anymore

[Deleted]

I dont see how more then half the playerbase could potentially tank has anything to do with it being a bad thing to give more people the option of tanking a dungeon. There is obviously people who have an offtank spec to be able to tank stuff like dungeons. Those people woudl increase in number by letting more people tank dungeons with something like a robot that wouldnt need gearing(but would scale with ilvl)

the 2nd part of your post is just a shitpost basicly. You dont get to decide that

I’ll elaborate:

For the queue to be instant (ignoring healers here) you need 1 tank on 3 dps, or 25% of the players need to tank.

56% of players play hybrids that can tank. Some of them are obviously main tanks but most should be main dps. If only half of these hybrids utilized their tanking off spec there would be no queue. Adding more classes/professions/mechanics won’t change the fact that more than half of the dps does simply not want to tank in dungeons.

Dungeons and raids are already quite hybrid friendly. You get satchels with lots of bonus gold, runes, AP. You can tank dungeons and still set your loot role to dps. There is literally no downside to utilize your tanking offspec and yet only a short minority queues as tank.

[Maischou]

I think most things I wanted to say have already been echoed numerous times - perhaps best by D-angeL and Simulacrum. Anyway, here's my spin.

I largely disagree with Nupomanic. More specs won't help, as D-angeL has reasoned. Softening the experience with buffs will not do anyone any favours, either. Although I miss "sub-roles" in so many classes (fistweaving, BM/lock/boom tanking, druid hybridisation, etc), simply tossing in a catch-all or buffing classes to allow for it is not the answer. On the one hand, it devalues the genuine work by willing tanks (respect where respect is due) and on the other I just don't think there are that many players willing to do it on pure DPS classes, at all. Nupo is in the very small minority here. Adding tanking specs to all classes would also be a complete watering down of the integrity of WoW's class system.

I generally think it boils down to the following.

Player toxicity
At this point, most players who have been here for a full expansion know how awful random groups can be. You'd much rather be part of the anonymous majority than the frontrunner who has to take a hit just because they volunteered to take on responsibilities. I recall LFR runs where a top 5 DPS (heroic geared, naturally) would say that "the DPS needed to up their game" in reference to a dozen or so players at the bottom. That's a far cry from a direct reference to "the tank". You're okay with it if ten other people suck as much as you. You're not okay with it if you're the one person who took on a specialised task and are getting flak for it.
Toxicity is a major point for me. I'm a pretty friggin' decent tank, and I'll hold my own for quite a while without a healer, but I can't abide people who think it's acceptable to treat others with disrespect just because they aren't living up to some invisible standard. This is regardless of whether it's aimed at me or at others. Personally, this is a case where the few bad eggs is ruining it for the rest. I stay out of random queues because of them. If I started seeing more constructive people (or just people voicing discontent with a toxic player), I'd probably do several hours of randoms every day. My guess is that a decent amount of players who would start running their tank off-specs if they were being treated better. I always come at odds with people that think this type of player (me, included) should "just grow a thicker skin" but the fact of the matter is that positivity in a leisure context has a much more powerful effect than hate and name calling. Many of us are here to relax and enjoy, not to be driven by fear and anger.

That responsibility. If my experiences in any other part of life are any indication, most people don't like to take on central roles. Essentially why we have many followers and only a few leaders. That leaves a minority of players to take on such roles. This leads to one possible amendment to the dungeon format that might work in the future: dungeons that scale to accommodate a few extra damage dealers. I'm not going to get into the details of the proposition, but it stands to reason that you might be able to cram in one - maybe two - more damage dealers into a dungeon given proper scaling considerations similar to those in raids. In that case, queues would be positively affected. However, seven people in a dungeon is halfway to an old-school hard-core "10-man raid" team of eight. There's a delicate balance to keep here.

Class fantasy. I'm going to side with Nupomaniac on this one, on his point that players simply don't like the available options. I'll grant that many specs may not really vibe with the player base. Generally, I'm not opposed to the notion that the current options (albeit very diverse in fantasy and style) don't appeal to players who would otherwise be interested in tanking. I'll be one of the first to lament the fact that the Havoc Demon Hunters got the awesomely iconic weapon look (although - in hindsigt - the Vengeance artifacts have a certain flair to them), and that Brewmasters (my main) are forced more and more into a cow corner rather than retain vestiges of the tiger in their visuals.