No flying in 7.0 confirmed

[Connll]

There is a fun fact as well. Do you remember that blizzard had a planned Q&A stream a week after the "No fly ever" statement got out that later got canceled and delayed for another week. They blamed it on that it was canceled to make room for another activity e-sport panel or something that was double booked same evening.
There is ACTUAL proof that the real reason this Q&A got canceled and delayed was the no fly backlash forcing Blizzard to do the 180 and just a few days later before the new date of the Q&A, announced that flying will be back.

Lore admitted on twitter after the "there will be flight after all" announcement. https://twitter.com/CM_Lore/status/608683181353631744

There is no rational reason to defend no-flying for the game. WoD proved that beyond any doubt.

That is one of the reasons why anti-fliers (with a few exceptions) tend to disregard facts.

Edit: Also, your example is one of the many cases of a WoW dev being less than honest with the playerbase. And people wonder why most pro-fliers aren´t impressed when a WoW devs says something.

[Dormie]

When you have been proven wrong, your words have no meaning.

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This is simply untrue. Flight was much more limited than you are portraying it here.

How? If you aren't in a dungeon or a building you can fly.

[Eurhetemec]

There is no rational reason to defend no-flying for the game.

If this is your position, why are you posting to people with that view at all?

[Deleted]

How? If you aren't in a dungeon or a building you can fly.

If you are not in a zone with no flight, which has been the case with many progression areas which came in later patches, or open pvp zones: Isle of Quel'Danas, Wintergrasp, Tol Barad, Firelands, Isle of Giants, Isle of Thunder, Timeless Isle.

You cannot fly in the whole open world. You cannot fly in any dungeon, raid, or PvP area. There are 2 starting zones and capital cities which did not get the flying treatment and probably never will. There are plenty of no-flying areas for people who don't like flying and who want to pose with their rare ground mounts, and I am speaking of current content. But for people who love flying, there is 0 options for that in current content in their new, moronic model.

This is not right at all, especially when you think about the simple technical possibility of creating no-flying zones in designated areas. Want to keep Suramar dangerous? Declare the energy shield as preventing flying. Use anti-air units and cannons. Use weather conditions. Whatever. But the current situation is just wrong.

[Slashnox]

Let's make sure to get a thread going that's like 20000 pages long to talk about it for several months.

LUL

10 chars

[Eurhetemec]

This is not right at all, especially when you think about the simple technical possibility of creating no-flying zones in designated areas. Want to keep Suramar dangerous? Declare the energy shield as preventing flying. Use anti-air units and cannons. Use weather conditions. Whatever. But the current situation is just wrong.

This isn't an entirely unreasonable position, but it is difficult to implement in a way that both doesn't piss people off - because they're constantly being fatally (or very inconveniently) dismounted without much/any warning - and that doesn't just make most "pro-flying" players just angry that they don't have "real flying", as too many areas are no/limited flying.

What WoW needs is a more complex flying model, not least with the ability to crash-land or be forced down rather than being insta-dismounted (and either dropping or parachuting), and that'd probably need to be the focus of an expansion.

[Dhrizzle]

There is a fun fact as well. Do you remember that blizzard had a planned Q&A stream a week after the "No fly ever" statement got out that later got canceled and delayed for another week. They blamed it on that it was canceled to make room for another activity e-sport panel or something that was double booked same evening.
There is ACTUAL proof that the real reason this Q&A got canceled and delayed was the no fly backlash forcing Blizzard to do the 180 and just a few days later before the new date of the Q&A, announced that flying will be back.

Lore admitted on twitter after the "there will be flight after all" announcement. https://twitter.com/CM_Lore/status/608683181353631744

That 180 showed that whilst people seem at least content with no-flying for current content they still want to fly eventually. A lot of people branded "anti-flyers" thought that not unlocking flight at least at the end of the expansion would be a mistake even though I prefer content designed around "ground-and-pound" style.

BTW does anyone know what "ground-and-pound" is supposed to signify? I have the feeling it's meant to be derogatory but I've no idea how. It's not like "fly-and-sigh," sky-and-dry" or "soared-and-bored" that make it quite clear if you find content designed around flight less interesting.

[Eurhetemec]

That 180 showed that whilst people seem at least content with no-flying for current content they still want to fly eventually. A lot of people branded "anti-flyers" thought that not unlocking flight at least at the end of the expansion would be a mistake even though I prefer content designed around "ground-and-pound" style.

BTW does anyone know what "ground-and-pound" is supposed to signify? I have the feeling it's meant to be derogatory but I've no idea how. It's not like "fly-and-sigh," sky-and-dry" or "soared-and-bored" that make it quite clear if you find content designed around flight less interesting.

It doesn't really mean anything, but it's derived from the military slang for foot-troopers (i.e. not air-mobile troops, airforce, or sailors), ground-pounders. It's not really derogatory.

[Ordinator]

You cannot fly in the whole open world. You cannot fly in any dungeon, raid, or PvP area. There are 2 starting zones and capital cities which did not get the flying treatment and probably never will. There are plenty of no-flying areas for people who don't like flying and who want to pose with their rare ground mounts, and I am speaking of current content. But for people who love flying, there is 0 options for that in current content in their new, moronic model.

Actually, if you "love" flying, the vast majority of the game has flying enabled. Go have a blast. Now of course what you intend to say is you love flying in current content which can only translate to you love disregarding the game and want to streamline it to objective hopping, making the game a boring checklist with no in-betweens.

And the very few people who cry about not being able to take screenshots from the sky.. You'll get flying eventually. No need to dilute game design so you can take screenshots.

[Connll]

If this is your position, why are you posting to people with that view at all?

An excellent question: I have actually answered that about 2 times, but I will gladly do so again, for the benefit of the newcomers.

What I reasonably expect here is that readers leave this thread better informed, and as such, are better equipped to make their choices towards Legion. for or against.

What I hope is that said information leads readers to realize that it is in their best interest to pressure (a.k.a vote with their wallets) for the Dev team start putting effort in the game again, and reverse "the Wod Doctrine" as *I* call it, of which Flight has become emblematic.

Do you wish to know more?

[Eurhetemec]

An excellent question: I have actually answered that about 2 times, but I will gladly do so again, for the benefit of the newcomers.

What I reasonably expect here is that readers leave this thread better informed, and as such, are better equipped to make their choices towards Legion. for or against.

What I hope is that said information leads readers to realize that it is in their best interest to pressure (a.k.a vote with their wallets) for the Dev team start putting effort in the game again, and reverse "the Wod Doctrine" as *I* call it, of which Flight has become emblematic.

Do you wish to know more?

I suspect I've seen all the arguments for and against, and I've seen rational arguments from both sides, too, though in most cases it's merely opinion superficially dressed up as rationality. That said, if you claim Legion is representative of devs who "aren't putting effort into their game", I honestly am at a loss as to what to tell you. I don't think you get to claim people "aren't being rational" whilst employing a naked counter-factual like that.

What would seem to be more correct to say would be "the devs are taking the game in a direction I dislike" or "the devs aren't putting effort into the style of content I like". But not putting effort into the game? Good lord. By all means vote with your wallet but that's just not even arguable.

[Connll]

What would seem to be more correct to say would be "the devs are taking the game in a direction I dislike" or "the devs aren't putting effort into the style of content I like". But not putting effort into the game? Good lord. By all means vote with your wallet but that's just not even arguable.

IF the WoW devs had (with regards to flight, for example) Changed the way it works, had they expanded it, or, alternatively, had they actually delivered the SAVAGE world they hyped, or an "enhanced game xperience that could only be achieved by no flight", you would be right.

Instead, however, they just removed it. Nothing else. I do think this qualifies as a lazy approach.

[Connll]

Please stop posting.
You clearly showed us that you have no fucking idea what that word means.

No

And please stop lying.

Are you enjoying no flying in Draenor? (Poll Closed)
Yes 67.22% (149,595 votes)
No 32.78% (72,941 votes)

Total Votes: 222,536

What was the WoD design decision that was reversed due to overwhelming player reaction again?

[Connll]

Clearly not flying, since that's almost the same as in WoD.

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And it has the nerve of accusing others of lying.

I wonder what is the reason?

Does it do it on purpose, or it's a matter of intelligence?

Moderation note to everyone: Don't push this any further. Get back on topic.

[MoanaLisa]

What I reasonably expect here is that readers leave this thread better informed, and as such, are better equipped to make their choices towards Legion. for or against.

What I hope is that said information leads readers to realize that it is in their best interest to pressure (a.k.a vote with their wallets) for the Dev team start putting effort in the game again, and reverse "the Wod Doctrine" as *I* call it, of which Flight has become emblematic.

You presume that anyone reading this thread 1) hasn't bought Legion and 2) doesn't understand the situation with flying. That's not impossible but it's unlikely at this point. Thread has been up for 10 months and just a glance at the topic tells you what you need to know. Polemics, nonsense statements, and petty arguments over the definitions of words are hardly going to change anyone's mind. If people want to play the game they'll play it; after all it's not like leveling, dungeons and raids have ever been that much about flying outside of Cataclysm. This battle was lost over a year ago and some have never come down out of the trees. It's probably that flying mounts in the store and the people who had invested in them prior to all of this had as much influence on how this all worked out than anything that the developers had to say. Money talks they say, and that's true. There's not much more to say about this outside of the fact that this is apparently settled. The few of you that have based your purchase decision solely on the issue of flying are certainly within your rights but the game is a lot more than this, flying is going to be available if you simply play the game and for many, the eventual appearance of flight in the Broken Isles is good enough.

For the most part the reaction to anyone who questions the assertions inherent in the thread or even stops by to say they're having a fine time without flying is hostile and extremely unconvincing for that very reason. If there were really excellent strong arguments for having flying in the game right now no one wouldn't be wasting their time parsing word definitions and questioning the intelligence of people who disagree. Accusing anyone who counters your arguments as lying has now become habitual and it walks a very thin line as far as site rules go. When Blizzard changes their plans over the course of a long year, at a time when it was clear they had no idea what to do about the problem they had created, and talks about it that gets called out as lying as well; as if changing conditions can never lead a development process to a different place than where they started. The entire "They're lying" argument in all of its many forms, whether applied to Blizzard spokespeople or users of this forum, isn't helpful. And I think I've seen enough of it especially with respect to when its applied to site users.

As I wrote the other day about 40% of the thread is ten people. Most of those are angry about how it's all worked out. Ten people--most apparently not buying or playing Legion if we are to believe what you say--isn't a lot though and the very simple fact that flying threads over on the Blizzard boards are routinely closed signals in an unmistakable way that the argument is over. I'm satisfied enough with the compromise inherent in the Pathfinder achievement which leaves flying in the game as one of the better rewards for playing. Now that we have an expansion that, at first take, seems to be worth playing, flying drops very far down the list of first-world problems. This won't change anything for you, that's clear. There is a clear distinction between the value of debating points and the actual reality of what is going on. The reality is that this is done. Blizzard has found their solution and the people can either get on-board or wave as the train pulls away. If you're not on-board I have no clue why we should even listen to anything you have to say.

[rebecca191]

"No flying ever again" was reversed in under two weeks. Unfortunately this result wasn't good enough for me (and proven by beta) so I'm not playing til I can get flying in the near future. If I hadn't played beta I probably would have just waited until Legion was free like WoD, from playing beta I realize there are some things I would like to do but not without flying so I'm done until it's on PTR or there's a firm date in the near future. I have less than a week left from a WoW token and after that I will have to find something else to do with my time for a while. I was mostly just farming mounts and tmog stuff lately anyway so not like I was doing much anyway...

And the "hostility" is mostly directed at those who say "I'm having fun with no flying and it's not a big deal to me, so you guys shouldn't have a problem with it either and are just being whiny babies."

For what it's worth I only returned to this topic because I got a beta invite, I think I hadn't posted in maybe a year or so before that....

[SirCowdog]

Are you enjoying no flying in Draenor? (Poll Closed)
Yes 67.22% (149,595 votes)
No 32.78% (72,941 votes)

Total Votes: 222,536

Stop lying.

These polls always crack me up, because they're always taken out of context. You've got data corruption from the fact that people can have multiple votes by having multiple accounts, and you also have a very short-term poll that's being taken on the heels of a 14 month content drought(SoO). Almost ANYTHING new would be well received after that kind of garbage. And not to mention that the poll was taken while most people were still enjoying the leveling content, and hadn't reached the stupid void of grindy content at end-game.

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Actually, if you "love" flying, the vast majority of the game has flying enabled. Go have a blast. Now of course what you intend to say is you love flying in current content which can only translate to you love disregarding the game and want to streamline it to objective hopping, making the game a boring checklist with no in-betweens.

And the very few people who cry about not being able to take screenshots from the sky.. You'll get flying eventually. No need to dilute game design so you can take screenshots.

This post is pretty typical of people who want to detract from the arguments for flying that are actually being made. A focus on pointing out flight in irrelevant, older content, and an emphasis on claiming that people only want flight so they can skip and ignore content(which is absolutely NOT the case).

God....it's so off the mark it almost hurts to correct it. PLEASE actually read what people are asking for instead of making baseless assumptions.

[Connll]

You presume that anyone reading this thread 1) hasn't bought Legion and 2) doesn't understand the situation with flying. That's not impossible but it's unlikely at this point.

And exactly how does that make my hopes and expectations for this trhead any less true/valid?

As I wrote the other day about 40% of the thread is ten people.

Negative.

40% of the POSTS in this thread were made by 10 people.

How many simply got in here, read whatever they decided to, and then left without posting? I would bet on a large number.

If you're not on-board I have no clue why we should even listen to anything you have to say.

Do what Blizzard wants or GTFO, in other words.

No thanks.

Edit: I hope you take a moment or 2 to reflect on the implications of what you ahve said.

[Ordinator]

This post is pretty typical of people who want to detract from the arguments for flying that are actually being made. A focus on pointing out flight in irrelevant, older content, and an emphasis on claiming that people only want flight so they can skip and ignore content(which is absolutely NOT the case).

God....it's so off the mark it almost hurts to correct it. PLEASE actually read what people are asking for instead of making baseless assumptions.

I've been part of the flying conversation longer than most people here. I've found in that time that people who cry about needing flying can only give self centered reasons.

[satimy]

Actually, if you "love" flying, the vast majority of the game has flying enabled. Go have a blast. Now of course what you intend to say is you love flying in current content which can only translate to you love disregarding the game and want to streamline it to objective hopping, making the game a boring checklist with no in-betweens.

And the very few people who cry about not being able to take screenshots from the sky.. You'll get flying eventually. No need to dilute game design so you can take screenshots.

You can also not fly if its enabled for people that enjoy it. If you really enjoy travelling on the ground through horribly designed zones and choppy terrain that do it by all means. However why do you feel entitled to tell others how to play?

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I've been part of the flying conversation longer than most people here. I've found in that time that people who cry about needing flying can only give self centered reasons.

The only argument against flying is self centered

"I enjoy traveling on the ground"

"Flying makes content skippable"

guess what you dont have to USE flying even if its enabled