Worst ret world

[Ave07]

I feel the same as im ilvl 822 and I can barely keep above the tank.

[Cyrops]

@Cyrops Lol what boss fight? I don't see it specified anywhere in the OP.

After I posted that, he told me it was Dargrul. But there was no information in the OP so stop acting like I should have known what fight he was talking about when it's not in the OP.

Edit: Oh, you're the OP. Good. Your OP is terrible. No information on talents, no information on artifact path, no information on what fight it is (until you said it later), no information on rotation. You could be doing something wrong and nobody would know because you didn't give any info aside from your Ilvl. Maybe provide more information if you actually want a worthwhile answer to your question because currently the numbers you posted mean nothing without any information about your setup. Why do I need more info? Because you didn't post sims, you posted your own dps chart without any info on yourself or even the fight in the OP making your chart meaningless until you provide information.

But thanks for posting it now. Can look through everything and see what's going on if anything. For future reference though, that info should be in the OP so people can help you and see if anything is going on that can be fixed, etc.

Edit 2: Okay, his might may have done more of his dps because he was more geared (if he put it on himself) or his might just got more procs than yours. As for crusade; prioritizing it over BoW is a bit weird since you want to have a lot of HoPo ready for crusade to get some stacks fast. I can't see that being a huge difference, but its a dps loss nonetheless.

That said though, we need buffs. That's obvious. Nobody can tell you if it's going to stay this way or not. Blizzard is so unpredictable at this point it's hard to tell what they plan on doing. All we know is balancing is still going on.

BoW over Crusader Strike not Crusade (talented AW)

I just keep being dead last on DPS, one fight holy pala did more DPS than me, I'm just tilted so much I'm actually doing my last artifact for Tank now :/

Boss name is in the screenshot of OP, so...

[Taeldorian]

BoW over Crusader Strike not Crusade (talented AW)

I just keep being dead last on DPS, one fight holy pala did more DPS than me, I'm just tilted so much I'm actually doing my last artifact for Tank now :/

Boss name is in the screenshot of OP, so...

Okay. Here's everything you did wrong:

Going the long artifact route is a dps loss for dungeons, you wanna go the short route for optimal dps in dungeons. Also, it's RNG but your might didn't proc that much during that fight, while the other rets might did. It shows me your talents are Greater Judgement and DP, not sure if it's showing me the correct talent set up you had but if those were your talents that is a huge dps loss over taking Crusade and fires of justice.

Your talents are absolutely horrible for single target. Greater judgement on a ST fight? It's the worst talent on that row even for aoe. You should be taking fires of justice. DP over crusade is awful, giant dps loss. Crusade is really good right now. DP is utter trash.

TLDR:

So, here's what you should have done for optimal dps and here's why you're always last:
1. You went the long artifact route first, rather than short. Short is optimal for dungeon dps.

2. You took greater judgement and DP rather than fires of justice and Crusade. Gigantic dps loss, especially for single target.

3. This is RNG, but you had terrible might procs on that fight. Can't rely on this though. Usually it's around 7% of your dps whereas on that fight it was 3%.

So, it's you doing bad. You're the reason you're last, not the class. We still need buffs though, but you could be doing a lot better.

[Cyrops]

Okay. Here's everything you did wrong:

Going the long artifact route is a dps loss for dungeons, you wanna go the short route for optimal dps in dungeons. Also, it's RNG but your might didn't proc that much during that fight, while the other rets might did. It shows me your talents are Greater Judgement and DP, not sure if it's showing me the correct talent set up you had but if those were your talents that is a huge dps loss over taking Crusade and fires of justice.

Your talents are absolutely horrible for single target. Greater judgement on a ST fight? It's the worst talent on that row even for aoe. You should be taking fires of justice. DP over crusade is awful, giant dps loss. Crusade is really good right now. DP is utter trash.

That explains why you're always last. It's not the class, it's you. Fix all of that, get used to it and see how much you improve.

BUT, we do need buffs. That's for sure. You're doing bad because of your talents, artifact path, and most likely rotation since you had the wrong talents, but overall we need buffs.

I took greater judgement as it was the talent from highest DPS sim
I need DP to survive in dungeons :/

I'll try getting Fires instead and see how it goes

I also need DP for soloing, too bad you can't reset talents for free AFTER the dungeon >.>

- - - Updated - - -

Okay. Here's everything you did wrong:

Going the long artifact route is a dps loss for dungeons, you wanna go the short route for optimal dps in dungeons. Also, it's RNG but your might didn't proc that much during that fight, while the other rets might did. It shows me your talents are Greater Judgement and DP, not sure if it's showing me the correct talent set up you had but if those were your talents that is a huge dps loss over taking Crusade and fires of justice.

Your talents are absolutely horrible for single target. Greater judgement on a ST fight? It's the worst talent on that row even for aoe. You should be taking fires of justice. DP over crusade is awful, giant dps loss. Crusade is really good right now. DP is utter trash.

TLDR:

So, here's what you should have done for optimal dps and here's why you're always last:
1. You went the long artifact route first, rather than short. Short is optimal for dungeon dps.

2. You took greater judgement and DP rather than fires of justice and Crusade. Gigantic dps loss, especially for single target.

3. This is RNG, but you had terrible might procs on that fight. Can't rely on this though. Usually it's around 7% of your dps whereas on that fight it was 3%.

So, it's you doing bad. You're the reason you're last, not the class. We still need buffs though, but you could be doing a lot better.

#3 my Might is always around 3%

[Taeldorian]

I took greater judgement as it was the talent from highest DPS sim
I need DP to survive in dungeons :/

I'll try getting Fires instead and see how it goes

I also need DP for soloing, too bad you can't reset talents for free AFTER the dungeon >.>

Okay but no. Not trying to be rude, but you shouldn't need DP to survive. Dont stand in shit and do mechanics right. If your healer is bad, just be extra careful and maybe use JV every once in a while if needed.

Taking DP and Greater judgement over Fires of justice and Crusade is HUGE. It's a really big dps loss. Stop listening to sims, go look at Solsacra's sims that he posted in the other forum, they're more accurate for rets talents.

Your artifact progression path can't really be fixed now, but going the short route first is a dps gain, going the long route first is a dps loss currently for dungeons.

That's why you're last man. Fix all of that and see how you do. Should be doing a lot better, but make sure you get used to it first. Crusade takes a little getting used to. You also need a weak aura to track fires of justice, it appears as a buff and you might miss it. Also, we still need buffs, but you could be doing way better. Good luck bro!

[Cyrops]

Okay but no. Not trying to be rude, but you shouldn't need DP to survive. Dont stand in shit and do mechanics right. If your healer is bad, just be extra careful and maybe use JV every once in a while if needed.

Taking DP and Greater judgement over Fires of justice and Crusade is HUGE. It's a really big dps loss. Stop listening to sims, go look at Solsacra's sims that he posted in the other forum, they're more accurate for rets talents.

Your artifact progression path can't really be fixed now, but going the short route first is a dps gain, going the long route first is a dps loss currently for dungeons.

That's why you're last man. Fix all of that and see how you do. Should be doing a lot better, but make sure you get used to it first. Crusade takes a little getting used to. You also need a weak aura to track fires of justice, it appears as a buff and you might miss it. Also, we still need buffs, but you could be doing way better. Good luck bro!

Queued for random with fires and crusade.

Last night I had a druid healer ignoring me until we killed first boss, the old "heal please" didn't seem appropriate, though.
Might be just my luck, but there are plenty of bosses that do AOE damage and my healers seem to be having hard time keeping up :/

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Pick Fires of Justice, makes the rotation less annoying. Zeal may end up being MUUUCH better by the time the 3rd content patch comes around(DUe to haste eventually coming to a stop). Crusade with enough stacks when you pop it will make you flow much faster and overall damage increase and with full Wrath of the Ashbringer traits, it will last much longer.


DP is nice but unreliable so maybe your RNG favored you. I don't like the Greater Blessings though. I put it on whoever I can but I tend to forget I even put it on someone in the first place.

[Deleted]

Wouldn't interpret Sols sims lightly and like that.

[Taeldorian]

Queued for random with fires and crusade.

Last night I had a druid healer ignoring me until we killed first boss, the old "heal please" didn't seem appropriate, though.
Might be just my luck, but there are plenty of bosses that do AOE damage and my healers seem to be having hard time keeping up :/

Yeah should be a lot better. Don't think it'll be way better after the first try though, it may take some getting used to. Crusade makes everything flow better when you get stacks and it increases your damage. Fires allows you to get more TVs inside of the judgement window if it procs. Should be fairly easy, just don't forget to pop crusade with 5 HoPo ready.

As for the AOE healing, that Resto Druid may have just been bad. Rdruids are the best 5 man healers atm, so he should've had no issues.

Either way, lemme know how it goes for you. Good luck bud

[Cyrops]

Yeah should be a lot better. Don't think it'll be way better after the first try though, it may take some getting used to. Crusade makes everything flow better when you get stacks and it increases your damage. Fires allows you to get more TVs inside of the judgement window if it procs. Should be fairly easy, just don't forget to pop crusade with 5 HoPo ready.

As for the AOE healing, that Resto Druid may have just been bad. Rdruids are the best 5 man healers atm, so he should've had no issues.

Either way, lemme know how it goes for you. Good luck bud

well, as luck coincide, got the same dungeon as the one I ran in OP, so here is last boss

30k DPS higher than before, but I have 827ilvl with 818 weapon



Dk was 808 wilvl and dh 828

[Grantley]

At ilvl 844 with an 856 ashbringer and 25% haste I find I am competitive on bosses (220k-ish sustained) and pretty handy on trash, though our similarly geared DH slaughters me on aoe. We cleared all 8 mythics easily and I never felt useless. And I'm not that good a player. So yes, it does get better.

You have to remember you have an amazingly useful box of tricks. A DH and a rogue have a bit more dps, but they can't bop, buff, cleanse, freedom or loh, and if they make a mistake (and everyone does) there's no autobubble keeping them fighting. Most of that stuff is off the gcd too.

Also, I guarantee the rest of the group has a pang of envy every time you escape an aoe on your insta-horse!

[Puzzony]

ilvl 845 here, 30% haste 21-21% mastery and crit, ashbringer is 866, long route taken to AtA. At the moment i pull ~250k on single target, my aoe is not that big but significantly better since AtA taken. rogs/DHs still easily outdps me on aoe, but with singletarget i'm in par with them.

[Cyrops]

At ilvl 844 with an 856 ashbringer and 25% haste I find I am competitive on bosses (220k-ish sustained) and pretty handy on trash, though our similarly geared DH slaughters me on aoe. We cleared all 8 mythics easily and I never felt useless. And I'm not that good a player. So yes, it does get better.

220k with those ilvl's sounds not competetive to me :/ the last run I did DH worst was 200k on boss
I suppose DH's are considerably OP right now.

Curently almost lvl 16 Ash, AtA is @ lvl18, gonna hang in there and see how it goes

[Puzzony]

220k with those ilvl's sounds not competetive to me :/ the last run I did DH worst was 200k on boss
I suppose DH's are considerably OP right now.

Curently almost lvl 16 Ash, AtA is @ lvl18, gonna hang in there and see how it goes

AtA makes an unbelievable difference even on singletarget.

[Deleted]

And don't forget for some aoe situations : its 20 mins u in the instance remember to use AW more than 6-7 times :P
On a sidenote : i got the feeling we really shine on lightcleave (2 max 3 ) targets and that gonna be better when both ds traits come in

[Deleted]

I feel the same as im ilvl 822 and I can barely keep above the tank.

Same here. I'm 825 and got the exact same problem.

[Mulderfox]

Does it get better at any point? 820ilvl overall (820 artifact)



Edit: I realised I exagerated my weapon ilvl, it was 810 for that fight

For the record, I am usually significantly higher. Maybe typically top two. You might try playing with your talents. Maybe spec a little more into AoE, or a little more into single tar. I usually sit at around 150-200k for most fights.

[Deleted]

Point is u need to play at around 80% of your ilvl bracket for ret pally to be able to try and compete with players of much lower calibre.

[Deleted]

@Taeldorian
Hm. I think you underestimate Greater Judgement. Especially if you take the short way to Ashes to Ashes with the Divine Storm perk. I can just speak for heroics right now, but if you want do deal with AoE and Trashpacks Gr. Judgement+DP is quite strong. My "overall" damage was lower using Crusade, but, as you said it was stronger on bosses most of the time, but this comes mostly from the wings perk. Before I invested points in this perk, DP and Crusade simmed a 2k DPS difference, which isn't that much considering the higher AoE potential.
I believe it depends on difficulty level, how long mobs are living and how much time you have between bosses to use Wings between them.

[ThunSaren]

Point is u need to play at around 80% of your ilvl bracket for ret pally to be able to try and compete with players of much lower calibre.

Yeah, this has been the case, got 97th perc on prepatch, next on group was 87th perc, yet im only 4th on dmg
However if played correctly i'm fairly sure ret is very strong for dungeons, once you get 3rd relic slot + AtA, your aoe just flies up and singletarget becomes even better, also try using 2piece from T18, the 1min30 crusade @ 15 stacks is ridic, puts me over 300k for the duration <3, it will get fixed eventually im sure tho, its broken af